AIBU in thinking that anyone who had ever actually given birth would never let an 11 year old make the decision to give birth?

[MyHumpsMyLovelyBabyBumps]

And that if an 11 year old can't make the decision to have consensual sex she can't possibly understand the complexities of pregnancy and labor? Especially as doctors have said it could kill her?

If you haven't heard of this it's one of the most upsetting stories I have ever read in a long while.

latino.foxnews.com/latino/health/2013/07/10/chile-president-praises-pregnant-11-year-old-maturity-for-keeping-baby/

But in many countries it is legal to marry at 12

But in many countries it is legal to marry at 12

As is female circumscision, bear baiting, cock fighting, non medically trained practisioners performing "medecine" on people, stoning of adulteresses etc. etc. etc.

Legality is not necessarily a good measure of "best practice and good outcomes".

Early matrimony and reproduction tends to exist in greater numbers where lifespan is short. Lengthened life span and better overall lifetime health is both a consequence and a factor in delayed matrimony and sexual activity.

Ah sorry see what you mean, when I said "we" I mean "we" as in British or British equivilent, not "we" as in global humanity.

Wasn't there a similar case in Ireland a few years ag, where the Church gave money for the child, who had been raped by an uncle, to give birth and drop plans for an abortion?

It might not be the same case, but again in Ireland, a young girl preganant as a result of insectual rape...the gov. took away her right to travel so she couldn't go to Britian for an abortion.

11 is such a difficult age. While she clearly doesn't really have a choice to make, she has stated what she wants to happen. I can't imagine living on a society with forced abortion anymore than I can imagine saying, as a Mother than my child agreed to a sexual relationship with my boyfriend.

However, in this country isn't it at 11 or so that you can decide whether or not you to want to see a NRP. That is also a seriously major decision for anyone to make. So it seems on one hand we feel an 11 year old child is capable of deciding whom they will or will not have in their life, but we don't feel,as a majority, than an 11 year old is truly able to decide what to do about something happening inside her own body.

xylem8. so the 5year old who gave birth... Hey body was ready for it?

Pro Choice has to mean pro choice. Anybody found guilty of sleeping with an 11 year old should be punished with the strictest sentence but you cannot oppose a ban on abortion but enforce abortion on others.

except that for underage dc whose choice is it to make? Is it the dc or the mother (for example the mother who claims her dd agreed to being raped by her stepfather in this instance or perhaps the grandmother)?

It's the choice of the girl. The 'mother' who said there was consent should be jailed for abetting crime and removed from the situation entirely. Te girl should then be given extensive counselling to help her understand the situation she is in.

women believe in "prochoice" because they are adults who can make that choice and it's wrong for the state to say it knows better. however a child is rarely give full autonomy over their own body. I would not even let an 11 year old decide their own bed time or dinner because they don't know what is best for themselves. if your11 year old had treatable cancer would you let them opt out of their medicine?

If only that would happen bit she isn't getting that option.

And as others have said in the UK decisions like this can be made by the courts if a child is judged not to be mature enough to make an informed choice.

I a, totally pro choice and find myself really torn by this, but in this situation the girl involved is not able t make am choice and is simply being used as a political pawn :(

In the UK, as, police and the courts could get involved and if a child wasn't deemed capable then the drs, her parents/guardians and the courts would make a decision that was deemed to be in their best interests.

do you think she has any idea what pregnancy and birth will be like? let alone raising a preterm baby which she's under the impression she'll be allowed to do

I so wish there were actual doctor involved 5 mad things who gave a fuck enough to not let her be violated a second time by birth or section

I doubt she has any idea odmthe realities of pregnancy birth etc, I mean how much did you k ow before you and your first? I knew the basic mechanics of it, but not the reality.

She probably has no idea. But she has to be made to realise. Myhumps, id my 11 year old had cancer and wished to opt out of treatment, I'd talk to him/her and make sure his decision was what he/she really wanted. Would I force them to go through painful/disturbing treatment that they didn't want? No.

she has stated what she wants to happen

I am perplexed as to why people look at the context of this case and leap to the conclusion that we can be wholly reassured that

a) her preferrence jibes with the gov. acting as her spokesperson.

b) the ethics of informed consent and individualised councelling have been observed with the patient's well being being the absolute priority.

c) her capcity to be a catalyst for increased popular support towards the relaxation of abortion laws and the gov's reluctance to consider said relaxation is not a factor in how her views are being presented by 3rd parties nor potentially a factor in how she has been advised by medical and "spirtual" authorites.

cannot oppose a ban on abortion but enforce abortion on others

Which is why a legally sanctioned choice based system is best. Becuase without it there are no controls that intend to weed out cases of forced or coersed abortion.

However in this case what we are looking at is not a risk of enforced abortion, but a context of a national ban on abortion without exceptions and enforced carrying to term and birth. Which apparently doesn't ruffle nearly as many feathers nor cause people to cast even a smidgen of doubt the validity of what gov. spokespeople are presenting as her fully informed choice.

As I understand it children are involved and do participate in any life changing medical proceedures and treamemnts they may need, in terms of informed choice and consent. I see no reason why that shouldn't or isn't extended to termination. However I don't believe the same standard of ethics can be assumed to be in practice in this case.

PD if a child wants to refuse treatment drs can and do go to courttk decide if a child jaa the proper understanding amd capacity to make an I formed choice, I think even if parents support the child's decision the drs and courts can still intervene.

other article
If she could get to Uruguay she would be able to have a legal abortion but I doubt anyone is offering her that option. Seems Chile did allow abortions for medical reasons until 1973 when Pinochet's govt made an absolute ban on abortion. Since paediatricians have said both the girl and her baby are at risk, this would be a case for intervening on medical grounds. If the law permitted this in the past, I could see it being reintroducedl. After all these are not Pinochet's days even if Chile is generally conservative.

From this article it sounds as if a lot of people in Chile feel she should have the option.

Awful situation. Just awful . Poor girl. However I do feel she should be allowed a say in this. It is her body, her baby. Just because she is young doesn't mean she won't be feeling the emotional bond many mothers feel with their unborn child. To force an abortion could cause her life long mental trauma, and she has been through enough already.

just did a search and found out that a 9 year old gave birth in Mexico this year and a 10 year old in Colombia.

To force an abortion could cause her life long mental trauma, and she has been through enough already.

Excpet that isn't going to happen to her.

There is ZERO risk of that.

The risks this child potentially faces are life long mental truama, physcial harm and even death from forced gestation and birth. Becuase her pregancny is known to the authorities and she lives in a country with no access to abortion regardless of the circumstances of the preganancy.

The child at risk of forced abortion is the child with a pregancny unknown to the authorities , where national access is limited to backstreet options where one cannot count on medical ethics flourishing and being all that concerned about issues like consent, informed or any other flavour.

xylem an 11YO is very likely to suffer internal damage as a result not just of delivering the baby but by carrying the baby to full/ nearly full term: damage to her bladder is highly likely.

She won't have been told any of that while she's giving soundbites to the media about how she's "chosen" to keep her baby.

Even if she had been told and was scared shitless she'd not be allowed to abort it. She's doing this because they're "good" Catholics and that's what you do. Women are only as good as their uteri.

just did a search and found out that a 9 year old gave birth in Mexico this year and a 10 year old in Colombia.

The youngest recorded mother was a 5 yr old who gave birth to a 6lb baby