to not understand appeal of Caitlin Moran writing for The Times?

[ARealDame]

She always has at least a couple of articles in The Times on Saturday, including her TV reviews, and seems to be heavily promoted there at the moment.

But I often find her writing cringeworthy e.g. this Saturday TV reviewing The White Queen headlines "She Makes Ingrid Bergman look like Someone Stuck Tits on a Turnip". Last Saturday, reviewing exactly the same programme (did anyone at The Times notice ?) the review headlined Battles, Castles and Tons of Fruity Historical Humping. Is she just being crass/offensive for the sake of it? And I find so much of her writing self-adulating plus impossible to make any sense of, a jumble of thoughtless sentences stuck together ... almost like a teenager on speed.

It seems a shame when The Times on Saturday has some enjoyable journalism e.g. the often brilliant Janice Turner, Matthew Paris, Giles Coran, plus some great review stuff of the Arts.

My heart just sinks when I see her bylines and picture. AIBU ?

Alex James is a farmer in the same way that Pearl Lowe and Danny Goffey are everyday countryfolk

She's brilliant.

Just because she's not a benign pearl clutcher in a nice Hobbs cardie, doesn't mean she's not worthy of The Times.

She's lived a life. One that wasn't privileged and I love her honesty. I think she makes The Times.

And Pearl Lowe is a 'designer'....She sells 'dyed net curtains' apparently and cheap shit clothes for Peacocks. Hell I dye stuff in my washing machine all the time. And accidentally too! Who knows where I'd be in design stratosphere if I actually tried to do it deliberately?

Oooh I must defend Pearl Lowe's Peacocks range (not that they do it anymore, sadly) The tea dresses were cut to proper patterns from old dresses, the zips were in the sides of the frocks instead of down the back, like most cheapola shite dresses and the fabrics were good and heavy.

The Alex James Cheese Thread remains one of my favourite threads ever.

Pearl Lowe is one of those people who looks like they could do with a wash. So is Caitlin Moran.

I was quite surprised to see in Twatter's link that she had a bathroom. I wonder if it gets much use?

I do love Pearl Lowe's styles. Her house looks gawjuss But I think she's probably a bit of a nobber.

CM's bathroom gets LOADS of use.

But for talking to her wankah mates about zany make-up and big vaginas, rather than showering. I reckon.

She should be the Patron Saint of "I'm not middle class" Mumsnet.

I bet she wears Converse and one of those patterned Boden macs.

smoothieooo He chatted me up too!

I suspect quite a few mnetters have a similar boast

Alex James will have chatted up 3/4 of Mumsnet.

Definitely no sisterhood where there's success!

Nasty!

I don't understand this sisterhood nonsense. You don't have to like someone just because of their gender.
I work with a woman who is an utter cunt, a nasty, vindictive, pathological liar. Should I give her a by ball because she is a woman? .

Its irrelevant to me, Caitlin Moran's background (or Giles Coran for that matter) in terms of their writing. Nor what she wears (pearl clutcher in a Hobbs cardie or DMs).

However, when a writer has an anti-establishment "persona" in a paper like The Times, it would be nice if it was coherent, thoughtful or humerous, or even true. A writer always has to be honest, even if people don't like it, even if they get it "wrong" sometimes. Otherwise it just doesn't work IMO. I remember Julie Burchill fulfilled that role pretty well for example.

I would say most good writers do it naturally to some degree, because they are thinkers. E.g. Giles Coran writing on the Shard last week was more anti-establishment than anything CM has recently written, including her hard-to-believe boasting about getting drunk at festivals on the cheapest, sick-making spirits she could buy, as a matter of principle.

Anyway, I will give articles I don't like a miss as people suggest, as I usually do. I think why I got esp. annoyed this time, is because I found the screaming headlines about Ingrid Bergman looking like Tits on a Turnip actually totally offensive. I probably should just have written to the Times Editor. And I will next time ... Have enjoyed the discussion though.

Are you Sarah Vine OP? or the Plankton?

'...including her hard-to-believe boasting about getting drunk at festivals on the cheapest, sick-making spirits she could buy, as a matter of principle'

A lot of her stuff is hard-to-believe I find. And the non-stop talk about drinking - I think Oliver Reed probably talked less about booze than she does! It reminds me a bit of being 18 or 19 and thinking that getting arseholed at every opportunity made me really cool, edgy and fun, rather than just pissed and messy and tedious.

YANBU. I still buy The Times despite her. She can barely pen a column without referencing her menstrual cycle/last bout of cystitis/falling down drunk. I imagine the editor finds it all wildly amusing.

I read that she's writing a new sitcom for Channel 4 with her sister. It's based on their experience of growing up in Wolverhampton. I will definitely watch it but have a feeling it may well be the cringiest thing evah!

I read that she's writing a new sitcom for Channel 4 with her sister. It's based on their experience of growing up in Wolverhampton. I will definitely watch it but have a feeling it may well be the cringiest thing evah!

Meh.

CM, IK and that bunch are the least unsisterly crew on the internets.

I just think it's a shame, whether you like her work or not, that posters here resort to bitching about how they think she doesn't use her bathroom because she's wearing DM's.

She grew up in a council house, no money, but pretty much educated herself and she has a great job that she's paid handsomely for.

There's plenty to be bitchy about when you think about how well she's done without the Oxbridge grooming. I suspect that is what bothers the bitches amongst you here. Isn't it about time we celebrated success? Girl's done well. That's the sisterhood I meant, one that should exist but really doesn't.

I love that The Times embraced her as a young kid and that she's still with them. Plenty bought her book too, so there are plenty who love her.

Whichever bitter journo started this thread, get back to your dull, conventional crap. You're the type I skip over.

Ah well.

Her sister was in my year at school, so if it ain't accurate, I'll let you all know

No doubt you will Marmalade

Are you able to confirm that CM's childhood was as described, or did you not know them that well? Lots of aspersions being cast on this thread!

I love her. She was the reason I bought a Times subscription too. I watched that 'in the bathroom' video and quite enjoyed it - yes I would probably find CM quite tiring in real life as she seems like she'd never shut up, but I think she would be kind and funny. Unlike the odious India Knight.

I used to enjoy Zoe Heller's column aaages ago - does anyone remember it? It was in one of the weekend supplements, I think. And what was the name of that other dark-haired woman who used to do a lot of interviews of celebs? Gah! She looked a bit like Sarah Brightman?

I don't think she doesn't wash because she wears DMs. I think that because she looks grubby. I agree, though, it's by-the-by. But it's an observation, which is a journalist's stock in trade.

My objection to her writing and pronouncements is because I find them contrived and overly mannered. Is that more acceptable?

I grew up in a council house too. I was educated at state schools. Neither is a badge of shame or glory.

I agree that most people in professions do not come from privileged backgrounds. I didn't. There should be more of us.

But it doesn't mean I have to praise people I don't rate who didn't go to Oxbridge or share my genital arrangement any more than I have to think Boris Johnson is a genius for quoting memorised lines from fairy stories.

I didn't start this thread but skip away.

Twas difficult to tell, Lottapianos.

Her younger sister came into our school in about the 3rd or 4th year. She was a really nice girl, very cool, a bit like her sister in that she was quite unconventional. But she was nice. She hung around on the peripheries of our group but I didn't know her well.

I don't think they lived in a council house at that time, but that's not to say that they didn't earlier in life. They definitely weren't privileged, though. CM has definitely worked her way up through talent, AFAIK.

No, you don't have to like her. I get that, but there's some mindless nasty claptrap above.

I admire her success and yes, there should be more like her.

I actually find her columns just Caitlin. I didn't like her musical opinions back in the day, but the fact she's still going pleases me. I read her and laugh or wince. Ditto Coren and Melanie Reid makes me punch the air with every success.

It's weekend reading. She's not running the country, she's not causing any harm. She doesn't deserve some of those comments. If you'd seen her in her music journo days you'd have clearly wanted to dip her in bleach if you think she looks grubby now...I only pray you look fookin' magnificent yourself.

Nasty, nasty, nasty world you journo's inhabit!