DH and I both want to study to become a teachers at 42 and 45? Will be 47/51 by the time we've finished! Are we nuts?

[Lionessy]

I have always remembered my old dragon of an English teacher, who I thought hated me, telling me at my last lesson before I left school 'Lionessy, promise me you will go to university to study English, that is your talent'. The only compliment I can ever remember in an abusive and very lonely childhood .

Of course I did'nt. My self esteem has always been very low so I drifted from crap job to crap job, never enjoying them, always feeling like I was punching below my weight. I have spent 9 of the last 11 years of a SAHM (2 years in a short lived job local government role before DC4) prior to that I was a PA in banking in London where I was bored out of my skull!

After considering many new directions to have a last shot of a 'career', I've got it in my head to do an OU degree in English Language and Literature and then do a PCGE so I can use the degree to teach, preferably in a college or even use it to teach abroad.

I have mentioned this to DH and suggested he also does an OU degree in combined Maths and Physics which he always excelled at at school. English is not his mother tongue but I believe he can do it. He can then train to become a teacher as well which he would love (he is currently a lorry driver!). We could have weekends and school holidays free with the DC, the youngest of which is only 2 now and will be in the education system for the next 16 years and we will have another 15-20 years of working years left as well. Over the 4/5 years of training, DH will continue driving lorries and I will look for part time office work when DC4 starts nursery/school.

DH likes the idea but says I'm dreaming. It's not realistic and we are too old. We will also have student loans in excess of £30k. I am an eternal optimist though despite having much shit thrown at me throughout my life and really think this could a an achievement for both of us. AIBU and unrealistic?

Ideally I would love to work in a college or university

Then you would be looking at DTTLS for FE colleges and masters or pHD for uni.

And FE colleges, most of the funding is for 16 - 19 year olds and for basic English language, so entry - Level 2.

Of course there is some teaching of A Level English language and literature but on a FT contract you might have 2 classes a week for that.

Do the English degree, things will change while you are doing it, they always do.

I have been teaching now 7 years. I'm not yet 30 and I'm exhausted. I love teaching and being with the children but there is so much else that goes with it. I work with low ability children and have spent many car journeys home crying - not because of the children (who I love) but because of offhand comments by people who do it understand what it means to teach challenging children.

You can be viewed as outstanding by your school because they understand what you do, then someone external (ofsted I'm talking to you) can come in and tell you you're crap because they don't understand the concept of children who are intellectually 8 years below where they should be but are still in mainstream.

If you have low self esteem, teaching is not the career for you. Mine is pretty low - the children boost it but I have worked hard to get that relationship with them.

Also, you won't have weekends and holidays free. When I started I worked evenings, weekends and holidays. It isn't so much now but all our specs change in September so resources will need to be replanned so I'll be back to working all the hours.

I would go for it- you only get one life so you need to seize opportunities. I do however think that you need to try and get into schools for some work experience to know what you are letting yourself in for- teaching is very different from the way it looks from the outside- the hours are long and it is exhausting.

Hi Lionessy, if you want to teach at university level, I'd have to agree with previous posters and say a PhD is the only way to go. And that would probably be after a Masters.

I'm a final year PhD in languages (I'm 27) and it has been a long, hard slog. Many times I've thought about jacking it in, but there have been great times too. I was extremely lucky to get funding. Many, many people go without and have to find money for their fees / living expenses through PT work or loans. Funding in the humanities right now amounts to about £14,000 a year and then there's conferences and travel to pay for. Plus the market in the humanities especially is extremely competitive and it may be some time after I finish before I find a permanent post.

Teaching in academia also doesn't necessarily leave you with free evenings and weekends. As well as preparing for and delivering your classes, you have the huge pressure to continue with your research and publish, publish, publish. If anything, I'd say it creates a significantly bigger workload than school teaching. Those huge big university holidays are when the academic staff frantically try to get all the research and publishing done that they couldn't find time for during the teaching year.

Sorry to paint a grim picture, but if university teaching is a longterm goal, then you need to really think about the pros and cons. You say that you wouldn't want to do a degree if it wasn't likely to improve your earning power. I know we're not in a situation anymore where a degree is naturally a ticket to a good job (especially in the humanities), but statistics do still show that graduates have higher earning potential than those without degrees. I would say go ahead with the OU degree - you do have the right to realise your potential. And if, after the first year, you feel it's not for you, you don't have to continue.

One thing you could look into after an OU degree is working in adult literacy. A friend of mine does, and though it doesn't pay as well as school/HE teaching, she finds it very rewarding. You could look into teaching English to non-English speakers and do a CELTA course after your degree. Those are designed for people with little/no teaching experience and, unlike many people I know with TEFL qualifications, most of the people I know who have CELTAs work in the UK. It does cost just over a grand, but that's a LOT less than fees for a Masters / PhD. Decisions about what you'll do after the degree are YEARS away in the future, so think about what is right for you here and now, but bear the different options in mind - and good luck!

My DH is a teacher and this year he has worked at least one day of every weekend, every evening, right through Easter and most 1/2 terms and Christmas. He normally manages to take 2 or 3 weeks off in the Summer. I think it varies by school but this kind of workload applies to everyone working in the academies round here. There is a culture of never taking longer than an hour to reply to an email, even at 10pm, and they are observed and threatened regularly with capability procedures. They spend hours filling in tracker spreadsheets and writing data reports. In fact, they rarely have time to mark books which I think is because its all about accountability and the management furthering their careers, rather than trying to benefit the students. Like others have said, talk to some teachers and see if you really want to do it in today's environment. Schools near you might not be like this, but you need to know what they are like and what teachers' lives are like before you make such drastic changes.

^

All that stuff that people have been saying AND the fact that even if you were to be accepted and succeed at degree and PGCE, you'd be ridiculously lucky to find a school wiling to employ an NQT your age. Schools want young, fresh, cheap, easy to manipulate labour. The two middle-aged people on my PGCE course fifteen years ago? The only two never to get a job.

What if you are 35?

Echo most of what others have said above. I cannot understand why anyone would want to spend their days with kids if they don't like being with them! I've just had my last lesson with a group of 31 boys who are all different and wonderful and I am sure, going on to great things. I've enjoyed every minute spent in their company. Teenagers can be articulate and funny, argumentative and challenging. DO NOT go into teaching if you don't want to spend time with kids. (PS this year I have taught 21 different groups - do the maths: its a hell of a lot of kids).

YANBU: in five years time, you'll still be 47/51, but you could be better qualified and doing what you want!

But Berts teaching at school or university isn't what she wants. It is just something she thinks she might be able to do with an English degree.

I feel very slightly narked (and I know it was naivety rather than arrogance) that the op thinks she can waft into a career that some of us have been passionately committed to and have made huge material and emotional sacrifices for, with no guarantee of any reward.

I am probably being petty I know.

maybe the industry needs older people to enter it, teachers on mn always seem to be worn out and have had enough

'I am probably being petty I know.'

No, I'm all for it, but I'd like compulsory updates every couple of years from all the people that fancy teaching.
Just to see if we are all embittered and lazy and unrealistic about the workload. Or just honest.
And how the reality matches up to the image.

I have worked with several people who entered the profession when they were over 40, but none of them had young children. Some are still in teaching 10 years later, some are not.

you need to realistically check out decision.get Some experience,shadow a teacher
yes the t&c are good,and favourable other jobs.but you'll not be skipping out at 330. you'll do evening work for plays,parent evening
but like all working parents,working decrease time you see your kids

if after careful checking you still fancy teaching,good luck

oh dearie,just saw op posted she can't stand youngsters
Christ alive,what level of disconnect do you have op that you'd consider teaching then?
liking youngsters,desire to educate,ability to wok in a hierarchy are big requirements for teaching

Give the OU a go if you will enjoy doing it for the sake of doing it. It's an uncertain world out there and it may or may not be useful in furthering your career.

I don't think the teaching/ accademic route will be practical for you. DH did a p/t PhD over 8 years while working in the same field. We deliberately delayed marriage and children until it was complete. The last two years I barely saw him in the evenings or at weeends- but being a teacher, I was busy too

I can't add much more to the way that teaching is at present. There's been a notable change for the worse in the last 10yrs when I started my PGCE. That was the toughest year of my life- I was exhausted and was working until 1am most nights. Some of that was being young and struggling to adapt to the time management, but a decade on, I'd struggle with that physical resiliance. I know a lot of teachers in their 50s who would leave if it was financially practical. It's not the 5 hours imparting knowledge to young people that's the problem, it's the unnecessary admin and politics.

Thanks Vicar... Thought I was a-goin bonkers!

I don't think that the situation re: lecturing is as dire in physics as it seems to be in humanities. That said, I always assumed that to universities, the undergrads get in the way... Could be wrong...

Yup Scottish.... Or just plain have a vocation!

To add... Surely though, you can go straight to OU degree without any previous qualifications though...

I hate to say this, but whilst I think you'll get through the training with no problems, I think that (like another poster said) that schools want to employ young NQT's with years of hard slog work ahead of them.

It shouldn't be that way; it's horribly ageist, but it is.

I'm really sorry to tell you that, I feel like I'm absolutely shitting on your dreams here

Would you consider perhaps just you going into teaching and perhaps you becoming an English Tutor, to supplement your income and work around your family a bit more?

No-one is quashing the OP's dreams; if you read the follow up post you'll see she says she doesn't like children and would want to teach in a university. It seems she didn't know she'd need a PhD to even have a chance to do this. Honestly, she seems to have thought about the plan for five seconds.

Yes, I need a seat on the grumpy bench - people who say 'Oh, maybe I'll teach' as if anyone can do it (well) and people who say 'Oh, I wouldn't want to teach' as if they could if they just felt like it make my blood boil!

Also, OP has said she only wants to do a degree to enhance earning power, which is completely unconnected to the love of the subject or interest in a potential teaching career.

I'm sorry you had an awful childhood, OP, and I hope this isn't too harsh. Believe me it is as nothing to some of the stuff I've had said to me in my career - by sociopath Head of Department, putting others down to make himself feel better,but mostly by some kids,while others have liked me -and I still love teaching and children. It's a vocation not a meal ticket.

You only get one shot at life. If this is what you want to do, then DO IT!! Good luck. I think it's great.

I have not read the whole thread, I went into teaching in my mid to late thirties and it was one of the best decisions I have made. I have four children and a stepson and hope to have more children. My children are not being failed and in fact see far more of me than they did previously. I am not desperate to get out and know very few teachers who feel that way.

One Ify main motivators to go into teaching was the holidays, I have my holidays free for the children and at least one full day of a weekend.

I am just your average woman and have not needed to draw on superhuman stamina to cope. Just a bit of organisation.

I found getting a job straightforward, my age was not an issue at all, in fact they seemed to like that I had done other things. We have also employed a good range of NQTs of all ages.

Oh that is excellent Arisbottle. I was starting to get a bit worried that I would be too old (35) by the time I graduate.

I did not go into teaching first time round because I believed that it would lead to a life of poverty and exhaustion, I have not found that to be the case at all.

I love my job and I work with people who feel the same.