Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Am I wrong to want the best for my children?

39 replies

Zingy123 · 10/06/2013 06:56

We are Catholic and my DD's go to a Catholic Primary school. We go to church regularly and our faith is important to us.

My DD1 will go to secondary school next year so I need to apply for her this year. We visited the 4 local ones last year and chose the order we will put on the form.

The Catholic school I went to now doesn't have a great reputation. The other Catholic schools are too far away.

The school we like is CofE but they take children from other religions too. My relative is the Head of a Catholic school elsewhere. I was telling them that we preferred the CofE school and they were horified we would consider a non-catholic school.

Their school is getting great results whereas the one here is not.

We may not get a place at the CofE school as places are limited. Our next choice is an academy with great results.

We only get three choices and our third choice is the Catholic school. Am I wrong to want the best school regardless of religion. My children going to a school will not affect my faith.

OP posts:
uniqueatlast · 10/06/2013 06:59

I think it is important that you via the best school for your child regardless of anything else.

2468Motorway · 10/06/2013 07:02

Not wrong, but try to remember how it feels to be a family of a minority faith or no faith who will have the most limited 'choice' .

candyandyoga · 10/06/2013 07:04

What does that mean motorway? People of 'limited' faith don't have more rights than this op, surely that is not what you are saying? If anything, people who take their faith seriously have MORE right to go to a faith school than those who don't!

LindyHemming · 10/06/2013 07:07

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MothershipG · 10/06/2013 07:08

Do you know what Zingy? I want the best for my DC too, but because I am an atheist they don't get a fraction of the choice my RC neighbour's DC do.

So be a good Christian and forgive me if I struggle to find much in the way of sympathy for you because one of your relatives is giving you a bit of grief. Hmm

HollyBerryBush · 10/06/2013 07:09

I never see the hype of Catholic schools - the boys one is dreadful, the mixed one closed it was so bad, the girls one is exemplary. I suppose it depends on area.

Again, a school might be good (or bad, define 'bad') but it might be the appropriate vehicle for your child. Always go with gut instinct.

Just because a school gets 'great results' it doesn't mean your child will. There are many factors which can affect results. Ditto 'bad' results, parents never see the real picture. I'm in a small school with relatively mediocre results. What you don't see is that a large proportion of the children that came to us in Y7 were already written off, predicted F &G's. Usually we can get them up to D & E's with a sprinkling of C's - a massive achievement for them and us - but to the outside world?

2468Motorway · 10/06/2013 07:10

Candy not limited faith limited choice. If you're not catholic or cof e you still want the best for your kids but are unlikely to have so many choices. Most faith schools have a faith requirement.

forevergreek · 10/06/2013 07:11

Yes I would say fine, but also remember as others hae said that someone with no religion only has the academy as a choice really. So you could get that as you want best school and they could end up with catholic one they don't believe in

Pilgit · 10/06/2013 07:13

No you are not wrong at all! I went to catholic schools throughout and my DD will go to my secondary over my dead body due to the quality of the education at the place! The only plus to the place was the pastoral care - this was better than at other schools, but not so much better as to outweigh the quality of education elsewhere. It was also pretty shit at education about catholicism (dad had a rather amusing argument with the head of RE about transubstantiation once) and we had more of an education on that stuff at home. In my opinion, the religion of a school is a secondary consideration to the quality of education.

HollyBerryBush · 10/06/2013 07:17

Pastoral is important - I know schools are fighting for results and pecking order in the league tables - but if you over pressure the children, they just end up stressed out and disaffected, then they under achieve if the pastoral isn't managed appropriately.

O/T just remembered, the next borough along has a fantastic RC Academy which takes in 30% non Catholics. Faith schools have to legally take in a proportion of non believers if they want government funding.

Eastpoint · 10/06/2013 07:18

Don't religious schools have a set percentage of places for children who practise a different faith? Our local CofE High School has a non-CofE element.

I agree with the statements that atheists have less choice.

HollyBerryBush · 10/06/2013 07:23

atheists have less choice.

Could I ask why as it is part of the Education Act that there is an act of collective worship daily - which you may remove your child from. This is in all state schools, although assemblies are usually once/twice a week these days, and I've never heard a prayer said in non-faith school.

RS should be named anything but RS, learning about all major faiths is not indoctrination, it's geography with a bit of history and humanities slung in.

Kleptronic · 10/06/2013 07:25

Atheists do have less choice and there's a campaign.

ninjasquirrel · 10/06/2013 07:26

Not sure about that (faith schools having to take a proportion of non-believers). Five out of the seven closest primaries here are Catholic or C of E. All of them have a long list of admission categories in which non-believers are right at the bottom.

MissMarplesBloomers · 10/06/2013 07:29

Take your DD with you & talk it over.You'll get a "feel" for which one is best for her & if she is happy she will do well.

As said above the religious support & education can continue outside.

kungfupannda · 10/06/2013 07:33

I thought that faith schools only had to take non-faith children in theory, ie if all the places are filled by higher category faith children, no non-faith children will get in.

Is that not right?

I do have issues with the allocation procedure. Particularly since in the schools with no religious links, there's no way for children from non-believing families to be prioritised, even though they're penalised at the other local schools.

TolliverGroat · 10/06/2013 07:34

HollyBerryBush, because a lot of state schools are faith schools and for a lot of those religious practice is the main admissions criterion. We are within easy walking distance of three state primary schools; two of them are oversubscribed and have faith-based admissions criteria. So we don't really have any choice when it comes to state education as only one of our local schools will consider my DC.

HollyBerryBush · 10/06/2013 07:36

I'm sorry - having a very thick moment (a bit spaced out on painkillers) - and I don't want to derail the OPs thread BUT! In the past all schools were run by churches, then the state got involved and education became mandatory. Some church schools survive, by and large they have good reputations and there is a collective like-mind-set who want places at these schools.

Very simplistic view, but if there were a collective like-mind-set for atheist schools, they would be springing up all over.

Looking at that petition, cursory glance only, it seems to me that atheists want the same rights as faith believers to access faith schools, because the perception is a better education? Well if you follow that through and give everyone equal access, then the school ethos will be watered down and it will cease to have the same draw.

Eastpoint · 10/06/2013 07:37

I just checked the admissions policy of our local school & there are 180 places in total. Each year 30 places are given to World Faith/Open. Points are given for attending services regularly etc in the same way CofE applicants would be.

Binkyridesagain · 10/06/2013 07:38

We have 4 schools within easy reach, RC, CofE boys only, State girls only and mixed state. The RC school is very good but very difficult to get in to, taking Catholics from upto 30 miles away, as an atheist you stand no chance. The Cof E is a lot easier, their entry criteria, if you have sons, is less strict. If it wasn't then we would only have a 'choice' if one school, as it is the 3 choices is a joke.

siezethenight · 10/06/2013 07:51

I know nothing about religion and schools but I put my children into a Welsh Lang School - I do not speak Welsh myself. I got tons of stick for it.
I did it because the Welsh Lang School here had stricter behaviour policies. They were getting better results at secondary age. There were better job options for them if they could speak Welsh fluently. People like to have Welsh speakers on the payroll here. The children coming home from the Welsh school always seemed to be better behaved than those exiting the English Lang schools...

All these years on and the stick I took for my decision was laughable. I have kids who speak fluent Welsh and one also French, they had such a happy school life and good results and are very well behaved. I would do it all over again tomorrow.
Step out of your comfort zone if the school is a good one. I know religion is different to language but the basis is the same I suppose. We were seen as really radical for doing what we did, not being a Welsh speaking household. At least you will be able to help with homework still! They even did Maths in Welsh so I was stuffed in trying to help them. We got homework groups sorted and brought kids home for tea with ours so they could help each other.

topbannana · 10/06/2013 09:34

Surely (and forgive me if I am way off the mark here) there is little difference between an atheist attending a CofE school and a Catholic attending a CofE school?
Both are involved in a faith school to which their families do not believe in and the decision can be made to withdraw a child from collective worship should you choose.
I see that an atheist may not be admitted to a faith school because of not meeting admission criteria but surely that is no different to begin out of catchment and therefore not getting in? The same way DS would not be admitted to a RC school as we are practising CofE?
The OP is saying that despite her faith she is willing for her child to be educated within a different system. This is her right and has already been pointed out that between parents and church there should be no huge problem. Her conviction in a good education for her child is overriding her religious belief therefore a wider range of schools are open to her.
YANBU OP.

Kleptronic · 10/06/2013 09:39

The fact is that for my child to go to the best state school in our area we would have to lie about our religion. Why is that ok? The school is state funded and we are citizens of this state. My child should not be disbarred from entry on the basis of religion.

BackforGood · 10/06/2013 09:45

What Euphemia said ^

topbannana · 10/06/2013 09:48

I see klep
I suppose it needs you to be in that situation before you really appreciate what it's like. Personally I would lie if it was that bad Luckily that is not an issue for us in this area.
I guess I have trouble understanding why you would want your DC to be educated at a school with opposing beliefs to you, if your beliefs were that strong. I get that people are annoyed they pay taxes only to have them spent on a school they feel is uninclusive to them but I am of the same opinion as the OP and would compromise my beliefs for a better education.