to think that expensive school trips should be banned

[Nicola10]

Year 8 pupils have, today, left for a school trip to France. Very exciting for them, yes, considering that they will be going to a theme park, as well as educational stuff. But, for the rest of the kids, whose parents could not afford it, including my twins, they have to do normal lessons.

The cost for each child is £400 each!

There are a lot of selfish people on this thread. We are talking about kids. All kids should have the same opportunities at the point of access on state education. All kids. There should be no need to

" draw a line"
" teach them a life lesson"
"Tell that life isn't fair"

Those are just some of the choice remarks I have seen o. This thread. Seriously, shame on you. What a selfish point of view to have.

You just have to pick and choose- it isn't as if everyone will be going to Japan at that price- most won't. Mine had the chance to go to Peru but it was too expensive- he did however go to Russia. They have to accept they can't go on every trip that is offered.

I used state education so that I could afford the extras - otherwise I would have tightened my belt and done private and they couldn't have had the holidays and trips.

Life isn't fair and never will be!

I think that's the thing, most children can't go on every trip.
Because they are expensive.
But, from year 7 we were told that in year 9,10 and 11 a lot of subjects offer residential trips. So we knew that the first 2 years would be fairly inexpensive day trips and from year 9, that's when the big money residential trip start.

They had the chance to go to on 5 trips this year. All in excess of £400 each, some were a lot more. Having put money away from year 7 they were able to go to Berlin and to Spain. Dd is going to France in 2 weeks, thankfully DS decided he would rather go to Germany in year 10.

I do think the NY trip is expensive, more than I had anticipated a trip costing.
£250 installments per month is a lot but there's the option to pay weekly or to pay less each month as long as a deposit is paid.
I just don't know how many parents will pay that amount of money for the trip. But I do think that a good percentage will scrimp and save and cut back and make weekly payments.

However, if my DCs do go, they will not be able to go on any other expensive trip that year.
Ds1 Germany trip is paid for. Dd has a history residential that year which is already paid for. But any other trips will be a no. Because I won't be able to afford it.

YA a bit U,but I understand where you come from. I used to feel a bit like you and feel terribly guilty as if I was the only parent in the entire school not to be able to afford the overnight trips anywhere, thing is though, we were never the only ones. DD1 is in year 9 and for the first time she will go to London overnight and quite a lot of her friends will not be going. I think it is part of life to learn you cannot do everything all the time, not easy but I found my Dcs understood it better than I expected when explained.

Those reading this now with babies- start saving now. There will be expensive trips in 14 yrs time.

I never went on any trips as a kid as my parents couldn't afford it. I never even thought about it really. I just accepted it. There are loads of trips on offer at my DD school and we pick and choose the ones she would enjoy. She is going to Rome next Easter. One of the trips was a cheaper activity weekend a few hours drive away. If you can't afford the trips don't send your kids.

Nilbyname, I don't think uts selfish to explain to children that life isn't fair.
I believe life isn't fair. This us bit selfish of me. U believe it to be a fact.
Some people are brighter than other children. Some are faster. Your family may be poor or rich. You might get a good job. Earn millions. You probably won't.
I dont resent you if you've trained for years, earn squillians and drive a Porsche.
I buy my weekly shop according to my means. You, yours.
I teach my kids that they can't have everything they want. I do not see this as me being selfish. I see it as good parenting.

So should families with nice homes move into social housing then so all the DC feel equal nilbyname? I think not.

When my DD was a t state second for two years thre was an activity week offering cheaper weeks that were fun as well s the overseas trips. A couple of mothers complained about the cost. Both had secondary aged children, neither worked, this is London and there is plenty of work even if it's cleaning or ironing. Only the Polish girls seem to do that now.

Ours start in Y2 here, 'only' £99 for one night. I boycotted it and wrote a letter saying it was poor value and put unecessary pressure on less well off families, even though we can afford it ourselves. That is by far the cheapest trip, it escalates quickly as they get older.

The argument about these trips being unfair on children whose parents can't afford it is flawed. For children from low income families, trips offered through the school can be the only opportunity they ever have to leave this country, to experience airports, going on a plane, being in another country.

It's the children from low income families that need to be offered these trips the most.

There will always be some children whose parents can't afford even the reasonably priced trip to somewhere in Europe, but that doesn't mean that absolutely everyone else in that year group will definitely be able to go on foreign trips with their family. Banning these trips would be a negative thing for children from low income families more than it would be for anyone else.

The point about families being able to afford for one child at a time to go, but not the whole family, is very very valid. It's also worth pointing out that it's not always money that will prevent some children from going. Lots of children can't experience these things as a family because they have siblings or grandparents that need a high level of care from their parents and can't be left or taken abroad. Should those children have to miss out too?

All depends on the school, I think

I am not sure if it is possible but surely teachers could get some idea first on what parents could afford

And then they could make sure there was at least one exciting outing all could go to

It is not fair to exclude some all the time. Especially at times when it can split a class apart

I should know,I was the "scholarship girl". Now, I would be happy to pay extra to let others come along with DD. As long as the children didn't know we are doing that. Or make sure her trips are to Cornwall and not Kenya

I know our children, even those born with a silver spoon, need to learn that life is not fair. But especially when past the age of 9-10, when cliques form and some nasty ideas pop up (checking a new girl's trunk for labels, anyone?), I don't think the teachers should promote things that reinforce this

So uniform all the way. No mobiles. No jewelry. No showing off. Charity work to drum home just how lucky they are. And by that I don't mean a 3500 quid expedition to Botswana

There are a lot of selfish people on this thread.

Really? So....my children should miss out on a holiday/educational trip because someone else is complaining they cannot afford it. And I'm the selfish one?

Seriously?

For that stupid "What if we can't afford £2 a week" argument. Ridiculous. Do you really think kids only compare on school trips? Nowadays they have to have the right phones, the right make up, the right shoes....it's endless. Banning school trips for all makes zero practical difference.

And in reality the school only takes a small number of kids on these holiday's anyway. It's not like the entire year would be going except your poor child who is sat alone.

Chances are most kids will be there with a small group lucky enough to go. So the majority argument is also moot.

Wishing to stop others from doing what you cannot is simply the politics of envy.

:O

I've only read page one and literally feel nauseous now so won't continue, what a hideous attitude from so many, life isn't fair, them poor kids (or rather children that happen to have poor parents) shouldn't stop the rich kids (rich parents) from going on a nice jolly.

Take them in the holidays then. If you can't afford to take your whole family then use the summer camps that take them abroad.

Schools should do everything they can to not cause social and money based segregation.

Seriously can't believe what I've just read. Grim.

I don't think they should ban the trips, but last year (yr 8) the school ran a trip to France for £600. Fair enough, but this year they are estimating between 1600 to 1900 to Japan. That's quite a jump.

Last year, my friend and her son went on a tour of Japan for two weeks and travelled around the country. They got a good deal and paid £3000 including spending money. So, why the hell would I pay nearlt two grand to send DS to Japan for 5 night? It takes the piss.

Why can't they offer a trip to somewhere in Europe? I am happy to pay less than £1000, but I freelance and I am painfully aware that there might be lean months. I already put aside money for this, so I am far from feckless.

Sorry for typos.

For those saying that that it's not fair that kids whose parents' can't / won't pay will miss out and that state schools should be all about equality, where do you drawer the line?

Should everyone be carrying the same bag, wearing the same shoes (same trainers for PE), be driven in the same cars, have the same opportunity for after school activities... It's endless. The basic education on offer to all is the same.

And I say this as one who didn't go on any overseas trips at school - as one of three children whose Mum didn't work it wasn't something that my parents could afford. I can't see that it held me back in any way.

Op...you are not a bad parent.
I am really sorry you feel that way.
It's a tough one, this.
My year 5 ds1 just went on a 4 day residential and by the time we got all the kit too it cost us £300 which, frankly, was a stretch for us.
You could pay over some months though which made it better.
He moves up to middle school in sept and the prices for their trips are eye watering! £800 for a ski trip?
That is more than we spend on our annual family holiday!
In state schools I beleive that trips should be heavily subsidised, to ensure that most, if not all kids get the opportunity to go.
Some of the views on this thread are :(

I agree

The kids that can afford it can go with their parents in the holidays

total bollocks to say they will "miss out"

Unlucky, the point is that it's not the poor kids v the rich kids. You don't have to be anywhere close to being rich to be able to afford one big trip for two children once each throughout their entire secondary school years.

The majority of us aren't rich, but can stretch to school trips. I really don't understand the mentality that thinks the many should miss out on enriching experiences because of the few, when the alternative for the few really isn't any more than a little disappointment.

We should be teaching children that life is a grey mush of mediocrity where there are no winners/losers, have/have nots

The point is:

We pretend we live in a meritocracy.

We pretend that if you work hard etc you can do as well as the silver spooner with all the connections and advantages that money can buy.

If we are going to maintain this pretence then when 30 kids go into a state institution that is supposed to encourage this, the rules should be the same for all.

Rich kids can go with their families. The school experience should be the same for all.

And MAYBE it might make the richer kids a bit more empathetic caring and good citizens to act in the interests of all rather than the selfish few.

So we want to teach children that life is a rat race, winner take all and fuck the losers?

What a lovely ideal for our education system.

No wonder the planet is fucked.