to think that expensive school trips should be banned

[Nicola10]

Year 8 pupils have, today, left for a school trip to France. Very exciting for them, yes, considering that they will be going to a theme park, as well as educational stuff. But, for the rest of the kids, whose parents could not afford it, including my twins, they have to do normal lessons.

The cost for each child is £400 each!

It's about the cost of the trips though. Most people can stretch to trips under £1000, but when it goes higher what's the point?

Maybe I would like to spend my money so we can all go somewhere together?

Anyway, DS says that they have to do worksheets still when they go away with school, so he would rather just go on holiday instead.

YADNBU,OP. In an ideal world, of course, children would have access to the same opportunities, regardless of background. In a small, more controllable world, such as a school, they should.

If a parent can afford to pay £500-£1k for a school trip then they can afford totake their child on an inspiring, educational holiday if the school doesn't provide the opportunity. Anywhere you go in the world, there are ways you can have a trip that's both relaxing and informative.

But then paucity of trips on offer is another reason the parents of those 'rich kids' run down/don't use the state system, Hully, which I think is even more divisive!

state schools have 93% of the population. I don't think we need worry about the 7% skiing elsewhere.

Although I would of course abolish private education, introduce a proper national curriculum, separate church and state, and provide opportunities for all children.

"grey mush of mediocrity"

Well yes obviously children who cannot afford to go skiing are 'mediocre'

FFS

I've been thinking about this, anyway, and I've realised we're luckier than we thought in that we had no expensive trips before year 6, and every trip they've been offered has been suggested well in advance with lots of space between payments - and I've also not realised that anyone is aware of children who never go on anything: my kids haven't mentioned that, but perhaps they haven't noticed, or perhaps there aren't any.

Anyway - I have always thought that the amount of different trips on offer is a good thing, and offers children more range and diversity and opportunity than their parents can neccessarily arrange. I also think it's very different going away with friends on a very scheduled trip organised by people who know what they're doing, rather than with your family.

I have also always thought that the sheer amount of trips means that nobody expects to go on everything, and in fact the one child dd knows who did Cape Town and Kenya was so unusual as to be commented on!

But in the younger years (y5-8 maybe?), yes, if there is one 'big' trip that the majority go on, it ought to be accessibly priced and there ought to be help with paying. And it does sound as though some schools are expecting far too much.

If state schools are going to be grey, joyless places with no extras then I would scrimp every penny and send them private and at least they could do without the extras in a private school.
It is also choice- if someone is saying they shouldn't have it because they can't afford it I would like to see what sort of gadgets their DC had, what sort of clothes, what sort of pram etc etc etc because I saved a fortune by doing without or second hand because I chose to use it later. I don't like to be then told I can't spend it on trips. I know that some families don't have the gadgets, new baby equipment either but I don't want to live my life having very little because some people don't have it - where would you draw the line?

It is a lot cheaper to send one DC skiing than take the whole family.

I'd draw the line at the school gates. For just six hours a day, five days a week, seven odd months of the year.

The rest of the time, do what the hell you want. Schools should be places of learning to care and share and make a nice society to live in.

And it certainly isn't re skiing.

My kids' school had a ski trip for £1200.

Our family of four can go skiing for £1000.

It depends where Hully and the cost of the lift pass.

It's still obvious despite the arguments to stop these trips. As I said at stupid o clock this morning, either ask the school for funding or do some fundraising.

It is utter rubbish that it is only for the rich kids or that the rich kids can go with their family in the hols.

My sister would NEVER have experienced Madagascar without her school trip. And it was at lead £2500 14 years ago. A hell of a lot for my mother and step father.

But they did boot sales, sponsored events, and got the money together - in fact the school insisted that 50% had to be from fundraising.

So rather than moaning it isn't fair and it should be banned, why not think of a solution like her school did.

Oh, and I still think a hell of a lot of people say they are poor but still have the new car, sky TV etc. it's about prioritising.

DS went skiing in Canada- not something we could do as a family of 5.

And very nice too exotic, but not appropriate in a state school if there isn't the same opportunity for all.

It is a lot cheaper to send one DC skiing than take the whole family.

Possibly but, if it is £1200 for a 5 days ski trip for 1DC and £3000 for my family of 6 to go for a full week I will choose to be patient until I can afford the £3000.

Well yes obviously children who cannot afford to go skiing are 'mediocre'

No, mediocrity is when the eliminate the two extremes. Take away the rich and you eliminate the poor. All that's left is mediocrity.

School means many things for many people. Personally I think kids are exposed to extremes with every thing they do at school. Every class will have the top, middle and lower achievers. Kids have to deal with the have's/have nots constantly. Money is simply another aspect of this.

For most trips in our school, ALL kids go. It's only the very expensive ones that separate those that can pay and those that can't.

if someone is saying they shouldn't have it because they can't afford it I would like to see what sort of gadgets their DC had, what sort of clothes, what sort of pram etc etc etc because I saved a fortune by doing without or second hand because I chose to use it later.

There are plenty of us who can't afford expensive trips because we don't have the money in the first place, not because we blew it on gadgets and expensive prams! You can't "save a fortune" if it's not there to begin with.

Elquota. You can't save it if it is not there. That is true. But you can still look at other means of raising it. Other than loans of course.

YANBU. There should be a cost limit, and an option to go on a cheaper trip.

The UK is fantastic for educational field trips and adventure sports, I really don't see the need to go abroad to visit a theme park or to pay thousands to visit the US.

Language exchanges are good because the child does actually get a chance to learn the language.

I would allow my children to go on a skiing trip with school because that is something that costs a fortune for my family of five during school holidays.

Is that old arguement being trotted out again? Yes, just budget, silly people, and do without the new car, alcohol, fags and plasma TV. Oh, and you could all eat baked beans for 5 years. I mean, it's all about prioritising and a bit of sensible forward planning.

I have to fight the urge to gnaw my own arm off when I read this. Do you not get it? Many people do not have the level of disposable income required to fund ski trips and drama trips to NY, nor do they own plasma TVs, new cars etc. and buying second hand or cheap is just normal life. State schools are supposed to be inclusive, not exclusive. If Irish and Swedish children do without these trips without any lasting damage, then I'm sure the same could be achieved here.

"Take away the rich and you eliminate the poor. All that's left is mediocrity."

That is one of the most ridiculous sentences I have ever read on mumsnet. It doesn't even make sense. What does 'mediocrity' have to do with rich or poor?
As a child I went on school residential trips and walking holidays that everyone could afford. For one school trip I walked coast to coast, 192 miles across England when I was 15, obviously 'mediocre' when compared to staying in a hotel in NYC.

As the trip was educational ie to France where there are going to have to speak the language then the trip isn't frivolous. And so what if they are going to a theme park. It doesn't have to be all work work work.

I think you are being unreasonable ( if my previous posts didn't spell that out). It is funny that those saying that if you don't have the money you can't save it are ignoring the option of raising the money by some form of fundraising.

If you really want your kids to go on a trip you should be able to work something out. My parents never had 2 pennies to rub together, we didn't go on fancy foreign holidays, but we still got to go on the school trips.

Or perhaps some people are not actually that bothered or a jealous!

Although I agree about fundraising, the problem arises when there are several trips abroad each year in High School - who do you fundraise for? And fundraising usually means asking the parents for a similar amount of cash under the guise of fundraising - certainly in my experience of funding school and Scout trips abroad.