to start doing less for unappreciative dd?

[LittleLisa78]

I fully accept that I am overly keen that my daughters have a great childhood because I didn't but recently I feel as though my eldest, who's 5, doesn't appreciate anything I do and am wondering whether I should do less or it's just one of those things - having to accept she won't appreciate it until she's older. Her father and I are separated and he sees her twice a month, I have offered more contact which he doesn't take up even in holidays. He regularly makes promises like trips to zoos, theme Parks, abroad etc which he always breaks. He spends no time with her, fobbing her off with the Ipad while he has friends over etc. He goes abroad at least three times per year but never takes DD. He regularly has weekdays off but has never arranged to collect DD from school or take her to any of the three extra curricular activities she does which I do with baby in tow.
I dedicate my life to my children yet if I ever broke a promise she wouldn't let me live it down. She moans at me for not spending enough time with her yet he spends none with her and she says nothing. Tonight he arrived for midweek contact for the first time in months, having cancelled various times, and he gets treated like a hero. I had some spare money at the end of last month and could really have done with some new clothes but decided to buy Walking With Dinosaurs tickets instead as I know she'll love it but when I told her she treats it like 'i should think so too' whereas if her dad had booked it she'd go on about how kind he is for weeks. He never has contact if she's ill, never helps with things like dance shows - I run around constantly for her and of course I don't expect thanks and it's my job as her mum but WIBU to start doing a bit less if her dad gets away with doing bugger all?

Children explore their boundaries with the people they trust. She trusts that you love her and will be there for her so you get the grumps and the challenging behaviour. She doesn't trust her dad one bit so even when she feels cross with him (eg over the Chinese) she darent express it for fear he'll walk away.

So well done you. Feel proud that despite everything you are raising a little girl who feels secure that her mum is there and loves her. Next step is to gently remind her to be polite, say thank you, be kind to others.

As others have said though, 5 is very little. She has only recently made the cognitive understanding that your memories and experiences are not the same as hers. She is not capable of thinking gratefully in an adult way about the sacrifices you are making for her. That will come.

Yabu I am afraid. This is the way it will constantly be until she is older and wil be able to appreciate you.

Dd is nearly 14 and XH is a fucking saint in her eyes. He doesn't let her down in terms of contact but the pets and holidays have never materialised and he will bang on about being part of school etc and making decisions but never actually step up.

Us on the other hand are the meanies who have to do the boring day to day shit, enforce goods need and behaviour, make sure homework is done and room is tidied. Even taking her and wonderful holidays to Disney and buying her the much wanted dog has never lived up to how great that fecking waste of space is.

Just ride it out for the next 20 years until she becomes a mum and has to make sacrifices and she may just get it but don't expect a 5 year old to understand your hurt and frustration, save that for your x.

She has low expectations of him and high of you.

She is only 5 and while she has realized the above she doesn't actually understand what that means.

One day she will - don't drop to his level, you can't raise him to yours but don't drop to his.

Christ, I didn't properly understand the sacrifices and sheer effort and magnitude of what my parents did even in my 20s or 30s; it wasn't until I had children of my own that I truly appreciated it!

You're expecting too much of her at 5, but one day she will be able to reflect back with adult understanding and see all of this for what it truly is.

Yabu, and your expectations are way too high. Your dd cannot be expected to appreciate what you are doing for her at her age. If you feel all the dance stuff is too much for you (and it would be for me), then scale it back, bit don't blame her. Presumably you made the decision for her to take part in the first place?

I had some spare money at the end of last month and could really have done with some new clothes but decided to buy Walking With Dinosaurs tickets instead as I know she'll love it but when I told her she treats it like 'i should think so too'

You made a decision to go without, to give her a treat. That was your decision, as tge adult. It is reasonable to teach her to say 'thank you for taking me' but not to 'get' the sacrifice you made in terms of new clothes etc. As others have said, I'm only really understanding what my parents truly did for me, and I'm in my thirties.

I think you need some new boundaries. Decide for yourself how much you want to give up both materially and in terms of time for ypur dd, make arrangements to stick to that. Start reinforcing basic manners and ensure dd thanks those who give her things, and do things for her, regardless of who they are, and including you.

You need to stop comparing your dd's relationship with her df with hers with you and just work on the one you can influence.

Thanks for your honest opinions. She's very mature for her age and almost six; it's just frustrating that she seems to have the capacity to appreciate her dad but not me and he can do no wrong. He canceled the previous midweek contact for example because he said his girlfriend had a sickness bug and he was taking her to the doctors. If I'd canceled something I'd planned with DD so I could take DP to the doctors then she'd tell me quite rightly that he's a grown up and can take himself. Yesterday Ihad a meeting which I rushed back from to collect DD from school and take her to her activity. It then turned out ex and his gf were off and had been shopping locally so they could've collected her from school and taken her to activity but no, that was all up to me and ex got praise for managing to have her for a whole hour!
I never voice my frustration to DD but it's hard not to feel it. I sacrificed a fantastic career for her, her dad has the career, money and admiration from DD. It just feels unfair but I know it isn't DD's fault and that retrospect later in life will give her appreciation

I think that some people are putting it in a very cruel way,because it must be very hard for you. The general trend of the answers are correct, she is utterly secure with you so she can take you for granted. You just need to continue the way that you are. She will realise in time - 5yrs is very little and it may take another 10yrs or more for her to realise. She has to work it out for herself, other people telling her,won't work. Don't let his behaviour change yours.

What career did you sacrifice?

At the same time you do need to do some things for yourself- it always worries me a bit when mothers say 'I dedicate my life to my DCs'. I appreciate you have a baby but I would make plans for what to do when they are a bit older.

I am going to buck the trend slightly here, from what I have read it seems as though everyone else thinks that you should continue making selfless sacrifices without a word to your daughter about her own attitude. You say she is old for her age, how does she treat you on a daily basis? Is she rude when you do things for her? If that was my DS (and it has been!) I would - gently at first - start to pull him up, and remind him what efforts in have made on his behalf. I never stop making an effort, but I also think children need to learn to be considerate of other people and see things from other points of view.

The issue here isn't really your DD though, is it? (She sounds bright as a button, BTW, you're clearly doing a fantastic job parenting her.) She isn't unappreciative, she's just very very little still.

It's your twat of an X.

No wonder you feel bitter, I would too. But try to direct that bitterness in the direction it's deserved.

And, as exoticfruits says, make time for you too. You deserve it.

The thing is as well, she is absolutely sure of your love, she can take you for granted because you will love her anyway.

She can't be quite as sure of her dad's can she? He lets her down.

There is probably a touch of desperation in her love and appreciation for him.

You don't have to sacrifice everything for your DD and if you choose to do that, it isn't fair to then put that on her, she didn't choose her dad, you did, she didn't choose to be born, you chose for her.

Tbh things do sound very tough for you and it's really hard when you have a baby in tow. You do sound single handed...does your dp/grandparents ever do this stuff?

You are rightly pissed off about your ex's awful behaviour, well done for not voicing your frustration to your dd.

No of course you can't stop doing stuff for her, unless she does too much (some of her attitude could be because she's tired?}. I think you need some help and some stress relief.

If you feel she's rude (sounds like she moans/tells you off) you need to pull her up on that, but I can't help feeling that she could feel quite shit inside because her dad is letting her down/not interested in her and she's taking it out on you? My dd behaved badly with me when she was struggling at school at a similar age. Raising her self esteem with books I got off Amazon helped.

And also what UnrequitedSkink said, if you think her manners/empathy could also use a polish. You'll know whether they do or not from how she interactions with her younger sibling, at school, at her activities, etc.

I just logged in to say exactly what exoticfruits had just said.

Your first post, about needing more clothes but buying Dinosaur tickets instead, worried me. Everyone's needs in a family are important, and should be met before 'treats' like show tickets are bought.

I completely understand that you want to give your children a great childhood, but an absolutely essential part of that is a mother who can express and meet her own needs. Could you be more explicit with her father about what you would help eg picking his dd up from school?

Also, I haven't got time to be subtle as I've got to go to work, but if at 5 you're saying 'I sacrificed a great career for you' you're creating a situation where she's bound to turn round to you and say 'I never asked you to'.

It does sound as though you need to talk to the ex and scale back your expectations in line with what he is actually going to do, then keep the pressure on for him to meet his regular commitments. There is a lot of 'well he could have done this or that' in your posts that makes it sound as though arrangements are quite informal and you are hoping to rely on good will and thoughtfulness that doesn't exist. Why would he be picking her up from things if he doesn't have to and knows you'll do it?

It sounds as though your expectations of both ex and dd are too high, so you constantly feel let down and obligated. Not that he shouldn't do more of course but you know he's not going to.

I agree that it's not healthy to sacrifice too much for others, especially if it doesn't actually make much difference to them but leaves you feeling embittered. You are allowed some treats and time to yourself and need to to stay sane.

In the nicest possible way, YABVU. Even if she is mature for her age, she is still only 5. I grew up in a similar situation to you - my mum sacrificed everything and my dad was useless. I gave my mum a really hard time. In highsight, probably because I was resentful that my dad was such a twat. I tested her, pushed every boundary for many years. She still stood firm, didn't stop loving me and didn't disappear like my dad did. I'm willing to guess your daughter has some of those feelings, even if she is too young to recognise them. It wasn't until I was an adult that I truly realised all my mum had done for me, even if I thought I knew as a child, I didn't.

Sorry but if she is totally unappreciative I would through a strop. I have done this when I took my kids to Legoland, and they just whinged. At the end of the day I'd had enough, so I stropped about how ungrateful they were. They now consciously try to remember to say thank you, and something nice.

Do remind her constantly to say thank you and please. Do remind her that "money doesn't grow on trees". Don't give her everything she might want, but do listen to her about what is important (sometimes this could be as simple as going to the park one Saturday, or even a pajama day).

Don't try to compete with her Dad. She will know soon if she doesn't already that he isn't there for her, and is all talk no actions. she might be nicer to him, but that is more like an "uncle" than "family".

Children of 5 do struggle to remember others are human beings, and have feelings like themselves.

Completely understand how you feel. DS's dad sees him for one day a weekend, and often lets him down / changes plans at the last minute. DS talks about daddy all. the. time. Drives me mad. I often want to stamp my feet a little and point out that daddy is marvelous for a few hours a week.

I never would, obviously. But it's incredibly draining emotionally.

Other posters are right of course. Your DD doesn't make a big deal of these things because she trusts you not to let her down. You are allowed to feel frustrated about things.

Make sure you have some time to yourself as well, you sound quite stressed.

It must be very hard for you having to deal with all this.

She's 5, ok nearly 6, but still VERY young. She is nowhere near mature enough to understand her relationships with her parents in the way that you want. Everyone else is exactly right - she moans at you because she absolutely takes you for granted. That is, strangely, a very good thing! She feels secure enough with you that she can act like the little kid that she is.

She is not, however, secure in her father. She is desperate for his attention and laps up every crumb he throws at her like a raindrop in a desert. She is undoubtedly terrified that he will stop coming to see her altogether. She will eventually come to see him for what he is but it's too soon to expect that.

That doesn't mean that she gets to treat you like dirt. You should absolutely be teaching her that a)she can't always have what she wants and b)she should be showing gratitude for nice things. It's perectly fine to discipline her if she is being rude to you.

But don't try and compete with her father. All it will do is drag you down to his level and your DD needs you to be better than that. One day, she really will appreciate all of this. Good luck x

I feel quite emotional about this because it touched a chord with my own childhood, although I realise that you are not identical to my mum! If you think there are similarities, please take this as a warning.

Please don't be a martyr mother. My mum would make sacrifices for us, make sure we always had the best, spend all her spare time supporting our interests, even give us help and treats that we didn't really need or ask for - but she wanted tonnes of gratitude and appreciation, and would become upset, scream at us, call us "ungrateful", "spoilt brats", "selfish", if we didn't help her enough and thank her enough. In counselling at the moment I'm starting to realise that it wasn't my fault for being a horrible ungrateful kid - young children aren't designed to understand adult sacrifices, children aren't designed to be constantly grateful, children sometimes need to express anger and grumpiness too. My mum was trying to fill her need for appreciation and self-esteem by doing everything for her children and then wanting constant appreciation; but children don't exist to fulfill their parent's psychological needs, and it's very damaging if they are constantly expected to.

It's fine to teach your daughter politeness, model how to say thank you and praise her when she does so. But please don't expect an understanding of your sacrifices, or an appreciation for them, especially at such a young age. And remember, it's fine to put yourself first sometimes, make sure you are meeting your own needs too. Much better to have a happy mum who's bought some new clothes for herself, than a mum who took you for a treat but then resents you for it and gets angry at you.

Littlelisa it will get better in time and she will show her appreciation. Been there done that and carry the scars but 15yo dd last night asked to change her name to mine when she turns 16 next month. Mine no longer even refer to him as dad.

It does get hurtful at times but its worth it in the long run

5/6 is too young to understand what adults have to do, and not do, for children. I also understand what namechange678 is describing, as my mum was a bit like that, and I still sometimes find it hard to accept help and gifts from people, because I worry about "owing" things to them and whether I've assessed the level of owing correctly.

She will understand better when she is older, and she will also understand that her dad is useless.

You are directing all the bitterness you feel about your ex at your DD. Stop it- she is practically a baby.
You wouldn't want to get away with being a rubbish mum because he is a rubbish dad, would you? Surely you want to be better than him?
It's hard, but everyone is telling you 5-6 is much to young for her to be grateful to you. Be glad she trusts you to be that good mum. She doesn't feel she has to shower you with praise for caring for her. That's normal. You must be getting it right.

I have two dd's who have gone through slightly ungrateful times when aged about 6/7 (no idea why) and although I do pull them up on it (including getting really mad on very odd occasions when they'd had treat after treat and were whingeing), I've found the best way to deal with it is to spend some really nice quality time with the problem child. Just have an afternoon tea together, or a very long bedtime story, where you listen and interact and have fun (or even longer, a day out if you can get anyone to mind the baby). Then, it's much easier to correct them once you are back on good terms and really enjoying each other's company (e.g. 'That sounded a bit rude, please don't say XYZ to me' if they demand things).

There is some boundary-testing going on here, but she is very little and you mustn't 'blame' her for things like your career being sacrificed, that very much was your choice and you could go back if you wanted.