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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to say I'm gay...but I'm not sure where I land with Gay Marriage

36 replies

HoveringKestrel · 27/04/2013 23:17

I was brought up Catholic, and I'm gay now, and althought I wish the best for everyone, I donn't know whether I could do it?

I've been proposed to by a gay man, and I'm gay, and I don't know.

Luckily I know how to kill time but I have a serious dilemma here.

Marriage is a religious sacrament. That is what it is.

And I was broguth up with religion and I know I don't fit in.

So what do I do? I know I love him, I don't see the need to get married, because ultimately I've been brought up to think marriage is in the eyes of God...

I'm not in the eyes of God, why would I get married. Am I being unreasonable?

OP posts:
Original poster
HoveringKestrel · 27/04/2013 23:21

Hopefully someone can shed an opinion

OP posts:
SPsYoniTheOneAndOnly · 27/04/2013 23:23

Its totally up to you.

5madthings · 27/04/2013 23:24

You don't have to have a church/religious ceremony.

A marriage is a vow between two people and you can write your own vows.

I don't believe in god, dp and I have been together for 15yrs and are not married but if we ever did get married it would be a non religious ceremony.

Original poster
HoveringKestrel · 27/04/2013 23:26

So may I ask why would you get married?

would it be for the ceremony and photos....or for the legal rights

Thats what I'm battling with

OP posts:
KurriKurri · 27/04/2013 23:27

Well I think for many people marriage is not a religious sacrament, it is a civil union. Maybe you should put the religious aspect to one side for the moment and concentrate on why a marriage might be the way to go for your relationship (will it make you feel more secure, will there be legal benefits to you both, will you both be happier if you formalise your relationship etc etc.)

Why does your partner want to get married - has he given specific reasons for wanting to take your relationship to this new level?

I mean I don't think anyone can tell another person whether they should or shouldn't get married, - I'd say its probably a gut feeling that feels 'right' for you, or not as the case may be.
But it's a big step for anyone, so if you aren't sure then it's perfectly reasonable to ask for more time, or to say 'not yet'.

SPsYoniTheOneAndOnly · 27/04/2013 23:29

I have no religious beliefs. If I was ever to be married it would be to wear the dress. Id happily just do a dress rehearsal Grin

In all seriousness its up to you. Its not all religious. Just showing your love for one another as well for legal reasons

Wheresmycaffeinedrip · 27/04/2013 23:30

There are ways to have the ceremony without it being all about the religious side.

Marriage should be about two people who love eachother wanting to be together. Not about how it appears in the eyes of a god who may or may not exist.

I know nothing about any religion really but I do think that honouring ones god can surely be done by being a good person and in how you conduct yourself. How you treat other people.

Go with how you feel and with what you want.

WafflyVersatile · 27/04/2013 23:30

Are you catholic now or are you non-religious?

A wedding/marriage is only religious if you want it to be. It's not surprising that you have this view with it being drummed into you from an early age because of the catholic upbringing.

Also plenty of straight people don't 'get' marriage and are happy being committed to their LTR without it. You don't have to get married just because you can.

SanityClause · 27/04/2013 23:32

Well, I get what you're saying about marriage. You have always been taught that it's a Holy Sacrament, and takes place between a man and a woman. It's hard for you to get your head round the idea that it could actually be a legal contract, which simplifies the tax and financial position and between the two people involved.

5madthings · 27/04/2013 23:32

If dp and I were to get married it would be for the legal protection it affords us and our children and also as a celebration if our commitment and the fabulous family we have made :)

JudithOfThePascha · 27/04/2013 23:33

Marriage is indeed a religious sacrament, for many religions - not just Christianity.

But that is not all marriage is. Marriage is a legal matter, too. It can be pagan or humanist. It can be unconnected with any religion and just be about a declaration to the world.

Marriage is different things to different people. You grew up with the Catholic faith but that faith does not have the final say on marriage. A/The Christian God is not the only person who sees a marriage. Marriage can be about showing the world that you and your partner are a permanent couple and showing each other that you are a team forever. On a more mundane level, it is also be a legal contract that may or may not benefit you.

Portofino · 27/04/2013 23:34

I don't do religion. For me, it was the commitment that we were a family unit in a personal and legal way.

JudithOfThePascha · 27/04/2013 23:35

Just to answer your question about ceremony/photos v legalities. Those things are all good, but the main reason DH and I married was because we wanted to show our love and commitment to each other and our future together.

Portofino · 27/04/2013 23:35

It was not about ceremony, dresses or expense in my case.

MrsTerryPratchett · 27/04/2013 23:36

The fact is that it doesn't matter whether you want to get married. Well, it does to you but that isn't the issue with equal marriage. I don't want to para sail. Does that mean that any straight person who wants to para sail shouldn't be allowed? Of course not. It applies to me.

Equal marriage should be the standard as long as one gay couple want to get married.

FreyaSnow · 27/04/2013 23:43

Not everyone who gets married sees it as a sacrament. Not all Christian denominations believe in the sacraments, but they still conduct marriages

I think the point is whether or not you are ever intending to undergo the sacrament of marriage. If you are or might do in the future, then you should wait. If you are not intending to undergo the sacrament of marriage, you should consider entirely separately whether or not you want to get married in a way that does not involve the marriage sacrament. The reasons for getting married in that sense would be - sign of love and commitment to partner, legal rights, rights and security for any children you have.

Original poster
HoveringKestrel · 27/04/2013 23:45

I actually promise I have read all of your responses so far because they mean so much to me.........from the cos we want to to the cos god likes love

I still don't know yet but...what Kurrikurri said was lovely.

I donn't think love is always as simple

And Marriage certainly isn't.

I don't think you should enter it with dreams of photos and a performance.

If my parents are to go by, I wish it never happened.

LOVE you all for answering. Thank You xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

OP posts:
plinkyplonks · 27/04/2013 23:47

HoveringKestrel - my OH was brought up Catholic but he doesn't consider marriage as a purely religious event. We got married in a civil ceremony .. my commitment was to him and him alone in a legal and spiritual sense.

You sure you aren't using this as a reason not to marry this person? Is everything else OK in your relationship?

quoteunquote · 27/04/2013 23:50

Marriage is a religious sacrament. That is what it is

Is it really?

You can make up your own mind you know, you can decide what you think, you are responsible for what you think,

Marriage is a rainbow,
nobody ever sees the same rainbow as anyone else,

What marriage is, is different for every single person, it's the joining of two individuals, to create a unique union.

if you focus your energies on the good that comes out of that, you won't have any left to care a jot what anyone else's opinion is of that union.

and if someone suggests you live your life according to some "factual' information, ask to see all the peer reviews.

pickledginger · 27/04/2013 23:56

To me it's a commitment (hopefully) for life. It shouldn't matter whether you're marrying someone of the same sex or the opposite sex. It's a service, religious or civil, for you to make a promise to that person and for your friends and family to witness that and do what they can to support you as a couple in the future. Everyone should have the chance to do that.

morethanpotatoprints · 28/04/2013 00:06

I see where you are coming from. I have a male friend who is gay and believes that a gay couple shouldn't be able to adopt. I am straight and know a gay couple who did adopt, both male. I used to be against the idea too but have seen it work.

I think in your case the religious belief of gay people not marrying is something you need to live with. There are many other ways of showing commitment and making it legally binding. There are many religious reasons people decide not to get married in a church including having been divorced, illegitimate dc, not religious themselves etc. It depends on your faith and how strong it is as to what choices you make.
Religion and politics are supposed to be the two subjects that you can't argue against in terms of peoples belief.

pickledginger · 28/04/2013 00:08

And I was raised Catholic. All those years of readings convinced me that the Jesus described wouldn't be a bigot. The Jesus of those gospels would look at people's hearts not at whether they'd eaten fish on a Friday. How can love and commitment possibly be a bad thing?

minsmum · 28/04/2013 00:10

I am Catholic and believe that marriage is a sacrament and also believe strongly in gay marriages. Marriage is about two people who love each other and want to make a commitment to each other. That is my deeply held belief and I would support any gay couples right to marry and I think the church is wrong in its attitude towards gay marriage.

Stokes · 28/04/2013 00:12

My husband and I are both straight, were both raised catholic and are both now atheists ( just letting you know where I'm coming from).

For us, marriage is about being each other's family, next of kin etc. It's a way to recognise, legally and socially, that we come first in each other's lives.

Our wedding was about recognising that on front of our closest family and friends - and yes, the party, although that was the last consideration.

If you love your boyfriend and consider him to be your closest relation and ally, then please do consider marrying him - it's a way of recognising that in a variety of ways.

For what it's worth coming from an atheist, the God I used to believe in would enjoy two people committing themselves to each other.

Best of luck, whatever you decide.

TraceyTrickster · 28/04/2013 00:37

You could be my best mate- apart from him being older!

He and his partner have been together as long as me and my husband. His partner wants to be married and i am encouraging them- a lot to do with inheritance/next of kin/pension...so the boring stuff.

But I think his partner wants to feel the commitment. And my DD wants to be their bridesmaid!!!

Really whatever suits you. From my point of view, religion is overrated but once it is lodged under your skin, it is hard to ignore. I think marriage was invented as a form of social control and not a lot to do with the church but hey that's me!