AIBU to expect children to care for parents at some point

[ruthyroo]

Had an interesting discussion with my parents recently.

They were talking about an aged relative - my aunt's MIL - who is 90 and in failing health, and slipping into dementia. She has recently been in hospital, and is not keen to go home. She has asked to go to stay with my aunt and uncle 'until she's back on her feet'. My parents were talking about it as if she was scheming and conniving to somehow get her foot in the door at my Aunt's and sneakily live there forever instead. Since she is 90 and feels very vulnerable I said that surely it was totally natural for her to want to be with people she knows and trusts, and wasn't that what families did for each other.

Their reaction was very much that parents sacrifice themselves for children and help them out, not the other way round. And that if I expected my dc to look after me when I was old, well I'd better not rely on that. I pointed out that DH and I moved back to the UK from Aus, partly because they and my PIL are not getting any younger and that we fully expect to have to help them out more in the future. But they were not to be budged: parents help children out (financially, childcare, lodgings, support etc) - not the other way round.

In my aunt's case there are other factors that would not have made it a great idea for her to take her MIL in - she's not in great health herself, my uncle is in a wheelchair and she doesn't have children nearby to help her out. But my parents applied the same rule to themselves and said that they had no expectation of my sister and I helping them out or - God forbid - offering a place to live if they needed it when they are older.

AIBU and totally niave to expect that children help parents as well as the other way round?

[Kendodd]

The last thing in the world I would want is for my children to make sacrifices like that to look after me, in fact I absolutely would not let it happen. I know you don't see it as a sacrifice though Poppy, maybe that's what makes you happy in life.

[Sirzy]

Hester, don't let it scare you just do what is right for your family. Make sure your mum knows that you are all their to support them even if its just being at the end of the phone.

When (if) your mum thinks it is time she needs more help then you can help her find it be that carers coming into the home or finding a good care home in the area.

[poppypebble]

What if your children wanted to look after you though, Kendodd? What if they were the ones who wouldn't be able to live with themselves if you were put into a care home?

[expatinscotland]

'What if your children wanted to look after you though, Kendodd? What if they were the ones who wouldn't be able to live with themselves if you were put into a care home?'

I wouldn't allow them to. Full stop.

[HesterShaw]

You can't help wishing, once the prognosis is in, that it would be over quickly and no one, least of all the person in question, has to suffer the indignity of it all.

My DH's gran is nearly 100. She is completely unable to do anything. She doesn't know who anyone is. I marvel at the force which keeps making her eyes open each morning.

[poppypebble]

Then I would think that selfish of you expat.

[Sirzy]

How is it selfish to not want others to have to give up their lives for you poppy? I would say that is the least selfish thing you can do.

Hester I agree. Dementia is a horrible illness for the person with it and even more so for their loved ones.

[poppypebble]

It is selfish if that person wants to be the one to care for you?

Does my life not count as a life then? Because I care for my mum rather than having children of my own?

[LadyBeagleEyes]

What expat says.
We don't bring our children into this world as some sort of insurance policy so they look after us in our old age.
And I hope he never has to see me in the state my mum was when she died, I hope I go long before that happens.

[BegoniaBampot]

But Poppy, you could then say that the children are being selfish thinking of their wants before the wants of their parent who might be happier in a home and actually better looked after depending on the circumstances. You look are you mum just now but what if that becomes impossible?

[5eggstremelychocaletymadeggs]

I think that the person needing care should be able to say to their chilkd if they don't want them to do it and their child should respect that!

Equally as an adult I would rather my children got on with their own lives and I would never expect them to care for me. If they could care for me and still have their own life and we were both happy then fine but otherwise no.

[poppypebble]

Obviously some of you are unwilling to accept that it is possible to have a fulfilling life that doesn't involve a partner and children.

I think it is very different when you have been a carer since childhood, and people need to understand that it becomes a part of you that you enjoy.

I've said before that you do what you can do and you can't do any more than that. I'm not sure why some of you seem unable to accept that not all of us see caring for someone as a burden.

[BegoniaBampot]

My mum died of cancer a few years ago. It was all incredibly quick, we had the help of professionals and there were several of us in good health who for a short period of time were able to nurse her at home in her last weeks. We wouldn't have had it any other way and it was what she wanted. The thought of people having to endure that stress mentally and physically for a prolonged period of time (year after year) is just hard to imagine, especially if they are on their own.

[5eggstremelychocaletymadeggs]

I wouldn't want my children to give up their life/jobs etc to care for me. If I did what would they do once I died? Getting a job after years being a carer would be almost impossible.

[LadyBeagleEyes]

I don't think many are saying it's a burden poppy, I think a lot of are saying that it can get to a stage when we can't do enough any more, and it's time to leave it to the professionals who can offer a better quality of life, which sadly, in my mum's final months still wasn't enough.
I think your mum is very lucky to have you, you sound like an amazing and loving daughter.

[expatinscotland]

'Then I would think that selfish of you expat.'

And I would die happy, knowing I had no visited this on my daughter. I have only one left to me. If I had a sound enough mind, and she was going to do this to her life for my sake, I would end my life rather than see her do it. I really would.

[expatinscotland]

'Obviously some of you are unwilling to accept that it is possible to have a fulfilling life that doesn't involve a partner and children.'

Of course it is. I've done it myself. But I would rather die than see my daughter do this for me because, as pointed out, once I died. Well, I've been a carer like that, 24/7. It was only for nearly 8 months, she died fast. I can't tell you how awful it is after they do and the emotions that go with it. I would not willingly visit this on my children, ever.

[poppypebble]

I'm sorry for your loss, expat.

I have a job. I'm fortunate enough to buy in care for when I'm at work and one of my sisters does lunchtime. I have provision in place so that if I am required to give up work, I will be able to do so. I own the house we live in.

I don't doubt that some of you feel strongly that I'm stupid to do this with my life. My point is that what is right for you is not right for me, but I still believe my choice to be a valid one.

I cared for my nan when she was dying from cancer of the vulva, I packed my dad's stumps with honey and gauze to prevent infection, I changed his catheter when the district nurses couldn't come. I was brought up in these circumstances. My earliest memory is going on a train to London to see my dad after he had a heart bypass when they were a rare operation, only performed down there. I can see very well how if it came upon you suddenly it would be too much, but for me this has been my life and it is a life - just one some of you wouldn't choose.

I expect my mum will probably need me for another 15 or 20 years. When she dies I will still have my brother and sister to look out for. I've experienced the people I care for dying, the fact that there are others that need me keeps me going.

I'm off to do bath time now, so I'm not ignoring anyone if I don't reply.

[WynkenBlynkenandNod]

I think we do get that it is possible to have a fulfilling life without partner and children Poppy and it sounds like you and your Mum have a great relationship and are lucky to have each other.

A lot of the time ill health comes at a time children already have their own family. If they are lucky it doesn't happen until their children have grown up but as this thread shows, there's a lot of us juggling raising children and caring for parents without extended family to pitch in. It sucks and I do not want my children to do it for me. If I am lucky and don't get dementia and they really want to then I would look at an annexe with helpers coming in maybe. But if I get dementia then it's a home for me. Though I'm currently thinking I will finish myself off before I get too far gone.

Hester, it is a horrible shock when the diagnosis first happens especially when you read on the net stories of what happens in some families. You can't change the diagnosis but you can get as clued up and prepared as possible. There is support available for your Mum and it's important for her to know that and access it when needed. What's available seems to depend on the areas. Look up Admiral Nurses, Memory Advisory Service, day care etc in your parent's area. Their local branch of the Alzheimer's society will hopefully be able to point you in the right direction. Totally get what you are saying about wanting to it to be over then it hits me what it means. The whole thing sucks big time.

[QuintessentialShallots]

'What if your children wanted to look after you though, Kendodd? What if they were the ones who wouldn't be able to live with themselves if you were put into a care home?'

I would think they had either lost their perspective, or that I had somehow brought them up wrong, to be honest. It is the last thing I would want for my children. I would feel very selfish indeed, that I ruined their lives, if they decided they wanted to care for me rather than have their own lives and fulfill their dreams. I would have failed as a parent, if my child decided they should lock them selves away from the world and and care for me.

And Poppypebble, that is my view on me and my children, and no slight on you and your choices. I dont think anybody are particularly talking about you, but about how they would react.

[exoticfruits]

That is precisely why I have told my children now that they are not to look after me. I would be very annoyed if they 'couldn't live with themselves' and went against my precise wishes. This sort if thread makes me think that I ought to write it down so they can't have any misunderstandings. They are NOT doing it.

[expatinscotland]

'This sort if thread makes me think that I ought to write it down so they can't have any misunderstandings. They are NOT doing it.'

My parents have. They have medical POA on each other, too.

[Laquitar]

poppy i honestly dont want you to feel that we all disagree with you or having a go at you, you sound a nice person, but what i noticed is the bit about your mother telling you that she would commit suicide if she was put into care. I think this is unfair on you.

Also, what expat said about your emotions after the peson goes.

And this from someone who is also a carer right now (but not for ever and i dont see it as 'my purpose in life' because i believe that we have many purposes in life), i do understand how difficult it is.

[apostropheuse]

expatinscotland I completely agree with you, which is why I have told my (adult) children this too. I absolutely do NOT want my children to look after me. I seriously WANT to go into a home when/if the time comes that I am unable to live independently. They can visit me as often as they like, it's not that I don't want to see them or anything like that.

Surely the person who needs care has a right to choose the kind of care they want if possible?