To be upset about what this mum was like with my DD

[housefullofnoisykids]

On Friday night DD (9) went out to tea with a friend and then to a sleepover at the friend's house. 2 other friends were invited so there were 4 children there in total including DD.

When I picked DD up yesterday morning she burst into tears as soon as we got into the car and said that the following had happened:

When they went out for tea DD there were the 4 kids and then 4 adults; the child's mum and dad and 2 friends of the mum. The mum made DD sit at a table with the 3 other adults and the mum sat at the table with the 3 other children. the mum's reasoning was that her DD wanted to sit with her mum. DD was upset as she didn't know the other adults at the table and obviously she felt left out.

They went back to the house for the sleepover. The birthday child and another girl that was there had it in for DD and spent the whole evening being horrible to her; making fun of the present she had given the girl (clothes) and saying it was horrible, making fun of DD's clothes and DD's pyjamas, and just saying mean things all evening. DD tried several times to tell the girls' mum what was going on and each time the girl's mum told her not to tell tales and to go and get on with everyone. She also said that the mum gave the birthday girl a pack of biscuits for them all to share but the birthday girl refused to let DD have any and the mum just said 'It's X's birthday, it's her choice' so DD didn't get any.

Another time the birthday girl went and told her mum DD had been horrible to her,and the mum went steaming into the bedroom and shouted at DD. DD said she hadn't and that it was the birthday girl and the mum said her daughter would never do that and that she is a lovely girl and DD needs to learn to get on with others.

DD then asked her to phone me as she wanted to go home, and DD said she was in tears at this point (DD says it was around 9pm) and the mum refused to phone me and just walked out of the room.

Then first thing in the morning DD says she woke up and all the other 3 were talking about her, saying they hate her now and that they won't speak to her at school. She again tried to tell the mum and the mum told her again to stop telling tales.

The mum didn't say a word to me about it at pick up and said they'd all had a lovely time and been good. DD normally gets on with everyone, has never had any problems at school with other children and is a lovely girl. Not perfect, as no child is, but certainly not deserving of this treatment. The mum has always seemed nice enough when we've met up with the girls and I've known her several years. Her DD is reasonably spoilt and is the centre of her mum's world. I really don't know where to go from here. Obviously any future playdate or party invitations will be declined, as will any invites from the mum for coffee. I feel if I say something it will cause trouble. I'm so upset though, that my DD was so upset staying at someone else's house and the mum wouldn't even phone me so I could collect her.

[EggMcDunnough]

This is it.

Your attitude in the face of her weirdness (and sounds like she had a part in encouraging what happened) has to be one of ''

like, you know her game, you're not getting involved. She is doing it to feel important and reacting will just be joining in the game, albeit as an innocent party. Don't do it.

[hatsybatsy]

this sounds v similar to what happened to me as a child - one mother treated me really badly on and off through primary school. she was just a very toxic individual

as long as you reassure you daughter that it's not true, that she's a lovely person, and that you continue to invite the kids she does like (but probably not that girl), she will be unscathed.

FWIW I wouldn't approach the mother about it in any way. If you move in the same circles, then the agro of seeking an apology for something she doesn't consider to have been wrong is simply not worth the hassle it will cause.

KNow that your daugter was in the right and this woman behaved very badly, and move on.

[lainiekazan]

Slight diversion:

At first I thought the PAYG phone idea a good one, but on thinking about it I don't think it is at all. Imagine being phoned at 3am by your dc!

When ds went on a residential trip at primary school phones were absolutely banned. The teachers said that homesick children could nearly always be comforted. If there was an emergency of course the parents would be called, but it would be bedlam if dcs were calling their parents at all hours of the night. (Actually I don't think any of them wanted to come home at all they were having such a whale of a time!)

[OnwardBound]

I am a bit stunned by the walk away tactic tbh.

So this woman effectively held your DD hostage, by not letting her call home to get her mother to collect her and you are not going to call her on it

I wouldn't ring her to get an apology, I mean if she wants to apologise that's up to her but you can't control her behaviour.

But OPs DD was distressed and ignored and belittled in her distress and her mother doesn't want to have plain clear words with the adult concerned because it might make trouble?

Unless you anticipate having rocks thrown through your windows I really fail to see what trouble can be caused that a grown adult cannot rise above

I really really don't understand this.

[cjel]

I think that your dd has been reassured enough by you to know she wasn't wrong. The fact that the other girls was upset enough for her mum to apologise is also huge support for dd. The way the birthday girl was embarrassed also shows a recognitions of wrong which is healthy. Any confrontation, however 'gently' done will now seem a bit passive aggressive.Poor birthday girl will learn that the way her mother treats people isn't right, 'just saying' anything to the mother will achieve nothing and in fact be a bad example to dd. I also had the thought (has happened with my DCs and DGcs) they sort it out themselves and if you've stirred it up with the mums its more than awkward. How would you feel if in the future they became mates and wanted to get together? ultimately you can support and guide your DCs but can't live their lives for them.

[housefullofnoisykids]

cjel, what a great post! my thoughts exactly.

DD is very confident, and has healthy self esteem and doesn't blame herself for it in any way. Instead she knows it is the girl and her mum that have the problem and not her.

I'm really mindful of the fact that in future they may be friends again (although obviously I would keep a watchful eye and DD won't be going there for any playdates or sleepovers!) as, who knows, the birthday girl could possibly see for herself she has done wrong and apologise to DD. Whilst if I speak to the mum a hornet's nest may be stirred up and it might make things more complicated for DD in the long run.

Onward bound, you may have said the rocks thing in jest, but yes, that is the kind of thing that I do worry about. The mum herself isn't a tough nut but she does have a brother that is, and who steps in to defend her at times. The last thing I want is for my DH to end up with a punch in the face, or for us to end up with a brick through our window. I just don't think the mum would take any confrontation, however nice, very well at all, and would escalate it. If she was the type that would take confrontation well and apologise profusely then I don't think she'd have acted as she did in the first place....

[OnwardBound]

Okay but if this woman is so scary that you imagine physical repercussions if she is crossed in any way, why then would you allow your 9 year old to stay at her house?

And cjel, how can it be passive aggressive to speak plainly and assertively or to ask a straight question about what happened?

Isn't it more passive aggressive to later ignore the person concerned without speaking up about what the actual issue is?

[housefullofnoisykids]

I don't think passive aggressive behaviour is as bad as it seems to be painted here on MN. There is a place for passive aggressive behaviour and sometimes it is the best way to go. Not everyone wants to get into a confrontation.

As it happens, DD has had a good day at school. Birthday girl tried to talk to her several times and DD ignored her and declined birthday girl's request to play with her at lunchtime.

[moonabove]

Just one thought - if your advice to DD is to ignore birthday girl (bg) it might get turned around by bg and her mum that your DD is bullying her. Have you had a chance to talk to the teacher about it yet? Might be best to do that soon to pre-empt any trouble of that sort.

[LandofTute]

The OP is not confronting the woman because she feels it would be in her dd's best interest not to. I think she has handled it well

[EggMcDunnough]

I don't see how any of it is passive aggression. Assertive would be more like it - you either say something or you say nothing, ignore and move on with your lives.
Sometimes it is just not worthwhile to engage with another party.

[JamieandtheMagicTorch]

The thing that worries me is that your DD does not have the choice to walk away from toxic people- the comparison someone made earlier.

At some point she is going to have a confrontation with the Birthday girl, one which other children may be a party to and have opinions about.

So in essence, you are leaving herto deal with it, whilst you don't

[JamieandtheMagicTorch]

I see moonabove makes a similar point

[pigletmania]

I think it's perfectly justifiable that op dd us ignoring the girl, would you talk to someone who is mean and nasty. You can let teacher know of the situation so sh can keep an eye

[KellyElly]

That mother would be in a world of shit with me.

[StanleyLambchop]

So what are you going to say if sleepover mum phones you tonight to ask why your DD ignored her DD all day long? What if tough nut brother takes offence at DNeice being ignored and decides to lob stones at windows anyway? Have you informed the school of what happened?

[BuiltForComfort]

OP fwiw I think you've taken the right route here. Just to add a word of caution though about your DD blanking the horrid birthday girl. I don't think that will harm for day, it sends out a message that her behaviour was noted and is being reacted to. But if it goes on, your DD may end up being seen as the bully or bad guy. I would counsel that she keeps her distance but is civil and coolly friendly. No need to play together but no need to blank outright either. That way your DD gets to keep the moral high ground rather than being seen as the mean girl who ignores / excludes the other girl (not saying she is mean, but people are good at turning these things around ...)

[OnwardBound]

Agree Jamie.

Sorry OP,I know you are trying to do what feels right but I fear you may be leaving your daughter to deal with the unpleasant behaviour of this family.

This family have form for confrontation which leaves you fearful of saying anything to them but your 9 year old daughter still went alone to stay the night at their home.

Now when there may be issues between the girls, based on what happened at this home, and the adult responsible not only failed to act but also exacerbated the situation, you are still loathe to speak up?

[cjel]

I would also try to encourage dd to now do what she feels is right and not to feel that she has to start being horrid to birthday girl, I know its a nightmare but that is life and relationships. Just because bg is horrid doesn't mean that dd has to be as well. My DD has ended up good friends with girls like this because we handled it the right way.If dd could see why bg may behave like this - because of her need to feel loved /important it could help. Not to teach her to accept being treated badly but to enable her to learn why some feel the need to bully.Everyone has off days and even the most loving families have disagreements I'd ask is there any of you who haven't said or done something to DCs or DPs that you later regretted?

[housefullofnoisykids]

I haven't told DD to be horrid to the child. I have, however, advised her to be polite but to keep this girl at arm's length. they are in separate classes anyway, and as I've mentioned DD has a solid group of best friends. Ultimately I have said to DD it is up to her how she is with this girl but she says she doesn't wish to be friends with her anymore. Neither would I. If someone was that unpleasant to me they would be taken straight off my 'friends list' and treated politely but coolly in future.

I think it's important to teach children that they don't have to put up with any old rubbish and they don't have to be treated badly. I think DD will be fine. She's not a bully and she won't bully this girl, but equally she won't forget how this girl - and her mum - have treated her.

[cjel]

Sorry OP I wasn't saying that you were, I was trying to say to other people that the escalating of bad behaviour wasn't a good idea. I think you've handled this exactly as it should have been dealt with . well done.

[housefullofnoisykids]

Thank you cjel :)

[YellowTulips]

I am with you on this OP. We are not talking about sustained bullying here, rather a one off incident. I can't see waging war on the mother would be productive. Better to simply to blank. The best lesson if you want friends is to be nice to them and in reverse you don't have to put up/socialise with people who are nasty. If the mother brings it up I would be honest but I wouldn't start a dialogue with her or the school.

[pigletmania]

I totally agree. Confrontation is not always a good thing and does not always achieve results. My mum used to go in and intervene at every falling out, it used to embarrass me and certainly was detrimental. Your dd should be polite and civil to te girl and that's all, you have nothing more to do with them. Explain the situation to your dd teacher for tem to keep an eye out for any bullying. I would do the same house. Your dd knows you love her and support her you don't have to go in all guns blazing to prove that