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Original poster

To think this can't possibly be normal Sea Cadets procedure?

45 replies

pointythings · 22/03/2013 20:03

DD1's best friend is in the Sea Cadets. She has an event tomorrow and has been told that she and her peers will not be allowed to wear coats or gloves, though the temperature will not rise above freezing. She will have to spend several hours outside without any form of winter gear.

Please tell me that this isn't normal? I mean, we don't expect our troops to run around in sub-zero temperatures without the appropriate kit, why should we expect children and teenagers to do it? And why isn't there a proper winter uniform anyway?

OP posts:
Hulababy · 22/03/2013 20:06

I wouldn't put in past them. My brother did sea carats when younger, I tried it for a while but stopped pretty soon. I remember when he did parades in hot weather and seeing poor young kids fainting due to heat exhaustion.
Wouldn't surprise me if they were same in cold weather too.

Hulababy · 22/03/2013 20:06

Carats!!!! Cadets

Pocketsocks · 22/03/2013 20:16

What type of event is it? If it's drill, it's not surprising, as that is as much about appearance of uniform as it is the drill itself. If it reassures you at all the uniforms are usually very warm, they should be allowed to get changed shortly after and the unit may provide wet weather gear of their own. We all used to enjoy ourselves despite the weather and if our was particularly awful, we could be moved inside or the event postponed but not until last minute.

MammaMedusa · 22/03/2013 20:30

I know two sea cadets who ended up with hypothermia after the river pageant last year - no coats allowed there either.

I don't know if they had thermals on but that might be a possibility for tomorrow?

shrimponastick · 22/03/2013 20:41

When DS was in Beavets, Cubs and Scouts they weren't allowed to wear coats for parades.

They all had jumpers and tankers on underneath their uniforms though.

Original poster
pointythings · 22/03/2013 20:47

I hope she has thermals... Hearing all this, I'm glad that DD1 said no when I asked her if she was interested in joining. An organisation which prizes appearances and uniform over the health of children - not for me. Sad

OP posts:
threebats · 22/03/2013 21:09

Air Cadets have coats issued to them to go on parades if its raining and/or freezing - my youngest did one Thursday, she was issued with a coat to wear over her top half - mind, her feet were like ice blocks after it. She's tip drum - no gloves. Tights only on legs but she gets a coat. Poor Sea Cadets.

Any cadet be it Army, Air force, whatever pointy - its all about discipline and conduct of the cadet and they work to strict rules. Including uniform rules. Its all part of the military training. Yes, even in cadets. And you can't join most until you are over 13 so its not as if they have small kids parading. I do get your point, I truly do as this evening my corporal cadet (just got her stripes!!)Has gone out on an outside training course - its pouring down, windy and freezing - she's gone anyhow. With spare clothes and towels for after when I pick her up and drive her home, she'll be muddy, cold and tired at the end. But its part of the life, part of the cadet life that they join - it does them no harm, my eldest did it and she is 21 now and an officer. Its character building, teaches respect. Confidence, team spirit and yeah, even how to brave the cold sometimes and come out of it knowing you did a good job :)

IloveJudgeJudy · 22/03/2013 22:17

It's a bit like that horseguards who guard at Buckingham Palace (I know they're adults). From tomorrow, even though the forecast is for very cold weather, maybe even snow, they have to wear summer uniform - the short, red coat rather than the long, blue/grey coat. Ridiculous.

PS DS2 is in the air training corps (RAF cadets). Don't know about what he would have to wear for drill. Luckily, when he did drill for Remembrance Day it was a lovely, warm day.

IloveJudgeJudy · 22/03/2013 22:21

Oh, sorry, threebats, I obviously didn't read your post properly. I knew that DS1 has a "crisp packet", but didn't know that he'd be able to wear it on drill. He loves cadets, too, even the getting really muddy at various weekends part.

Well done for your DD becoming a corporal!

Bluelightsandsirens · 22/03/2013 22:25

I was a member of the sea cadets for years and it was years ago now we were never allowed more or less uniform no matter what the weather and I used to pass out in full dress in hot weather Blush

We were also given salt water to drink before topper races and/or HMS sailing as it was supposed to help with sea sickness Shock

Loved the sea cadets though and did some amazing events including going to America and staying on barracks.

SirBoobAlot · 22/03/2013 22:32

That's normal. I was a PO Cadet. Froze on many numerous occasions, and would still be doing so as a staff member if my health wasn't shit!

She won't freeze if she's prepared. If it's full blues, the uniform is thick, if it's 4s, then she will still have her pully plus possible jacket over the top. Vest / long sleeve top under uniform depending on rig, and thermals.

You get used to being ready for these events.

Fallenangle · 22/03/2013 22:39

Her parent could try asking the RNVR officer in charge for sight of the risk assessment.

MsWetherwax · 22/03/2013 22:40

I agree with other posters - the uniform is warmer than it looks, and it really is character building to be part of the cadets. It is normal procedure, or at least it was 25 or so years ago!

DeafLeopard · 22/03/2013 22:44

When DS does drill etc in cold weather, they advise them to wear thermal underwear and thermal socks. We have a thermal vest cut to the shape of his dress uniform shirt, and in their working gear the jumper is thick wool and really warm.

SirBoobAlot · 22/03/2013 22:55

She's hardly doing it in shorts and t-shirt (though have done that, ahh PT memories...). If it's raining and they are in 4s they will be issued jackets. If they're in blues then the jacket is water proof.

You take more pride in your uniform, and the event that you're doing, to worry about being cold anyway. We did a full PT display, in Trafalgar Square, in the pissing rain, white trousers, striped short sleeve t-shirt, trainers... And everyone still put in 110% because that is what you do.

And the staff are not heartless bastards. They will be allowed to rest / warm up / fall out of squad if needed.

LadySybilPussPolham · 22/03/2013 23:20

I was in the ATC and endured many cold/wet/windy drills and expeditions. It was totally worth it for the sheer variety and excitement and I bloody LOVED it all

julieann42 · 22/03/2013 23:25

Sounds normal although we do issue our cadets coats like when we were doing a street collection the other week but if its a parade or drill we don't, it's uniform without gloves and coats but do advise if its cold to
Wear thermals or such like underneath.

TraineeBabyCatcher · 22/03/2013 23:27

Quiet normal.
As a teenager I fainted on parade at a memorial service when we had been stood for an hour, stock still in the minuses, in just our uniform.

olibeansmummy · 23/03/2013 08:55

I was an air cadet and never remember being that cold! The uniforms are very warm, because they are made of thick materials.

Sallyingforth · 23/03/2013 09:38

Just wanted to say how good it is to see that some of our youth are still interested in being smartly presented and disciplined. I admire that and wish I hadn't been so lazy.

freddiefrog · 23/03/2013 09:45

It's quite normal. You just have to layer them up.

My DD is a Sea Scout and the same rules apply to them - we've got the hang of getting as many layers on underneath her uniform as possible.

boxershorts · 23/03/2013 11:21

its just military posturing. A few parent shud remove their kids

DeafLeopard · 23/03/2013 12:26

boxershorts - that would be the children that lose out then

Tinuviel · 23/03/2013 12:43

We have the same with Brownies, Guides, Beavers, Cubs and Scouts at Remembrance Day parade. At our church they aren't outside for long as most of the service is in the church and the last 15 mins outside at the memorial but no coats allowed. Mine would wear thermals and a long sleeved top under their shirt.

The main parade in the town is all outside and the same rules apply. It's not about posturing, it's about looking smart and wearing a uniform. If they had coats on, they wouldn't look 'uniform' (and in some cases not smart either!) If they had a coat as part of the uniform, it would bump the price up to the point that some parents couldn't afford it and their DCs would miss out.

We're quite lucky with Scouts as they only insist on the jumper/shirt and can wear school trousers/shoes with it.

Original poster
pointythings · 23/03/2013 20:48

I'm with boxershorts on this.

I live close to two US Air Force bases. When the weather is like this, irrespective of the date, they wear their cold weather gear.

Saying you have to wear summer uniform because the calendar says it's summer is like saying you can't have the central heating on because we're past the solstice. It's stupid.

You can toughen young people up through discipline, routine, physical activity - those things are all good. Using rigid adherence to appearance - not so good.

I understand looking smart for a parade, but DD's friend was involved in a community activity that involved being outside in this weather for several hours, and not doing the kind of activities that would have helped keep her warm.

And I do think there should be a uniform coat, provided at cost, and probably some form of second hand provision too. If schools with insanely expensive uniforms can do it, why can't the Sea Cadets?

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