to think that people in prison should NOT be allowed nhs funded IVF?

[rodandtheemu]

As the title says.

This is a really interesting topic. In other countries prisoners are allowed conjugal visits and become parents behind bars. In Norway for example, long term prisoners are given access to job training and relationships with loved ones are actively promoted. They have less than half the reconviction rate that we do, which in the UK is around 60% depending on the prisoner and their offence. What is it that we want prison to do with prisoners? Considering the vast majority of prisoners will be released, and this includes murders on life sentences who will be released on licence, surely promoting family ties, responsibility, and stability is one way of reducing the risk of reoffending upon release. The point the ECHR made was that the punishment was removal of liberty, not the removal of the right to procreate.

I think this whole situation has become completely overblown by Grayling and the Daily Mail. Only one prisoner has ever been given permission to artificially inseminate his partner. That is ever, even since before or after the European Court of Human Rights ruling. And yes, women are entitled to apply for AI/IVF too, although none ever have. The numbers are tiny when compared to the prison population which is almost currently 85,000 men women and children in prison.

Really.

Wow that's a very emm strong opinion

I'm not entirely sure its concidered ok in this country to only allow pregnancy for people with suitable genes or those above a certain income.

Rape victims often have pychological or even occassionally physical barriers to having children. Certainly childbirth can be a major trauma for a rape victim. Sometimes child abuse victims struggle with sexual relationships and really need help.

I would rather that tax payer's money helped the victims of crime than pay for frills like criminals having IVF.

"The child of a successful drug dealer or tax evader may well be better provided for than the child of two parents on minimum wage. So your argument about the woman needing to find a partner who can provide is a bag of shit- unless, of course, you were proposing to make an exception for the wives of those prisoners who have managed to keep hold of their ill gotten gains? "

Wives of prisoners who keep ill gotten gains should go to jail as well. If you don't want to go to jail then don't break the f*cking law! Not being able to vote or have sex is losing a freedom and part of the punishment of going to prison. If criminals have long jail sentence then its for a good reason. If a criminal wants a family then they need to behave well in jail so that they are let out early on good behaviour.

I am in favour of people on benefits having IVF. Lots of people on benefits are honest people who have fallen on hard times/ been unlucky in life. Plenty of people on benefits do an excellent job of parenting. Being a good parent requires responsible behaviour and prison inmates need to prove to the world they are responsible enough to be let out.

"Regardless of whether you think wives of partners who keep ill gotten gains should go to prison, lots don't."

The law doesn't think that wives should keep the proceeds of crime. Plenty of people break the law and don't get caught. It doesn't make it right.

Prisoners do not deserve anything more than the basics necessary for every day life. Ie. being feed, sheltered, kept safe, basic health care and access to education and training. If you choose to commit crimes then you forfeit your right to vote or have sex. Prison is a punishment

Save your sympathy for the victims of crime.

They shouldn't be entitled to it. When they committed a crime and are serving their punishment then they have forfeited their rights.

I think it's totally appalling that anyone in prison could be entitled to IVF. With regards to their innocent partners, I have no sympathy! If you CHOOSE to carry on a relationship with someone that commits a crime then you ACCEPT the consequences of that choice, regardless of any unforeseen circumstances such as illness. No one in jail (regardless of crime/conviction/sentence period) should get IVF on the NHS. I think it's disgusting that this would even be considered by any government as an option.

My brother and his wife tried for 11 years to conceive. They got little help via the NHS despite working hard all their lives and never claiming a penny off the system. Even when my brother was made redundant and had to find a new position. They personally funded their treatment, which I can assure you was not cheap. Paying for criminals and their families to have access to IVF on the NHS is wrong when there are more worthy law abiding people that should get the funding instead. If you are in prison you should lose all privileges, nothing on the NHS (unless urgent), no money, nothing!! And if you choose to stay in a relationship with a criminal, well then you get nothing too. I do not want to pay for criminals other than locking them up!

Chunderella, having a a prisoner or a woman undergoing chemo is a rare cirucumstance. It is perfectly reasonable to freeze his spem to enable him to have children in the future. That is not the same as IVF.

In fact it would make more sense to freeze the ova of a woman who is about to undergo chemo rather than fertilise the ova. She might want to have babies with a different man in the future when she realises that her ex is a complete tosser for landing himself in jail.

There is a world of difference between freezing sperm or ova and actually making a baby. It makes sense to collect and freeze the sperm of a young man who has cancer prior to treatment whether he wants children or not. A young man in his twenties with cancer may want children in the future.

I agree.. people in the prison system should NOT be allowed acsess to IVF. Prison is a punishment. End of.

I apologize for resurrecting this old post. I found this thread after a Google search... because I am pregnant, and the father has recently been incarcerated for I do not know how long yet...
I have my heart set on this baby who I love though he isn't even here yet, and I love the father and he loves me. But unfortunately I am afraid of complications with my pregnancy and I am terrified that I may lose my baby... and having just lost the man I want with all of my heart to be the father of my children... the love of my life, losing our baby is my biggest fear.
Yes he isn't perfect, yes he made mistakes, but he is a good man nonetheless, kind, sweet and considerate, loyal, smart, funny, hard working, the kind of man who took care of his lady and nursed her back to health from the same illness that has now come back to threaten our pregnancy.
Before him I had never met a man that I would even consider having a child with, or thought would be a suitable father.
Now to think that I may lose our baby to be, I think it might kill me. With him gone... I plan to stay with him, and support him in his time of need like he has always been there for me... there is no chance for us to try again.
We both have our hearts set on the one good thing in our lives... and to lose our little life we created would be devestating. But it might happen... and that is it? My hope of having a family, a child is gone. I love this man and I don't want to just have anybody's child, and if our unborn child is lost, that is it. End of story.
Which is why I was wondering if inmates are allowed to give sperm so that their partner may be artificially inseminated. Because for me, it's our baby or no baby.
I am still hoping that I do not lose this baby though... conceived in a happier time with the man I love.