To be ridiculously upset about dd not being able to take her place at private school

[eminemmerdale]

DD(7) is super bright - I am not being a pfb mother, she is number 3 with two older siblings but she is stupidly clever. Because of this, we, on advice, put her in for an entrance exam for our super selective local prep school. It started off last summer when we went to the first open day, then did the interview with the head, taster day, pre-test and finally the entrance test. She was awarded a place - we were told she had done 'exceptionally well' and got one of not that many places. We had, from the start, said we would need a significant bursary, and applied - we fulfill all the criteria and were pretty much led to believe that we would get a good enough one. However, although we got what would probably be thought of as a lot of money off, we just couldn't match it (unless we stopped paying utility bills and eating!) I asked if it could be negotiated and they did do their best but clearly the funds weren't there - cue lovely e mails and calls from the head and deputy head, regetting that we couldn't take the place :( Her primary is one of the best in the city and I know that a few other children from her year have been offered places, which is great. However, I now find out that one of them has been offered and accepted a bursary, but the parents are laughing their heads off because the grandparents had offered to pay full fees but the parents kept that quiet! How is it fair that the money they are taking means that my dd can't take the place? If they had been honest and said grandparents would pay then dd could possibly go - how many more are doing this? I could (in fact, have) cry. It is fucking horrible.

Maybe it's because we both came from poor backgrounds that although we didn't meet until almost 30, I had bought my first property at 18 and my OH at 19. Basically the only way to get a room to yourself in a large family is to move out. Didn't have children until I was mid 30s and OH knocking on 40. neither of us is in really well paid jobs either but we are virtually mortgage free so could easily mortgage the house and pay school fees but for many reasons we wont. Boys are both very bright and could, I am sure, get bursaries/scholarships if we chose too.

Private education is definitely not everything and the values you instil in you children in the home are worth so much more I think. You've already said her current school is good - you don't need the private school any more than you think the other family need the bursary.

I don't know if you're being unreasonable (maybe you are), but I'd also be ridiculously upset in your position (maybe I'm unreasonable too!)

I suppose you can either spend a gazillion hours trawling around on the internet, trying to find funding sources (which is what I'd do), or you just have to think that it wasn't meant to be, and that your DD will benefit in other ways from her current primary school. Not easy, though.

Did you or your dh go to private school?

Sorry I didn't mean it to come across as trying to tell you how you should have lived your life, but you pays your money, you takes your choice.

The benefit he got from his time travelling is a view of the world that not many people have a chance to get. Passing some of that onto his children is definitely worth as much as a school that you don't even know that your child would be happy in.

You are in no different a position from me, and thousands of other people - you can't afford private schooling.

The only difference is that you chose to proceed for a while as though you could, so it feels for you like a 'near miss'. You probably shouldn't have put yourselves and your daughter in that position.

I knew it was never a realistic option for mine, so I never looked any further into it, but instead concentrated my energies on making sure I chose the best state options available and gave mine good extracurricular activities and travel with the money we'd saved.

My eldest is at med school, and 2nd has an Oxford offer for October this year, so I guess we didn't do too badly.

We have thought of ways to increase our income - including selling the house (but the equity is negligible and the area is ridiculously expensive!) working even more hours etc, and maybe that may be possible over the next few years - for me certainly, I could probably get a job that paid more but dh is in such a specialised area and is not too far off retiring (theoretically anyway, practically he will be working for a long time!) We are going to look at putting a tiny bit away some months when it's possible for her to perhaps have a chance at 11.
My gripe about all of this though is, as people have said, the expectations we were given; and the apparent way others can still hide their means. If independant schools really want to live up to their promises they should be more transparent from the beginning. I wish we'd not started the journey now.

But they haven't hidden their means, the grand parents income is irrelevant- they may have many grand children for example so I wouldn't expect the school to take this in to consideration.

If your dd passed scholarship exams is there no possibility of the bursary being topped up with a scholarship award? I would be pretty cross if I had made it clear to the school that I would be unable to accept a place unless my dc was awarded a X% bursary. I assume you worked out the percentage based on the guidelines of the school? Some schools are open about bursary levels. If you fitted the bursary level and weren't seeking more than the likely award then YANBU to be upset.

there was a section on the bursary form which asked for other ways in which we may be able to pay fees (including grandparents, trusts etc) I remember saying to DH that a lot of grandparents do help out - we know people in such a position - not that they should of course, but if you know that your parents have made provision and expect to be paying, than say so!

I have to say as the youngest child of 7 in my family, I don't think it's fair to compromise the opportunities of your other children (e.g. nice place to live/holidays etc) to spend the money on one child where it is isn't a life or death situation. Your daughter could do well or not in either school, you don't know what the future is. She may not even thank you or be grateful for the sacrifices or make the most of the opportunity.

Personally, I'd forget it and move on and make the most of you family. My OH came to education late in life and has 2 degrees and has done various jobs in his life - including being a SAHD for a while. He now chooses to do a fairly low paid manual job as it is something he enjoys. Your daughter could have a a brilliant academic education and then realise she enjoys working in a job where she uses none of it

See? the private school system is awful!

Have you already declined ? If not go back to them and tell them unfortunately you would need further financial support and ask them to let you know if they are in a position to offer more funding (you may not be alone in this position after all) be that now or in the future. If they really want your dd they may be able to do so.

As to the other family presumably if gp's fund or part fund the that would be money the family may not benefit from later on. Try not to bear a grudge. A local prep school recently had to clarify its expectations of bursary funding so that new cars, second homes, exotic holidays etc would not be the norm for its recipients.

I think you need to stop feeling like the other couple have hidden THEIR means. he means weren't theirs they were from their grandparents. Them taking a place makes no difference to whether or not you could afford it!! You can't afford it they can - even if they didn't get bursary their child would be able to go due to grandparents, however tHey got bursary so they don't have to rely on that. I would like a bigger house but can't afford it, myncousinsngreat aunt has justbdiedmand left her a shed load of money so now she is going to buy a big house -'life is not fair. We choose how to spend our money and some of us have other family members to rely on. TBH why did you even look at a private education if you couldn't afford it??? As I take it you went to them not the other way round!! And if I was working 2 jobs to pay for my child to go to that private school and your child came in with a full scholorship I would be annoyed!

lonnika scholarships have nothing to do with income. They are awarded on merit alone.

Bursary then sorry not scholorship :)

This other couple do sound awful, but IMO it would be very difficult for private schools to take grandparents' means into account, because that money is not at the discretion of the parents applying to the school for their DC, and the grandparents could, at any time, change their minds or be unable to pay (eg due to the need to pay for long-term care).

Agree with everyone about the school unfairly raising expectations. They are not required to be at all transparent about how they award bursaries (or much else, e.g. number of applicants for places - making it difficult to establish how selective schools actually are and how much is hype - how many bursaries are given out to what value etc). But if they are a charity, their annual accounts should show how much in total they pay out on bursaries and such each year: you can compare this with annual fees and make a guess at how many DC it might pay for.

Have done this for a couple of schools near me, it revealed that they don't actually give out much £££. Some probably goes to DC whose parents have paid fees but run into trouble.

On the "bright child will do well anywhere" argument, have never been convinced. I was a bright child at a comprehensive and got straight As, Russel Group uni entry etc, but think I could've done even more/had more subject and career options/a better experience at a different school. For example, the school was crap for science (dire teaching) and many with talent underperformed, or chose other subjects or paid for tuition.

When looking at secondaries for a bright child I'd be trying to get info on grades / numbers of students by subject for GCSE and A-level, and leaver destinations, to see if there is a reasonably-sized cohort of high-achieving DC. There was a list published recently of schools where no students got entry into the top universities: there must've been promising, bright students at those schools.

LIZS yes we've done all that. You're right amck, it was a risk we took and we need to move on from it. lonnika - the reason we went for it was because the school stated that 100% bursaries were available and it was suggested to us that we should try to get her a place.

Although it sounds OP as though you have good state schools for your DD, which although not your preferred option is a good position to be in.

Who suggested it to you ? Can i also say - playing devils advocate that if my parents we paying my child's fees because we couldn't afford them and someone else with similar finances to ours got a full bursary I would be annoyed and feel unfairly treated. As others have said look carefully at your options for when she us 11 - a grammar wold be ideal by the sounds of it x

We don't have grammars in this area - they were abolished in 1974 - until I joined mumsnet, I really didn't know they still existed!! But yes, there are some great schools around here.

I too think you should have priced what you must know to be expensive even with a bursery to see if you could afford it. Before you went to visit even. I think it's terrible you've out your dd through all that for nothing.

I don't understand why you are so bothered about other child either.

Ds's school apparently offers 100% bursaries but when I enquired I was told that they couldn't remember the last time they'd actually awarded one. I didn't enquire any further as I'm pretty sure my income would be above any bursary level for prep school. However I shall definitely be applying for senior school as ds wants to go to a full boarding school and there is no way I can afford that level of fees.

Actually dd is a lot less concerned than I am! And had we got the full bursary we had worked out the extras, and could have done it. It's not the other child I am bothered about, it was the blatant crowing by the parents that they had, (to my mind at least, I know many people have and will disagree with me,) pretty much got money from the school pot that needs to be stretched, by false pretences. I was actually very quiet about the whole procedure, a few close friends knew we were doing it and dd did discuss the times she had spent at the school with her friends of course - when we told her that she had passed the exam and was certainly clever enough to go but sadly we didn't have enough money, she was a bit cross for a while but then satrted talking about what she will be doing in year 3 at her current school. It's more me and my 'delusions' I guess

I am in and out of state and private schools all the time, and the teaching varies a lot in both, depending on the quality of the head etc. Paying for something does not necessarily mean it's better, and just because it's free at the point of use does not necessarily mean it's crap. However one thing does matter and that is how many bright, engaged kids there are in a school. If there's a critical mass, then other bright kids do fine.