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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To hate the police?

268 replies

DrHolmes · 07/02/2013 17:32

BF was pulled over by an unmarked police car today. He got out of his van and was told he was not wearing his seatbelt and they issued him with a £60 ticket. I came home from work and he told me the story and told me he was wearing it. He has a beeper that goes off every few seconds if he doesnt have it on and no one would drive about listening to that. I know he is telling the truth. If we appeal it then we put our case forward and then goes to court but if the fiscal find the police in favour we will have a higher fine. But i do not want him to pay the fine because that is letting them away with this. Corrupt filth. Not sure what to do :/

OP posts:
ThatVikRinA22 · 07/02/2013 23:02

deepred youre on.

after 3....

3
2
1

byeeeeee!!!

niceguy2 · 07/02/2013 23:02

'the public get the police they deserve',

The point behind that phrase is that as you point out, the police are the public. So if you have a load of idiots in the general public then you will end up with a load of idiots in the police. And let me say we have a LOT of idiots in our public!

That said from my dealings with the police I'd have to say that on balance we have a very very good police force and recruitment seems to weed out most of the idiots.

For those moaning about our 'corrupt' police, you haven't seen anyfuckingthing.

Next week I will be returning to a country on business where typically if shit happens, the last people you want to see are the police. The only time I've seen them 'enforce' the law was stopping motorists speeding on the motorway. They just randomly pulled cars over and gave them on the spot bribes fines. I'd have been less cynical if it wasn't a bank holiday weekend and they probably needed extra spending cash. Another time I had to 'tip' the law officer to be allowed into the airport. Failure to comply would mean a beating, followed by severe torture and an anal cavity search with a truncheon. And I'm not even exaggerating.

Another country I went to last year, they routinely get young girls to chat up tourists in a bar. Then when they leave, they are arrested for soliciting a minor. You then get to spend a few days/weeks in their cells until you wisely choose to make a generous donation to their (cough) station rebuilding fund.

I'd take our coppers any day of the week.

landofsoapandglory · 07/02/2013 23:02

Vicar it's you who needs to read, not me! Our case never went to court. The police would tell us that they would warn the people doing it, and next time they would escalate it etc, but they never did. They just said the same thing over and over again, until one night they PC said he'd get the sergant to take it to the next level.

The next day the PC came back and said the sergant said to warn them again, so I phoned and asked why. He said because a warning was fine for the first offence, it had been going on for four years and he said he didn't know that because no one had made him aware! So you see, they were shit and they did let us down!

I don't doubt you are very good at your job, but don't pretend that everyone in the police is, because they are not!

amillionyears · 07/02/2013 23:03

My DH and I run a business.
There is no way that I would sit here tonight and defend all business owners.
Wouldnt dream of it.

AmIthatWintry · 07/02/2013 23:04

I'm hiding this thread too.

pathetic idiots spouting cliches "corrupt filth" etc. It is laughably pathetic

OP that needs to step back from running her bf's life - fuck it, no wonder he's scared to tell her he didn't have his seatbelt on

I hope the police are tied up with something more important if ever these posters needed to ask for their help

Twanks

Seenenoughtoknow · 07/02/2013 23:04

Yes Vicar - the police wrote our statements how they wanted to write them, not how we spoke them. I wrote about this further back.

The case went to court, neither my friend or I (a witness) had to attend (I told my friend this was a bad idea as I thought things had been underhand so far).

We live rurally, it was a county court and a solicitor (whom she never got to meet) dealt with it for her. The nearest women's aid said it was the most sadistic and sustained beating they'd seen in many years (over 2 hours of beating, bullying, even a threat of murder whilst she was locked in the house with him)...doors were smashed in, she was stripped naked etc etc... She was destroyed by it and is still suffering emotionally, mentally and physically now, years on.

So, if the police (the abuser's friends remember) were there to help and guide her, why do you think he got off? One of the local police officers who know him gave a statement to say he was of good character (they all know he's a bully and a menace and has been involved in and provoked many fights, so even if these are not on record, surely an honest police officer couldn't stand up and say he was of good character?).

This is not a reflection on the force as a whole, but it is proof it does happen. The police didn't let the abuser off, but they did everything in their power to help him. They even advised him to put himself on a voluntary pub watch ban for 6 months because they knew it would look good in court (as he was under the influence when the beating occurred).

Anyway, I have no doubt you are a dedicated member of the force, and I wish there were a few more of you locally to us. I'm sorry this ever happened - especially for my friend, as her trust in the police is even lower than mine, and for good reason after her ordeal.

ThatVikRinA22 · 07/02/2013 23:07

sorry land i got you muddled with another poster....apologies.

frustratedworkingmum · 07/02/2013 23:07

What a sad sad thread to read - no wonder there are so many kids with terrible attitudes towards authority and law and order if this is the attitude they get from their parents.

I daresay the police aren't perfect, you name me a profession that is?

DIddled · 07/02/2013 23:08

I have the misfortune to be married to one of the afore mentioned 'corrupt filth'.

His recent offences include happening across a violent aggravated burglary whilst walking the dog (off duty) and without thought for his own safety , detaining the offender and ensuring the elderly householder was ok. Nearly lost the bloody dog tho'!

Also running outside in bare feet when a neighbour across the road was accosted on her doorstep at knifepoint for her car keys, then jumping in the car to try and find the bloke who held a knife to a mum with two toddlers on her own property.

He'd be mortified if he knew I had shared this- he is the most modest man I know!! He is also not one of those types who feel the need to make sure everyone knows what he does.

I'm proud of him anyway :)

ThatVikRinA22 · 07/02/2013 23:13

seen - i have explained that once it goes to court it is totally out of the hands of the police.

land i got you muddled with seen which is a sign i
A) need to go to bed
B) do need to hide this thread!

gless you are right. im getting too involved and there is no way im going to change opinions on a forum!
those that have had a perceived bad experience will hang on to that - and tell everyone about it. thats human nature - and it shows we probably dont explaint things well enough when they do go tits up....especially with domestics.

i had a domestic which got statute barred and i worked my arse off to get a result for the victim only to find out it couldnt go to court because of the length of time it took to get to my desk then gather the evidence.

shit service? yep.
my fault? no. i did my best. i gave it my all. i was as pissed off as the victim. it still bothers me now.

ThatVikRinA22 · 07/02/2013 23:15

niceguy - i think thats exactly what he meant.
thank you.

landofsoapandglory · 07/02/2013 23:19

It's okay VicarSmile hope you sleep well!

Seenenoughtoknow · 07/02/2013 23:19

Vicar - and I have said more than once that the police INFLUENCED the case in the favour of the abuser. That's why we lost.

TheCraicDealer · 07/02/2013 23:19

But don't they sort of write them in a more refined, factual manner anyway? My partner is in the RMP and they don't take statements verbatim, they read quite oddly really.

It's now getting to the point that he is going to have to think about what he's going to do should he leave the army. One thing I don't want him to go into is policing, partly because of posters like Vicar who really do work their socks off and are still branded by a large proportion of the public as "scum". Yeah, because he was scum, wasn't he? And this fella here too. Jeez, you really do know frig all.

niceguy2 · 07/02/2013 23:22

I think you are flogging the proverbial dead horse vicar. I'd stop whilst you are still sane.

Most reasonable people will realise that the police are human. There will be good coppers and some piss poor ones. That's life.

I went to the doctor's yesterday and the dr I saw didn't know which drug to prescribe for my fairly common condition. I had to tell her. Do I now start a MN post declaring all doctor's are idiots?

The woman cashier at Iceland today was incredibly slow at scanning. Which are the morons? Everybody at Iceland or all women?

Am I sounding a bit unreasonable????

Lilithmoon · 07/02/2013 23:24

It almost goes without saying that in such a huge workforce you will have some problems; however I am certain the good outweighs the bad. I have only ever had positive experiences with the police; and am very thankful to them.

niceguy2 · 07/02/2013 23:26

Oh and lastly before I go to bed. My yardstick for whether or not we have a good police force is quite simple.

If I was getting mugged and the police show up do I think:

a) Thank god!
b) Shit! run!

In the UK it's undoubtedly a)

In far too many other countries it's b)

amillionyears · 07/02/2013 23:34

Glad vicar appears to have gone to bed.

I think you need to put yourself and your health before the police, not the other way round.

cumfy · 08/02/2013 00:03

Well it's an interesting split between those who have had good and poor experiences with the police.

There are far, far, too many poor experiences being detailled here.

I also think it is unfortunate that those who have had good experiences, drag out the "there's always one bad apple though isn't there ?" argument.

SarahBumBarer · 08/02/2013 00:13

My experiences of the police:

Police attended burglary at home of my then 13 year old self in Northumberland and told my parents that we have a better chance of catching the burglar than they do.

Police car tailgates 18 year old me along a deserted country road in Norfolk and in fear I spead up to get back to the built up area then he pulls me over for speeding.

A friend whose father is a police officer who admits after her parents separate that her dad regularly hit her mother and police had been called at least twice (to her knowledge) to the house. Mother had on at least one of those occasions been pressured to let the matter drop quietly.

Coming out of train station in Derby, DH and I get caught up in horrendous post football match traffic. Cars entering yellow boxes and all sorts. Two Police officers chatting and doing nothing. I ask them out of the window if they should not be doing something to try and direct the traffic flow better. One tells me to shut up and move on or he will pull us over and inspect our car and he "will find something".

A friend of mine joins Leicestershire police (around the time of a lovely BBC documentary showing Leicestershire police officers behaving quite badly although lazily rather than corruptly). During a conversation some 18 or so months later she talks about some kid being arrested and being handled a bit roughly and falling over. I was horrified but according to her it is ok because he was being arrested and people have always "done something" if they are being arrested. We are no longer friends.

We get burgled, my car keys and hence my car are taken. Police are actually initially very attentive because it is part of a widespread luxury car theft ring (only it was my DH's car they were after and they lucked out with my banger). Shortly thereafter my car was spotted by the police who gave chase resulting in my car being abandoned. £150 impound fee later I got it back after a £40 taxi trip since it was recovered to the most inconvenient location possible. Police had told me that when it was found I would be given a choice of where it would be taken probably a location about 2 miles south of me would be best. Perhaps they just thought I fancied a trip to the lovely industrial estates of north Nottinghamshire instead. No explanation ever provided as to why the procedures that I had told would be followed was not.

My dad was beaten up by his partners son after a non-violent argument with his partner (about son's drinking). Police attended and removed my dad from his own home on the grounds of preventing a breach of the peace. Police later advised that they did this because it was easier to remove him (being one person) than the two others (partner and son). Dad spent night humiliated and distressed in police cell.

My DH's mother got a part time job in her 50's as a civilian with a police force. She stuck it out for just over a year before she quit with no job to go to because of the sexist, bullying, ageist, patronising attitude of a "significant minority" of the police she worked for/with.

Nothing really major but enough to have painted a long-term sustained impression of a police force...not to be proud of.

Then take the stuff, the serious stuff you read in the press.

OhBotheration · 08/02/2013 00:14

I haven't read the whole thread, it's all a bit too depressing but like the other officers on here, it's all stuff I have heard before.

But I will say this.

I don't care what you think of me or my uniform. I will still turn up and deal with your burglary/assault/theft/rape. If yesterday, I arrested you and tomorrow, you are the victim, then that's what you are and I will still sit with you and take your statement and reassure as best I can.

That's my job.

I know there is corruption. I have confronted it when I have seen it. Most of us care more than we would admit and most have joined out of a genuine desire to help. Most people have a shitty experience to report, even I do.

There's 150,000 of us and seven million of you. Give us a break.

OhBotheration · 08/02/2013 00:18

Btw, Vicar, I am really sad to hear you are off work at the moment. I hope you are okay.

And my post doesn't read very well now I've looked at it. I'm going to bed. Tomorrow is a new day.

sashh · 08/02/2013 04:54

Fight it. Go to court and state your case (well your BF's actually needs to do it).

I did this with a parking fine, the magistrate suggested the police solicitor and I had a chat, we did, they offered no evidence and it was dropped.

DreamingOfTheMaldives · 08/02/2013 07:50

Vicar, sometimes you just can't reason with people, but I admire your tenacity! I absolutely hate being tarred with the same brush as the few ignorant/bullies/lying officers that there are. Because we all know there are, and its not like any of us officers on the thread have denied it. It's not a perfect world and we're not a perfect police force.

Whilst I agree that it is only some officers who are ignorant/lying/bullies, one of the reason that decent officers get tarred with the same brush is their complicity in that behaviour, by turning a blind eye to it. You know these officers are lying/bullies/ignorant but how many times have you made a stand and reported their behaviour? How many times have you censored your witness statement to exclude the lying/bullying behaviour of your colleague?

Officers turn a blind eye to the inappropriate and often criminal behaviour of their colleagues, as there is a 'don't grass' and stick together mentality, whatever happens, in the police service.
Until the decent officers stop condoning the behaviour by their failure to report it, you will find yourselves tarred with the same brush.

My best friend is a police officer and I believe she is a good one. She is also a decent, honest, caring, thoughtful person. That didn't stop her saying she hadn't witnessed a colleague assault someone he had detained by smashing his face into the ground. She knew the officer was a bully and had assaulted someone but she turned a blind eye and excluded it from her statement and lied when the complaint was investigated. She was a probationer at the time. Her other colleagues who were also present and did exactly the same as her were not, they were experienced officers.

Officers write their statements together so that the account of events is identical, word for word, rather than being your own personal recollection of the incident. You wouldn't allow civilian witnesses to do that yet it is considered acceptable for officers to do that. Is it any wonder the public think officers collude with each other.

JustasmallGless · 08/02/2013 08:22

Dreaming- if officers do their statements together it has declared in court and that is taken account of.

The police conduct regulations have been changed so that of you don't report something which is an offence ( and please bear In mind that officers have a higher level of behaviour to adhere to in their personal life) then YOU are as culpable as the offending officer.

The culture of covering for the few bad apples will go. The number of women in the police has also increased over the last 19 years to nearly a third. I think this makes a difference too. Women deal with aggressive offenders differently and try and diffuse rather than dominate.