to think that Chris Huhne's son was very wrong to call him 'autistic'

[Sallyingforth]

He is may be an unpleasant creature but that word should never be used as an insult.
order-order.com/2013/02/04/peter-huhnes-texts-to-lying-father/

Iclaudius

If you show me where I have piled in on the boy I would be grateful. Ta

Pagwatch no not 'boy' - me

I am not sure a couple of comments constitutes being piled in on. Maybe just a couple of posters thinking your comments look as though you haven't read anything anyone else has said.

But for what is worth I have said I hope he is left alone.

I think it's disgusting that these private text messages have been made public.

They should have been seen by the court but definatly not the public.

That is disgusting.

Damemargot - because people who don't have to live it don't know. That doesn't make them vicious or stupid, it makes them ignorant.

I have shared the example of my friends who joined the hate heather mills group. I can't expect them to be alert at all times to the problems and daily humiliations of life as an amputee.

Just as I know virtually nothing about raising a child who isn't NT or what it is like to be deaf or blind.

So if everyone who is stupid or ignorant or careless is met with a veritable tsunami of condemnation.... I just don't think it helps.

I am not saying dont challenge. But make the challenge proportionate to the offence.

I think pagwatch says it well - just please would you think about what you are saying. NOT 'this is disgusting, horrific' etc. for RG and his ilk yes. For PH, no.

When you explain things though and people still dont get it, thats willful ignorance.

It can be anyway and it often is.

Well of course. If you explain and they refuse to engage, then gloves off, do with them what you will, they are a lost cause.

But I want to believe that most people want to do the right thing and most people just don't know or just don't think, rather than that they come from a place of hate which must be 'horrifying' and 'disgusting' to quote but two of the words used a lot on this thread.

But some people do come from a place of hate and it is naive to think otherwise.

Hopefully they are in the minority.

I have felt touched by posters on threads who have come back and said that yes now they do have a better understanding and they will think twice in the future.

But it always amazed me at the lengths some people will go to to justify their prejudice and just dont seem to want to change their attitude.

"But I want to believe that most people want to do the right thing and most people just don't know or just don't think, rather than that they come from a place of hate which must be 'horrifying' and 'disgusting' to quote but two of the words used a lot on this thread".

That's right.

I can be crass without knowing it. I think we all can be.

The only further advice I'd offer is that people (well, me) react better when "engaged with" gently. I get defensive and cross when rebuked - it's natural. Much better when I go away and reflect on a gentle conversation.

Of course some people come from a place of hate. I have met quite a few. Luckily for me I have the verbal dexterity, the social capital and enough physical aggression to put them right back down where they need to be. I do understand that some disabled people don't have that power and never will, which is why their parents fight so hard for them and feel so angry and depressed.

But it has to be worth distinguishing between ignorance and hate.

I think after all this time I have a good measure of the difference.

Ignorance stops once informed.

Hate just keeps on going.

O yes - hate won't stop, you can't reason someone out of hate. Those people just have to be stopped. But the ignorant can learn. The cHallenge I guess is identifying who is who at early stage.

But I think its pretty easy in the PH example. I don't see him as a hater of autistic people, rather someone using a misinformed stereotype that autistic=unable to understand others emotions.

spero has put it very well

but I am not at the end of the prejudice people receive, so who am I tell people to not be so angry

so I shall gracefully bow out, walk a mile in their shoes and all that

They in the public domain because we have open justice. That is very very important. They don't have it in places like China. Although it does seem very private he or his mother has agreed they be used in the case and it would be much worse if we had hidden closed justice.

I think what has upset people is the sheer ordinariness of using autistic as an insult (as exemplified by all the posters who think its ridiculous to be upset by this).

Many posters (including Hecate several times, in her apparently-invisible font...) have pointed out that this isn't about Peter Huhne. It's about the fact that disabilist insults are generally seen as acceptable in a way that racial or sexist ones are not.

Threads like this might perhaps help to raise awareness and make people think twice before they say something similar another time.

I thought the court ordered disclosure of the texts? Don't think anyone had any choice, but I might be wrong.

I wasn't ignoring hecates point, just concerned that general trend of thread was to assert that every disablist comment in every context was horrific, and I don't think that is right or helpful to the general debate.

Others are of course at liberty to disagree.

He was wrong but I think leave him alone really. Poor choice of words, but most insults are derogatory terms to someone. What comes across most is his sheer anger and disappointment in his dad and I feel sorry for him. My son was diagnosed with autism today. There is all sorts of stuff like this I am dreading but I'm pretty sure this lad has no interest on hurting my son or people like him.

"I think what has upset people is the sheer ordinariness of using autistic as an insult" I agree completely Bedhopper, that is why I feel strongly that this needs to be discussed, irrespective of who said it & when.

I wish I hadn't read this. Ds was diagnosed with autism today and I'm feeling a bit raw at the moment.

I don't care how PH is hurting. No excuse to use autism or any other disability as an insult. Nice

Well ok I feel sorry for him, he's obviously hurting badly but still...

just concerned that general trend of thread was to assert that every disablist comment in every context was horrific, and I don't think that is right or helpful to the general debate

well, disablist comment (i.e. insult) is as horrific/not-horrific as racist or sexist comments. Calling someone an 'autistic piece of ' (presumably is 'shit') is, IMO the same as calling them a 'black bastard' - which I would consider completely unacceptable and horrid. Adding the word 'black' or 'autistic' into your insult shows that you consider blackness or autisticness to compound the insult, and therefore reveals an unacceptable view of race or disability.

I do feel sorry for PH's situation. And I imagine that he might be unaware of the implications of what he said - simply because disablism has not been widely and publicly addressed in the way that racism has.

Threads like this are a tiny drop in the ocean of the work that needs to be done to raise awareness. But it would be lovely if just one person who has read this thread might think twice before using the word 'autistic' (or any other disability) as an insult in the future - or challenge it when they hear someone else doing it.

in the 4th line of that post I mean to say that 'piece of ' presumably means 'piece of shit'.

aw ghostwhoosh, I am every so sorry this upset you

great timing huh?

But the comment ""I think what has upset people is the sheer ordinariness of using autistic as an insult"

Its NOT ORDINARY!!! i have never ever n my days heard of this as an insult

many vile terms have passed me by, but not this one