to ask you to talk to me about people who DON'T have children

[Officedepot]

I am 30 and not sure whether I want kids, mainly for the following reasons:

• I am not actually that sure I like kids that much. As in when I see kids out and about in shops or on trains etc my normal reaction is to be annoyed by them, ie. if they are making a noise, running around getting in the way. Although I know other people who say they felt like this about other people's kids but love their own.

• In my 20s I lacked the confidence to travel, pursue hobbies etc but now I have developed a bit more confidence and have a really fulfilling life and loads of hobbies, mainly adventure sports. I also travel a lot to weird and wonderful places. I think if you are the kind of person whose hobbies extend to shopping and going for coffee and you only holiday in mainstream places then you would be fine having kids but my hobbies / travels are not really stuff that could work around younger kids.

• I worry babies might bore me and teenagers would be too stressful.

• I am lucky that I have a good career and get paid well so I am used to having the money to do pretty much what I want (within reason!). Not sure I want to live the rest of my life on a budget (sorry if that sounds selfish!).

• I actually rather like spending time with DP. Just the two of us

• I have also battled with some mental health issues and have anxiety and worry A LOT about various things so not sure how I would cope with kids. I am also someone who NEEDS 8 hours' sleep per night or I really struggle to function / cope.

DP feels the same, although we both acknowledge that we might want kids in a few years' time.

However it does concern me what life would be like without kids, especially when I am older (like my parents' age). I do like the idea of having adult kids I have to say.

Please talk to me about the lives of people (either yourself or someone you know) who does not have kids.

Cailin

Great post

Amber

What an awful thing to say

OP

I think it's perfectly rational and acceptable not to want children, but I agree with those who have said that you have time to decide.
I think all the things you say in your OP make you sound thoughtful and realistic. I have thought many of them myself. But I do feel as Cailin does

IMO you are overthinking the whole thing. Could this be linked to the problems you have with anxiety? Have you had treatment? It can be life changing.

I used to think I 'needed' 8 hours sleep. Its not true. We just 'need' what we're used to and manage on what you get. You'd cope. Everyone does. Why do you think you'd be any different?

Things have changed in my life since we had children but I don't even use the word 'sacrifice' because the pro's of having my children are literally unimaginable and if I have to have a few years off skiing/ less money then so be it.

I would also add, that for me, having children was an urge that stemmed from the desire to create something new with my DH. It was as much about me and him as it was about me, IYSWIM.

You sound very like me 8 years ago. I couldn't see a reason for having children - people tend to talk a lot about the negatives and it didn't seem much fun, I'd never been broody and logically it didn't make sense (I also NEEDED 8 hours a night!).

What swung it for me was that I didn't want to wake up at 60 and regret my decision so we decided to not use contraception and see if I could even get pregnant (part of me was convinced I couldn't). I fell pregnant pretty quickly and I had some wobbles during pregnancy and the first 12 months but I can honestly say its the best thing I ever did. I now have two and I think being aware that not everyone loves kids has made me more considerate to others who don't want everywhere to be child-centric.

You don't have to decide now and either choice is valid but maybe you are trying to be too logical about it and having kids isn't about logic. As someone said to me recently parenthood is 7 shades of hell and it's 7 shades of heaven too.

Not read the whole thread but I can totally identify with the OP just from that one post. HOWEVER!!! My DS turns 4 next week and, although it has been the most challenging role I have ever had in my life, by God, I cant even put into words how much I love him. Yes I fantasise about having a life, but if that meant that I'd never have had him then life can get stuffed. I often heard Pre-DS that mothers would die for their children, and I never quite got that until I held that gorgeous lump in my arms 4 years ago. What I am trying to say is don't rule it out on account of your current lifestyle or issues. We all have a remarkable ability to adjust.

I think it's worth considering that around 25% of British women will remain childless, and I believe taht in America, the %age is even higher, around 35%. So though you are posting on a parenting board, where there is a strong presumption for having children, if you look at women more broadly, then you will see that it is quite widespread.

I don't have children, but my life has changed enormously from how it was when I was in my twenties or even my thirties. Women without children are not a homogenous mass with a single lifestyle of city breaks in Europe, late night cocktails and expensive shoes. Many of the comments on here about people remembering a single childfree life are nothing like my life as a married 47 year old. In general, I'm not interested in shoes, and don't get to go on many city breaks! Reflecting on my female friends, most are either without children or are empty nesters. But we all have very different lifestyles - some are married, some are single, some widowed, some gay, some with partners. Some (me included) run our own businesses, others are retired, others working. All of us have an amazing array of hobbies/obsessions/interests - contribute a great deal to families (including caring for elderly relations), and many involved with DC in various ways, including things like being school governors, being teachers, helping out with activities, etc

All I can say is that it is perfectly possible to have a rich, fulfilling life without children, but it needs to be your life, not mine and not anybody else's.

42 and childless by choice.

A lot of my friends (early forties) don't have kids either.

What pisses me off is when people question why I don't have kids. My bloody doctor, during a routine examination of my psoriasis asked 'why I didn't have kids and was there a problem in that department?' I put it down to him being an older Asian man.

I don't go round asking my friends who have kids why they have chosen to do so.

I have two beautiful cats though. I sing to them and we co-sleep. [mad cat-lady emoticon]

God, there are some miserable bastards on that childfree website!

It sounds like you shouldn't have children.

CalinDana - what a beautiful post! I too would never change having kids - yet before I had them I wasn't one to be around kids at all. Now I love the little blighters!

Most of my good friends are childfree, nearly all of them by choice (I think there are one or two who would like/would have liked children but it didn't happen, or hasn't happened yet.) I was never all that keen on the idea, though from time to time I rather wanted to go for it and did have a bit of a soft spot for babies and other people's DC (unless they were completely vile) - though for me, the main priority was (and still is) avoiding couplehood. I got PG accidentally at 39 and thought, oh well why not? and now have an 8-year-old who I love very much - but if I hadn't had him I'd still be having a happy, enjoyable life. Or at least the odds are reasonably good that I would have been just as happy childfree.

I do think it's perfectly OK to be childfree. The childfree balance out (to an extent) the people who have four or five or even more children. I also think that some people breed because they think they ought to, or they are too unimaginative to consider that it's not compulsory, and then regret it when they actually have children to look after, which is not much good for anyone concerned, child or adult.

I was probably similar to you and went on to have one dc.

It's just like a whole new adventure really. A huge challenge which brings amazing rewards.

I got to 35 and pretty much all of my friends were having families. And suddenly all those nights out became a bit boring. DH was very keen to have a dc.

It's a new chapter in my life - I can't say I don't sometimes find playing the same game for the 40th time a bit dull, and I don't love every one of her friends (but I can usually find something to like about most of them).

Someone said to me, just have one and it won't change your life that much. I'm afraid I think that's a big lie. It has totally transformed our lives.

But definitely for the better. Funnily enough I can find just as much enjoyment sitting on a beach in the UK in the rain than I could sitting on one in Goa.

It something that involves you pretty much 24 hours a day and there's not really any relief from that. So I won't say it's easy. But somehow it's worth it. I look at my dc and think she's the most amazing thing in the world. Far better than any travelling, nights out, jobs opportunties. All of those things are just insignificant when it comes to her.

I haven't any kids and as I'm 37 time is running out fast for me. I'm finding it really hard to decide. I'm inclining towards not having them. I love my life as it is and most of all I love my relationship with my DP just as it is, and I know that would change if kids came along.

HollaAtMeBaby Please do not think that all childless women would look at that website. It is bad. I am childless but love kids, other peoples that is.

Not many people regret having their children but I have known people who regret not having them at all.

Dryjuice I think that's really difficult to be sure about - it's pretty taboo to say you regret your children when they actually exist.

Women can live fulfilling and happy lives with or without children I have no doubt.
However, I think to imagine that the way to protect one's current romantic relationship with DP is to avoid becoming a mother is erroneous. Just as having a "sticking plaster baby" will not fix a difficult relationship, neither will remaining child free stop a good relationship from changing. Adult relationships are dynamic and will be affect by other life events; longevity, financial issues, illness, ageing!!! All of which will happen regardless of whether one becomes a parent.

My sister and her husband are child free by choice. They have the life they want, and it looks good and happy to me.

They spoil their nephews and god children. BIL is my son's my favouritest person on the planet and they go off and do their own boy things while sis and I shop and yak during my visits to the UK. So it's not like they hate kids, just don't want any of their own and that never changed despite everybody insisting to them that it would.

I think they made the only sensible choice, to only have the number of children they wanted, which was zero. Much better than a friend of mine who never wanted children, but had one anyway becuase she crumpled in the face of "oh, you'll change your mind, only it will be too late, and you'll live the rest of your life in regret"

My poor friend, her poor kid. What an unmitigated disaster thanks in not insignificant part to people who have fixed ideas and shove them down other peoples' thrpats ad nauseum.

I would happily (I think) have remained childless but DH dearly wanted children. I agreed to one child and my practical life has not changed dramatically as a result: DH and I can still afford (time/money) to go out alot, pursue hobbies and go abroad. But emotionally things have changed dramatically for me: I never could have imagined how much I love my child, how much I've learned about children/people by watching her develop. It's an amazing adventure!

i know loads of people without kids. Probably just as many as who do have them. Its a perfectly valid choice, and people with adult kids when theyre elderly can sometimes be the loneliest, as its not guaranteed your kids will visit you. Enough old people who live alone and the kids are stressed and see visiting their parents as a chore

my ex in laws had two children they didn't want. they never discussed it, at the time, each assumed the other wanted children. they had a boy and girl and considered the job done. they then talked it through and realised they hadn't wanted any. they were open about that with the children and with anyone who would listen.
they raised two totally fucked up human beings, desperate for attention, with no deeply held values.
if you don't want children, don't do it.

I think you've been given some good advice here OP, but there was one thing I wanted to add. Please don't take it for granted that you have loads of time to decide. I very unexpectedly had a prem menopause that started at age 35, no warning, I didn't know of any family history (i later found out it had happened to one of my grans).

I met my husband when we were both still in our teens got married at 24 and had my 3 dc at 29, 31 and 32. We've taken them backpacking in Latin America (when dd2 was small enough to be in the backpack, have travelled in Europe and the Carribean as well (and we never do all-inclusive!!). We're tentatively thinking about going to India with them but that depends more on me as I also have neurological problems.

Since I had dc I've learned to ski (though I no longer can) and to scuba dive.

We're pretty laid back non anxious parents, though, and it easier to go a bit off the tourist trail as dh is a doctor so health isn't so much of a worry. In fact in Guatemala the only one of the 5 of us who didnt get d&v was dd2, who was 16 months old and still breastfed!! I have to say travelling with children has really opened my eyes to aspects of countries I thought I knew well because you can get a whole new perspective seeing it through their eyes. I also had amazing conversations with other women about their lives and families, which opened up because I was carrying a baby on my back (we had a fantastic hour in Antigua Guatemala with a bunch of indigenous Mayan women who all had a go of our Bushbaby backpack while I learned to tie a sling on in about 15 different ways!!)

I've been ill with this neuro thing for a year now and I guess I've learned to grab life with both hands. For me, I was lucky enough to get children out of that. But that's me. I'll get back to you on the teen thing - my dd1 is about to become one!!

Most of my friends felt the same as you at 30. Now pushing 40, they all have at least one child

Having said that, I do know a couple in their forties who consciously decided not to have children and to spend most of their time, money, energy etc on intternational travel. They seem to lead a fabulous life.

Officedepot, I could have written your OP - I know have 4 DSs .

For me it was never about having babies, but I could not imagine growing old without adult children and (maybe) grandchildren. I find babies boring and who knows what the teenage years will bring, but if I did not have children I'd never find out, would I?

FWIW, I had my first at 37, my last at almost 44; tbh, given the choice, I'd've had them a bit earlier (I had several MCs before I had DS1).

Having children is not the be all and end all, and not having them would certainly make for an easier, cheaper, more self-directed life, but equally having had them has been the single most exciting, hard, satisfying, terrifying and interesting thing I have ever done. I see your adventure sports and raise you child rearing !!