To think school should have done something to help my child

[gordyslovesheep]

She was on camp for a week - I had packed her toiletries in a white toiletry bag - everything she needed - tooth brush, tooth paste, shampoo, shower gel, shower puff, flannel etc

she came home after 5 days and said 'Mummy I didn't have anything to wash with' ...transpires she didn't 'think' to look in the wash bag and had been brushing her teeth with her mates paste and her finger and hadn't had a decent wash or hair wash

DD3 is a bit vague - she needs reminding of things a lot - she also needs to be clean as she is approaching puberty - she is 8

Camp was 40 mins away from our house

AIBU to think school could have a) had a teacher check her bag to make sure she didn;t have these things OR b) contact us and ask us to bring them up

I was a bit cross they did neither

Firstly, she needs to pack her own stuff, with you checking & guiding. (Although haribo in the washbag is a good idea!)

Secondly, I've taken lots of kids on residentials, & I always pack a bag of hotel toiletries (shampoo/shower gel, disposable toothbrushes etc) which dh, who works away a lot, tends to accumulate.

But my first response if a child came to me with no washing stuff would definitely be: 'Who packed your bag? Why didn't you? Well, if your mum/dad did it, I'm sure there'll be a washbag in there somewhere. Go & look properly, & if there really isn't, come back & I'll sort you out with some shower gel & a toothbrush.'

It's far more common that it's teaching colleagues who forget their shampoo though - they've often been in a total flap sorting out cover lesson planning, own childcare & making sure the gin is packed.....

forever i wasn't tall at that age. i'm not tall now either.

When mine went on camp (boys, age 6 to 9), they helped me pack the stuff and I talked them through where everything was. After that it was up to them. I gather the leaders were scrupulous about ensuring teeth-brushing, though

Hi op.. Your dd sounds like a normal kid who shouldn't be approaching pubity what a pain for her. My dd was 11 and I thought that was early.. Poor pet.

Personally I think 8 is far too young to be away from you for a week to be honest and your text is proof of that.

forever dd2 is like me ...short with stumpy legs! Dd1 is 10 and tall with no hips ...she is showing no signs at all.

Oh and she was fine away from me ...she had a ball.

Wow. She's a bit 'vague' but you didn't think to tell her about the wash bag. But expected the teacher to know and ensure she used it.

When asked if she washed, I'm also sure the teacher is also to blame for her disingenuous answer.

Glad I refuse to do residential trips with kids because of this sort of blame/responsibility/hassle.

I think that teachers/group leaders sometimes dont realise that children often need to be given very specific instructions .

I was talking about this with DD1(17) she said that some teachers are (understandably) nervous of being in close contact with children while they are performing 'private' tasks.

At the age of 8 some children will be happy to go off and sort themselves. Others will need to be told to use toothpaste with the toothbrush when brushing teeth.

I'm afraid I feel that it is a bit silly to chastise teachers over this. Unless she has significant special educational needs, she should be taking as much responsibility as possible for her own personal hygiene at this stage, rather than being nannied through basic stuff.

Our 9 year old started growing pubic hair at 7 years old, same age as me, I expect our 7 year old to soon show signs of puberty too. Both girls take personal responsibility for their hygiene at home, but I can see the 7 year old just still doesn't care, whereas the 9 year old is far more meticulous. Both go on 3 Scouts camps a year and a school residential a year, plus sleepovers. The 9 year old packs her own bags and I inspect them afterwards, the 7 year old just can't be bothered but I make her pack her bags in front of her, go through the teeth brushing routine, washing face routine, make her tick items off the list herself, otherwise she'd end up exactly like the OP's child. I do see this as basic stuff and only a child with special needs (yes I have an AS child so I know the extra time it takes) should need at the age of 8 years old to be nannied.

I am currently in a 3-4 years class, the difference in abilities at the beginning of the year was spectacular, many couldn't eat other than with fingers, couldn't put their own coats on, shoes on, go to the toilet unaided and wash their hands unaided etc, some of it to do with the fact that they'd never had to do these basic tasks before. We now have every single child able to put their coats on, more than half can do their own zips, every child uses a knife and fork with varying degrees of complexity. One child had obviously never ever been to a toilet without and adult before, very hard work in the first few weeks, now can finally pull trousers down, use toilet roll, trousers up, turn tap on, find soap, wash, towel, bin, done! It's all about getting children to take responsibilities for themselves little by little. A 3-4 age teacher should only be helping those with special needs to use a toilet, a 8-9 year teacher shouldn't have to check every child washes themselves. Sorry that sounds like lecturing doesn't it, but it's just basic stuff for the appropriate age.

I got my dd2 to help pack a wash bag for a trip but she forgot to put the toothbrush in. I realised on day 1 got a message to the teachers, they were near shops, and asked them to buy her a toothbrush. They didn't, so she didn't brush her teeth for a week.

Yuk! But she wasn't bothered..and really wasn't the end of the world.

When my DS2 went on a school trip aged 9, the school instructions said that children had to pack for themselves. Lots of parents were a bit and packed for their little darlings... But I guess this is exactly why the school suggested it: a child who has done their own packing knows what they have with them. :)

But why send them away at such a young age? For a week as well. Far far too long until at least 11.

None of my kids would have enjoyed that. A 2 day field trip yes. A bloody week definatly not.

I have a 14 year old DS who still needs to be reminded to do the basics and no, he hasnt been nannied. According to DD1(17) who has a good understanding of the species this is pretty normal.

Even if children know they have things and know they are supposed to wash they sometimes need to be told when to do things. This is especially true when they are out of their normal environment and routine.

This can be simple stuff like telling children to wash hands & face and brush teeth and put on pyjamas rather than simply telling them to get ready for bed.

What is wrong with going away for a week? In an environment where you're enjoying yourself and with strong relationships, there is no reason why not. Our girls do Scouts, it places a large emphasis on relationships between the children and their young leaders, they equally do school residential trips, starting at 4 years with 3 days, by 11 years it becomes a 2 week ski trip, these experiences leave a legacy long after the trips have taken place. They aren't just holidays, they learn all sorts of things about the outdoors, they learn there is more to life than TV and games consoles, they learn there is more to relationships than mum, dad and siblings - that they must live in harmony with a greater "family", they learn to take responsibilities for themselves and others.

Spinkle do knock the chip off as the daughter and granddaughter of teachers and working in education myself it is not about blame - and I have accepted that packing with her would have been the best solution - no need to be so abrupt

Thebody I guess that is why we all parent differently - not sure how old your kids are but in terms of 'sending them away' it's something our school does from year 4 - she went with a big gang of mates and loved it - she is used to being 'sent' away as she stays with her dad 2 nights a week.

My first week-long residential trip away was taken when I was 4 and not out of a pushchair (special needs). I went on lots more as I grew up. My mum used to do a huge list of what she'd packed and tape it to the inside of my suitcase. I got assistance with personal care, as did many others on the trips - the staff were trained to deal with special needs kids - but I loved every minute of it.

So I think sending an able-bodied 8-year-old to camp, as long as they want to go, isn't just OK - it's actually worth doing. A little independence from your parents is a precious thing, even at that young age.

Yes, there are risks, but I'd rather let my kid experience the world than be restrictively risk-averse.

I quite agree NamingofParts, our 14 year old is in fact the least willing to do basics when outside of the house of all our children yet he's the 2nd eldest. I wouldn't however expect when he does his next trip away from home for the teachers to have to remind him personally to brush his teeth or wash himself. Teachers simply do not have the time to personally check every single aspect of a child's personal hygiene on trips, some level of responsibility has to be with the child, even if they are not very interested in their personal hygiene.

We do indeed. Although my perspective of school trips has changed I am afraid due to nearly loosing dd on a ski trip this year.

No fault of the school and teachers but just do remember folks that you are sending your most precious thing away and out of your care and trusting others to keep them alive. Coach drivers too remember.

Mister my dd and her friends experience of life wasn't the best. Death, pain and disability..

However I know our experiences have completely changed our perspective and made us irrational in this subject so will how out now with apologies.

Don't know if this would help but top tip from DS1's Akela, when packing for camp make them 'help'. Let them see what is going where in the bags, get them to check off the list.

Our daughter was 2 days into her school ski trip when the Belgian coach crashed in Switzerland, my colleague's friend lost her son in that crash. It made the parents very nervous for the next 10 days, the school immediately told the parents they'd made the choice NOT to tell any of the ski group and asked parents who'd secreted mobile phones in their children's luggage to respect that wish that the children remain oblivious to the coach crash, especially since some of them would know some of the deceased children. The children of course weren't greeted by smiling parents on their return, they were greeted to solemn faces - unfortunately one stupid parent immediately told her girls who told all the rest of the group! But we are all precious, we could all die at any time, we are far more likely for our children to die in our own personal cars than on a trip in a coach with the school. You have to keep things into perspective. Risks in your own personal cars or on school trips do not decrease magically at the age of 11 years old. I'm not going to look up statistics, but at a guess children are at greatest risk during their teenage years and for boys into their early twenties, at the time where they are allowed more independence but their brains are behind in terms of maturity and ability to judge risks.

You broke camp rule one - make them pack their own bag (even if at eight that means putting in it the things that you have got out). Your own fault, I'm afraid.

Sorry. But read your post nat.

My dd was on the school trip in France when her coach did crash in feb.

It's very easy to talk about perspective until you have been woken up by a phone call to say your child's coach has crashed but there's no news... None except pictures on sky news and hearing of a death and injuries.

You see a police car outside your door. The officer is talking to you but you can't hear.. It's not real it's a terrible dream.

Our children will never recover, we will never recover.

I will never again allow my child to be driven on a 24 hour coach trip again or for that matter any coach. The health checks on drivers are shockingly minimal... You don't know this until the police tell you.

thebody - in that context it's understandable that you don't/didn't want to take any risks, and I'm sorry for my bluntness, which is a bad habit I seem to be getting into.

In fact, thebody, my last post was only in response to your earlier post.

I don't really know what to say in response to your next one, apart from that it's truly dreadful what happened to your kids, and something no-one should ever have to face. I'm surprised you were able to respond to my post so calmly, and I'm doubly sorry I wrote it now.