or are the local Posh Mums rude?

[CarefullEugene]

DD2 is now in Year 1, pretty quickly in Year R she settled into a group of five girls. The same names are mentioned all the time, they play together, sit together at school etc.

I knew one child (1) from before school, DD and her get on well, she's been here to play a lot and been invited back.

Friend 2 - lovely friendly parents, playdates outside of school have flourished, lifts home from activities

Friend 3 - invited to play at our house, spent all Saturday had a great time, wanted to come back but never an invite back for my DD

Friend 4 - again has been round to play, mum sat drinking coffee in garden, I answered all her questions but never an invite back and failed to even ring/text about the class beach outing she organised during the summer.

First I thought it was 3 & 4 ' s parents did n't 'do' much out of school 'play stuff' but Friend 1 & 2 have both been several times to 3 & 4 s houses. !, 3 & 4 play tennis together. 1 & 3 organise lifts for ballet, which my DD goes to but has never been 'included'.

Have just gritted teeth and asked Friend 4 round again but the mother turned me down due to tennis commitment.

Parents of No.1 have worked very hard to manipulate desirable friendships but I don't know if I can be arsed. We've moved to this area, have a lovely home, work hard, nice manners but it just does n't seem to be enough for the local cheerleader mums.

So do I ask again, encourage DD to find other friends with nicer parents, ask a direct question - Tell me what's wrong?, or love bomb them with playtime/taxi invites?

I'm smiling nervously in the mirror now. NO I don't grin like a loon at all and sundry, well I did n't think I did, may be I do, may be I do, oh no, that's why my younger daughter does n't get to experience the posh mothers fish fingers & chips (The local, universously agreed fail safe crowd pleasing menu choice)

Oh no, I had become calm and now I've started rocking backwards and forwards .

Thankfully DD is not the PFB but overthinking it, girls 3 & 4 are....

Does that validate you Fake? Or just give you a confidence boost? Good on you.

there are other reasons why some people don't do certain playdates like the specific dynamic of their children that might not have anything to do with your child......for example I found that kind of thing very tricky with boy/girl twins so gave up on it all.....

re the ballet lessons, have you actually asked them for a lift? I'd never bother to offer a lift to someone, but would be happy to do someone a favour if they asked me. If you always go to the lessons they probably don't see need to offer lifts. Chill out!

And I don't think that manipulating your kids friendships is exclusively confined to 'posh mums'. The very non posh mums at DDs school do this too, their kids socialise together because all the mums know each other. It isn't reallya big deal, just probably more convenient for them. They'll find their own friends at secondary school.

I think it works the other way as well fakebook, parents who never smile, look severe - thinking it makes them look interesting (it doesn't) also puts others off.

Personally, I wouldn't waste your energy on them- I don't think you're ever going to crack that nut as it were but I also think you're not atall unusual in thinking about these things. A lot of people in this thread are obviously very cool and don't give a shit - good for them, cheers!

No, just makes me feel all warm and tingly inside and very wise. :)

Yes not smiling is not good either, but most normal people generally smile naturally and go between normal expressionless face to a quick smile.

Smiling excessively or putting on a permanent bulldog face is very strange and would make me run a mile.

Gosh careful I am glad I don't live where you do

Do you have your own friends in the area OP? I wondered if being new to the area you were hoping to make friends via DD? I know when I moved with young DD people kept telling me that having children was the easiest way to make friends when you are a newcomer.

Sadly this wasn't the case for me as everyone was already in friendship groups and being the only one working F/T all the playdates (and mums get togethers) take place when I'm not able to participate. Perhaps it's similar for you? All you can do is to continue to invite others around and try not to take it personally. It can be pretty lonely though.

OP I can promise you that if you go back to work full time all these worries over play dates will disappear!

All families are different and have different priorities. I really would not over analyse this at all. For all you know the other mum's could be on here posting about you as a mum who is pushing for playdates when they are already busy with other commitments (probably not but you know what i mean!). Kids have friends who fulfil different roles and perhaps kids 3 and 4 will always be in school and at mutual activity friends where kids 1 and 2 will be come round to the house friends.

My kids are always asking if they can invite friends back for tea and I get lots of invitations for my kids too.

Unfortunately because we have after school activities 3 nights a week and family commitments 1 night a week , we only have Friday evenings free.

Arranging mutually convenient times is almost impossible but I'd hate for someone to think it was because I thought I was too "posh" for them ( that I thought they are not good enough for me!)

One of the mums in my DS's class is very very keen on play/tea dates and will be quite persistent about it. Last time we tried to get our diaries together we had to book it in three weeks in advance.

CarefullEugene

Are you American?

Why does it bother you? I wouldn't want to be mates with such snooty cows. Sorry!

Do you have your own friendship groups that don't include these women or your child? If so, surely they are more important.

I don't understand this notion that seems to be everywhere that, if you invite a child to your home, then you should expect the same back. Yes, it is nice to think someone would return the gesture, but surely it's not worth upsetting your dds friendships over something so petty? If you give lifts to these children and their parent's don't reciprocate, then simply don't offer lifts anymore.

I'm not friends with all of my dds friend's Mums and Dads. I have nothing in common with 3 of them at all, 1 is a total ignorant space cadet, and I have mates of my own that I am happy with. I don't know where this idea comes from that once our dcs are in school, we must suddenly change our whole social set to mimic our child's?

I am friendly with a few of the Mums and Dads who my dd is in the same year as, but that's purely because if I'd met them outside the playground we'd have gelled anyway. I'd never force myself to befriend people I don't gel with, I'm not ignorant or rude to them don't get me wrong, but they are casual acquaintances I say hi to and that's that!

You are over thinking the tennis playdate thing, if the woman has paid for lessons for her dd, she's not going to cancel if you invite them over is she?

Don't be so worried about being liked by a group of women you call rude and posh!

I can understand how you feel, but you really will need to chill out.

Just wait until she is older, and has Facebook and BBM.

Then girls can boast endlessly about who they are with and what they are doing, with pictures.

Still trying to work out how these mums are 'posh.'

So far, you've one grilling your husband over house prices = vulgar and common.

Another who feeds guest children fish fingers and chips = déclassé and rather lower middle class.

Dump them and find some classy mothers worthy of your energy.

I don't think there's much you can do about it except enjoy the reciprocal friendships and invest less energy in the others. It'll work out, honest. Those girls will grow into mini-Mums and not be your daughter's type anyway.

Well thanks everyone,

• no I am not American (did n't Noel Coward use that question as a passive-aggressive insult?), it's a HalfManHalfBiscuit obscure ref.
• DH & I are fine for adult friends round here, there were a couple of false leads but we've fallen in with a really nice group, generally people who grew up, moved away then moved back to raise a family.
• The parents in question are a bit younger and born, raised and never left. Heirs to local businesses, others treat them with a deference that comes from who their relatives are, local royalty.
• Others seem to be keen to be moving in the 'right' circles.

I just thought it would be natural if kids play a lot together at school to once in a while (once a term, or twice a year) to go round to a friends house to play.

I'm not interested in seeing other peoples toy boxes but DD certainly is.

I think you have a point OP. Some people like to be seen as nice/fair so always reciprocate DCs arrangements.

Some people don't care what others think of them and arrange DCs stuff to suit themselves and ignore 'debts' (and ignore any hurt caused to owed DCs in the process, which is your issue).

The main thing is to take a 'some people are like that ' attitude with DD so that it doesn't become an issue for her. It is bluddy annoying but as someone said above there will be loads of opportunity for her to be excluded when she gets to the facebook age.

Having interests and friends for DD outside school would be good.

Genuine question and no Coward-esque insult intended just that there were a few 'clues' in your prose that led me to believe you were American.

CarefulEugene I'm going to go against the grain here, and say you have my sympathies. My dcs are in what sounds like a similar school environment, and I've come up against similar ishoos.

All I can say is that it doesn't matter what you do, you can't change the way some of the other parents are socially wired. It might not be anything to do with you, and it might, but if they don't want to include you in their (adult and child) friendship circles they won't, so you may as well let it go.

My solution (which isn't perfect) is to continue to invite over the friends my dcs want to see, regardless of reciprocity - so if child 3 has been over already, I don't wait for my dcs to be invited back before inviting again.

One option is to work harder on the 'family friendships' - in other words, put something in the diary (for 3 months time if necessary) for a Saturday afternoon outing with (for example) child 4 and their family So you start to build a wider relationship rather than just your dd and their friend. Or (and I do this regularly, although sometime though gritted teeth) arrange some adult nights out with the other parents. These things can all help.

The other option is to help your dd build up a friendship circle of non-school friends, either through the children of your adult friends, or brownies or other non-school activities, so that she is less dependent on the school crowd.

Either way, good luck.

I think you are way overthinking this, sometimes people say 'let's get the kids together' and then don't, I don't take it personally at all, but because I work and commute a long way, I have less time than I'd like to arrange playdates and so they are more a twice a term thing than regular.

And, very occasionally, we don't reciprocate because perhaps my daughter doesn't like the child quite as much as the child likes her and so rather than say 'my dd doesn't want to come around because your daughter is very bossy and she actually doesn't like her much', we just decline any further invites. It doesn't happen often, and mostly we are just busy, but surely some families or children just don't gel as much as others, and it wouldn't occur to me that two families that spend a lot of time together are actively excluding me.