Baby won't sleep at night, three year dropping nap in the day

[ditziness]

I feel like I haven't slept for over a year now. Had enough. Getting so angry and upset. Atleast I used to be able to vegan hour or so sit down after lunch to feed the baby or optimistically snooze, but now i'm usually just getting an hour swearing at my three old and putting him back in bed while the baby cries. But if the three year old doesn't sleep he's a horrible tired mess by late afternoon, so I need to go out of walk him around in the buggy to fall asleep . Dead on my feet. Or he'll fall asleep around 5 and then not go to bed till 930pm giving me precisely 30 mins off before the baby starts waking up every hour, as she's only doing a two and a half hour stretch from 730-10 these days.

Tonight has been an ordeal, one of those nights you looking at the clock hoping it'll say 6 am for it to be over, and it only says 1 am.

Fed up

Does your toddler have nursery in the afternoon then? Any chance you could swap for a morning session?? So they could go nuts in the morning and be tired in the afternoon ?

Just wanted to say you're doing brilliantly. You have so much on your plate and are coping and surviving. Let this be your standard and don't feel bad about anything! Just do what you need to do. I have a 3yr old who has dropped his nap and a baby too. This is what we do-
Big morning out, baby will generally sleep in buggy, we go to toddler group or park or something.
Sometimes have picnic whilst out- thus avoiding hastle and mess of lunch at home!
Back home- all get in my bed, baby feeds,I snooze, DS watches a film or episodes of something on the laptop.
I have had some health issues and this is the way we get through the day. I find that, although far from ideal, this rest will help us all get to bedtime without too many meltdowns.

If 3 year old wont sleep, while baby is napping after lunch have quiet time and lay on sofa with him to watch gentle dvd - he may sleep if feeling all cozy and you'll get a rest. Make tea time earlier and have earlier bedtime for 3 year old. It will get better I promise.

Mens problem is that they are practical not emotional instantly (flame me other than the odd exception it's true) so if you offload they give you great advice or tell you in all the ways you should be grateful, which you already bloody know so just piles on the guilt, cue getting pissed off, cue big row .

It's taken years for me to realise I need to specify this is a blind support moment not a "help me" moment iyswim.

You'll be ok, you are chugging through a lot more than most people do.

This all sounds so stressful for you! Going to try and separate it out and see if I can offer any opinions on it. I think it's just been so much happening for you, that it wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't so many things at once.

1. I'm sorry about your dad.
2. How long is it until you are hopefully moving out of you PIL's house? Could you try to spend as much time out and about during the day so you aren't having to tidy up so much?
3. What help are you getting from your DH? We have one lie-in day each at the weekend, and I do middle of night wake-ups, he does early mornings and just deals with having to get ready while supervising. He wakes me 20 mins before he leaves the house.
4. DS's naps - can you have quiet time if he doesn't want to nap? Does he have to be in a pram on the way home from nursery? If he is walking or even on a buggy board he will stay awake, just get him home and immediately start the bedtime routine if necessary.
5. What time does DH get home from work? Can't you go to bed then, he can deal with the kids until he goes to bed.

Honestly, the biggest problem IMO is a lack of support. Does your DH know how bad you are feeling?

i am a bit proud i think, i don't like asking my inlaws for help, i feel like i'm putting on them enough. My FIL works from home and is busy most of the time. and my MIL doesn't keep well. She's been in bed for the last week. I feel bad for wearing her out just by being here. She does cuddle the baby sometimes if i need to do something with ds.

and i don't like putting the telly on. I know it's not evil, and I wouldn't be so daft as to ban it completely or judge anyone else for doing it. But I don't think wee babies should watch television, and if ds is watching it so is dd. cbeebies also completely drives me mad. i'd rather go for walk.

sigh... thank you for the plenty or sage advice, shall digest and think on. keep it coming. and most of all thanks for listening and empathy x

TV saved me when 3 year old dropped his nap forever on the day DS2 arrived. Make DVDs your best friend and feel no guilt. I was bonkers with sleep deprivation for a year. Still makes me cry just thinking about it. It is hideous and you get so tired you can't work out what you need to feel better. Ask anyone and everyone you can get your hands on for help. Be shameless. Even a micro nap will help.

Good luck, you're doing great and it will get better.

Didn't want to read and run, no advice as such but I can sympathise my DS dropped his daytime nap at 15months old! I thought I was going insane, my DH is in the navy so I didn't really get a break from the parenting (still don't!) and that 90 minutes was my respite and my insurance that he would sleep well at night so I did mourn a little when I lost that.
All I can say is if you need a rant this is a good place for it and your DH wbvu

yes the tiredness is horrible, it doesn't even feel like i'm tired, It feels like I'm on drugs, a horrid angry wired feeling that makes my bones hurt.

i must admit youve all inspired me to put 6 episodes of charlie and lola on back to back. we were at the park, but it's raining. and we're an hour away from where we live, rurally without public transport and i don't drive. If I was at home I would have gone to a playgroup or met up with a friend. but literally nothing but the park here.

DS goes to nursery two full days a week, and dh takes him in ( an hour away). Cause we're away from our home town he can't go to local preschool until we manage to buy this house and move back in the new year.

But there are puddles to jump in, bugs to hunt for, birds to find, trees with fruit/nuts/autumn leaves to chuck sticks at. Don't underestimate how long a 3 year old can throw a stick at a tree for, that was DD1s afternoon when I was stuck at parents arseendofnowhere the other week, while I sat on a rug and rocked baby. Just tog up warm and set them free.

As for TV having it on as background drives me nuts but when it's a film like toy story or monsters inc for a set amount of time it doesn't bother me so much, after all adults do that for entertainment iyswim.

i'm sorry, but you're preaching to the converted. I know you can be outside in the rain. I just didn't want to be wet and cold too when I'm so tired I feel ill.

DS has been up since 5am. and has been refusing to nap since 1pm. If I go and lie with him he pinches me and headbuts the baby. i hate him just now. i'm crying and pleading with him and he laughs in my face.

If he's got that much energy he's not going to sleep... why not try doing the opposite and do something high energy to tire him out instead? For example get a balloon and have a game to see how longhe can keep it in the air for before it hits the ground, set him a task to find things (4 brown things, 6 round things whatever else) ... that sort of thing. Of course when you're exhausted its not fun for you but at least it might stop him being bored and spiteful... just ideas really.

Ooh I remember I t well. My baby would wake in the night and just as I got him back down my 3 yr old would wake up for the day. Every time I fed or changed the baby 3 yr old would jump all over me. Put baby down for nap, no time to rest, 3 yr old would want my attention. It was like wading through treacle. It will pass. You've had a horrid year but it will get better. You might have to go into acceptance mode for a bit.

acceptance mode. word. had to bundle them both into buggy. little shit fell asleep within 5 minutes, now i'm sitting on a wall in the rain feeding baby. joy

Oh poor you :(
Handing you a virtual for what it's worth.

Hope your day gets better from here.