How much childcare/housework is reasonable to expect a SAH parent to do?

[addendumm]

Am getting really annoyed with DH who SAH and looks after DS 4 days a week while I work. He doesnt have a job at the moment.

How much housework is reasonable to get done during the day with a 1 year old who naps for 2 hours?

When the working parent is home how much time should they reasonably be expected to care for the child while the SAH parent has a break?

I would be interested to hear how others divide these responsibilities so I can work out if Im being unreasonable.

[Chocolatephiladelphia]

I would expect him to do everything.
If one of you works then the SAH parent should do it all.

[poorchurchmouse]

I don't think your problem is really the housework, it's your DH's expectation that all your time at home is leisure time for him. I really think you need to reassess how things are working: you said you wouldn't want to put your DC in nursery, but it really doesn't sound as though he actually likes being at home. I don't know if he might be depressed or if he's just a lazy sod with an over-developed sense of entitlement - that's your call. But that he thinks this is fair is a serious problem.

For what it's worth, my DH is a SAHD and doesn't do a huge amount of housework, although he does do the laundry and clears up the mess DS makes as the day goes on. We also have a cleaner. I work FT and I'm not often home in time for bath and bed. But when we"re both here we're a team, and either we're all out and about together or one of us is looking after DS and the other is getting stuff done.

[NotGoodNotBad]

"My Ex partner was unhappy with my views on this. He came from a very 'traditional' family, SAHM doing everything and being a martyr, WOHD doing just his paid work hours and NOTHING else."

For anyone with a partner like this, how about you work only during the same work hours as your partner has? (If you can clean etc. during that time, then fine, if not, it doesn't get done). If you can get the food shopping done fine, if not you'll run out of food. When partner knocks off, so do you.

They will soon realise in the evenings they rarely get to eat, washing up hardly happens, no-one puts the kid(s) to bed, plays with them or reads them stories, and at weekends you will all starve.

[janey68]

Why on earth would you partner anyone with these views in the first place??

What happens in these relationships before children come along? Does the woman facilitate inequality by doing a greater share of the home stuff before children? Does she automatically assume her career is the 'lesser' one and therefore she should do more in the home? Does she see herself stopping work after children as the default position?

Because tbh people don't change personality overnight. It takes two to make a relationship and if you set up home with someone who doesn't see you as an equal then why complain about it a few years down the line?

[Arisbottle]

I only did more in the home whilst at home with the children. During term time we share the chores, in fact DH may do more than me as unless he is working away he has more free time than me.

[addendumm]

Lots of interesting points to think about.

I hadn't thought about it if the roles were reversed, but yes when I was on maternity leave and dh was working I did do most things. I don't find housework hard to do and like living in a tidy place. I used to prepare dinner during ds nap and stick it in the oven to cook while doing bedtime routine.

I found it easy to do which is why I posted and wanted to find out if that was reasonable to expect other sahp to do.

Dh did help out with any extra cleaning though once ds was in bed and used to take ds out for a few hours on Saturday and Sunday so I could get a break. Something that never happens now because he has him all week and wants to have a break away from him. So yes I am doing a lot more now which is why I am so so tired.

Interestingly though, looking back I wouldnt have been one of the sahm who said that dh helped out 50:50 while he was at work!

I don't think housework comes easily to dh and he is lazy when it comes to doing it without me helping. He also lets things build up to a state where you do need to spend a bit of time cleaning, instead of just washing up and wiping down surfaces as you go.

When I first went back to work he did do a lot more around the house during the day, but he found it hard looking after ds and things started to slide. I took up the slack as I knew he was finding things difficult and the situation slowly got worse and worse.

I never intend on being his boss, just as he is never the boss of me.

I just told him that I'm pissed at never having any free time and having to also do the basic chores that should be done during the day like wash up after breakfast and lunch, wipe down the kitchen, do some laundry, tidy up the toys they have had out. Also that he is not being considerate in regards to not fixing something for my dinner when I don't get a chance as I'm looking after ds from the moment I get in from work till when I go to bed.

He is not happy being at home but it is mainly his decision for us to have ds at home and not in childcare so I have made it clear that it is therefore even more important for him to help out. I pointed out that it would actually be easier for me to have him back at work as well, ds in childcare and a cleaner come every week.

We have decided to see how the next few weeks go, but have a longer term view of getting pregnant, dh finding a job while I'm on maternity leave and then me resigning from work for a couple of years and being the sahp. He does admit that he never realised how challenging being a sahp was though so I think he will be more supportive when we do reverse roles again.

We have come to an agreement of basic chores to do during the day and those that can be done together in the evenings. Also a list of simple recipes can he can prepare for dinner before he has his free time in the evenings.

As far as sorting out some time for me to have a break without ds, we haven't come to any decisions. I am a bit unsure of this as I love being with ds and don't mind looking after him all the time when I'm not at work. It was only becoming unbearable because I had no free time and had to deal with work, a messy house and doing all the housework in the evenings. So I'll see how I feel in a couple of weeks, see how things have improved or not.

[addendumm]

Sorry-Interestingly though, looking back I would have been one of the sahms who said that dh helped out 50:50 while he was at work!

[addendumm]

Sorry again-Interestingly though, looking back I would have been one of the sahms who said that dh helped out 50:50 while he was not at work! (Am tired, going now)

[AThingInYourLife]

"Athing - I'm baffled as to how any arrangements in your life work. How did you decide to be a SAHM? did you consult with your partner about that at all? or just announce that's what you were doing? "

I'm not a SAHM, I'm on maternity leave. Although it is not decided when I will be going back to work.

DH and I discuss all our plans as we make them. I would never expect another adult to support me financially without their agreement. I'm baffled as to why you might imagine I would be so irresponsible?

I might be a terrible housekeeper, but I am a passable mother and a good wife.

"ps I am very amused by the definition of a domestic goddess being someone who can load a dishwasher and keep their toddler away from knives."

:o you get that I was joking, right?

You forgot the "one handed" bit. Tips for safely loading a dishwasher with one hand while carrying a baby who can't be put down with the other and in the company of a toddler desperate for attention who likes to climb into the dishwasher gratefully received. Putting baby down and turning attention elsewhere fraught with risks to baby from jealous toddler.

Is it really so terrible if I load the dishwasher once baby and toddler are in bed and DH is chilling with DD1? Really? It takes a tenth of the time and is a hundredth less bothersome.

Surely I can do my half of the work as and when it suits me?

Unless there is some requirement that the house be perfect when the big boss man comes in?

"I don't think your problem is really the housework, it's your DH's expectation that all your time at home is leisure time for him."

Precisely, poorchurchmouse.

"Because tbh people don't change personality overnight. It takes two to make a relationship and if you set up home with someone who doesn't see you as an equal then why complain about it a few years down the line?"



First of all, it is not unusual for men who have seemed all modern to turn into chauvinists when children come along. Women using their maternity leave to be good little housewives sets up a really unhealthy dynamic where a man had even the slightest tendency to lazy entitlement.

Second of all, are you really saying that if your partner treats you badly it's your own fault for marrying them? Nice!

[poorchurchmouse]

Don't get pregnant again until you're absolutely sure this is sorted and isn't going to happen again. If things carry on as they are you're heading for divorce, and as someone said upthread your DH would probably get the children.

And regardless of the practical considerations I wouldn't be having another baby with someone who thought the house was my job and thought it was fine for me to put the baby to bed while he sat about and did sod-all about dinner or housework. I wouldn't want to have sex with someone who treated me like that so the problem wouldn't arise.

[poorchurchmouse]

And don't even think about being a SAHP if it's mainly your DH who thinks one of you ought to be at home with the children. That way madness lies.

[AThingInYourLife]

Sage advice, poorchurchmouse

I would also want to be convinced of a complete change if heart regarding his expectations of leaving childcare and housework to the woman before I gave up work to become a SAHM with him being the wage earner.

If he's this lazy when he's the SAHP, I dread to think how bad he would be when he was the one putting a roof over your heads.

[HandbagCrab]

Op I wouldn't be giving up my job if I were you. Also, if the balance isn't right a year after having the first child. I can't see how having more children would make things easier.

It's not ok for you to never get a break. I love being with ds but I still need a break. It's amazing how much clarity you can get when you can think without having to think about your baby at the same time.

Wouldn't it be better to have ds with a good nursery/ childminder/ nanny than with dad (or mum) who doesn't enjoy childcare and is struggling to cope with it full time? Why does your dh think this is the best decision for childcare when it's making you both unhappy?

[janey68]

Good, OP, I'm glad you are seeing that he is behaving ridiculously as a SAHP In leaving breakfast and lunch dishes, not even wiping down or picking up toys. These are the sort of things you do as you go along when you're at home- millions of people manage it with multiple kids- and you only have one right?

I'm interested in your comment that he seems to have had the major influence in deciding he doesn't want to use childcare, while not actually being very happy as a Sahp. You need to challenge him on this. He can't make a unilateral decision about staying home. You would be quite happy using childcare and the both of you working. This is a set up which suits many parents and is a good one in that it provides balance for both- getting out to work and using those skills while having equal responsibility in the home. You need to talk long and hard before simply reversing roles and finding he's still not behaving reasonably. Staying home doesn't suit everyone- it's not so much that it's difficult, but it can be isolating and frustrating and tbh does involve a lot of routine. It's not everyones cup of tea, so I wouldn't blame him for feeling like that but what IS unfair is to be a SAHP and not pull his weight

[AbigailAdams]

Agree with poorchurchmouse and Athinginyourlife. A SAHP's focus is the children and although that involves a certain amount of housework, how much gets done during the day can vary depending on how the day pans out. I am sure that if addendumm's DH were pulling his weight the rest of the time when she was at home then how much he got done during the day wouldn't be an issue.

He seems to be getting lots and lots of downtime, she, not so much.

Well done for tackling this addendumm. The fact that you have to though rings warning bells for me about how he actually views housework and childcare as being women's work.

[shushpenfold]

When I was a SAHM I did everything in the week - cleaning, washing, admin...you name it. My dh helped with the kids on his day off (he only had one!) but did nothing else as he was working....I thought that was a fair deal. Essentially, he worked damn hard and so did I (3 under 4 1/2) Now that I'm back at work, we split things more evenly but also have a cleaner who also irons.....she's a life saver.

[janey68]

I don't think anyone is disputing that a SAHP's primary focus is the children. We're simply pointing out that in 2012, carrying out the basic daily tasks involved in running a house are easily compatible with caring for the children. Whereas if you are physically miles away in an office in paid employment, they aren't.

Let's be honest here. If doing a daily wash meant scrubbing everything by hand, putting it through a mangle etc then yes, it's time consuming. Even in my mums day, with a twin tub washer, it was a bigger deal than now - heating up the water, transferring clothes into a spin dryer etc. These days it means putting clothes in the machine and switching a button. And the other things the OPs husband is failing to do- wiping down surfaces, well, if you are preparing breakfast and lunch for the child, which you are surely doing as the SAHP, then you can certainly wipe down the counter aftwrwards! Clearing away toys... Isn't that something you do with the child? If you have time to get stuff out and play with it then you can also clear it away... You just make it part of the 'game' and the daily routine.

It shows a total lack of respect for the working partner to just leave all this and expect them to do it as they walk in the door, when it can be done easily during the day without negatively impacting on "quality" time with the children.

[AThingInYourLife]

"These days it means putting clothes in the machine and switching a button."



Of course it does.

The exact right amount of the right clothes in the right colours is always just sitting right by the washing machine.

What is it with some people that they think there is only one way to do anything, and it's their way?

[Arisbottle]

It is much easier if you have separate baskets for whites, darks and delicates. Sorting laundry isn't that hard . It is lifting bits of cloth. My children used to love helping me sort the laundry.

[janey68]

Oops yes I forgot to mention the task of separating whites from coloureds and putting powder in the machine. Like you arisbottle, I used to Make sorting the washing into a game with the kids when they were small. Children can be involved in this sort of thing and it teaches them all sorts of sorting and matching skills, which IMO is a positive thing anyway

[HandbagCrab]

All everyday washing in my house goes in on same cycle, same washing tab, same fabric conditioner. I buy clothes that wash at 40 and aren't pale. I don't spend fortunes on clothes that are dry clean only or require ironing. I approach housework from the point of view of 'what is the least we can get away with'. It does require forward planning in the sense it effects the clothes I buy and occasionally something gets ruined (a white primark tea towel this week).

Similarly I buy kitchen stuff that is dishwasher safe, multiuse cleaning products, family toiletries, dinners that are easy to cook.

However, I can only do this because I have the support and partnership of my dh. If he never washed a bottle, put a plate in the dishwasher or washed his pants, I would feel like a put upon skivvy however much I streamlined the house stuff.

[jellybeans]

My DC5 is so hyperactive that I get little done, bit better now he is a little older but even so. However since i have been SAHM I do most the housework. DH does garden (he loves it), most of big DIY (i do half decorating) and the odd bit of ironing. When he is off he does half the childcare. He has them all while I am studying or at uni tutorials.

I would say with a little one who is not at nursery it IS hard to get stuff done. Sometimes you just want a break when they are asleep. But when they are at playgroup etc there should be time for at least the washing and bathroom cleaning etc. Either that or he could do hat when you get home. I quite often do chores while DH has the DC in the evening/weekend.

[AThingInYourLife]

Ah, I remember the halcyon days with DD1 who loved a good sort of the washing.

How different from DD2 who will not "help" except to turn the washing machine off every time I turn it on.

It's weird that not all children are the same. I really must send DD2 back for being defective.

"It is much easier if you have separate baskets for whites, darks and delicates."

You can't seriously be suggesting that I pass the work of sorting dirty laundry on to the person with the "responsibility for paid work" by asking him to put it in the right basket?

:o

There is a right time for doing laundry, and it is when you have small children to look after.

Doing it when they are in bed or there is someone else around to look after them is wrong.

It's 2012 now, and the new modern way is that women whoever does the childcare must also do the housework, because it's no trouble for them but massively difficult for people who have jobs.

Yes, yes, I know that the new modern way looks a lot like the old sexist way. But it's not. Because of self esteem.

[janey68]

Dear me you seem to be over thinking this. Surprisingly my children are all different to eachother too but I still managed to get the washing done!
You seem to be transferring a lot of your own ishoos onto the ops situation here...

[janey68]

And btw these jobs aren't massively difficult for people with jobs as us WHOP manage to do them all too. It's just that if one partner isn't working its so much more practical for them to do it