To not buy a poppy

[Hippymum89]

Why is it more important to remember the death of a soldier who died fighting for the country (or so he believed) than the death of every other person who has died?
What about all the others who have died helping others? Were their lives less important? Or the little old lady who died in hospital at the age of 97, she didn't kill any Germans, or rescue people. She lived her life, but doesn't that count?
I think poppys glorify war and therefore murder, so I will not be buying one.

I agree with you LtEve and as I said I take no issue with it (why would I?) but some of the posts on here make me a little uncomfortable. They are romanticising every British soldier who ever fought IMO. And quite frankly, some of them don't deserve it!

Stelmos post makes me very sad. If that's the kind of Soldier we have out there representing our country, no wonder some countries really hate us.

I agree with Waltermittymissus. I usually wear a poppy. I don't really agree with war but I do think it is right to show respect to those who have lost their lives in the armed forces. Also accept that, depending on what 'side' you're on views of particular actions will differ. I am put off wearing a poppy by the fact it now seems to be a requirement and no-one is allowed to question it. People should always be allowed to respectfully question things or give their opinion.

StElmos boyfriend is ONE soldier out of 250,000.

I am another.

Don't choose to judge the whole British Army by the voice of one.

I have no issue with risking my own life to defend your right to free speech, even if your beliefs and politics are not the same as mine. Difference is what makes democracy. If you have no desire to wear a poppy then that is your business. I do however object to having to put up with personal insults and vilification because of it. I fail to see why, when you hold an opinion that you know is likely to be offensive to a large number of people, many of whom have endured a great deal of personal sacrifice that you know very little about, you want to use that opinion as a basis to pick a fight deliberately.

Some of us have to fight in areas where we are not protected by the anonymity of a computer, and not do it from the comfort of an armchair. Pop down to the Cenotaph on Sunday, say what you've just said now, and see how brave you feel then.

Feminine/Ethel, you are both right. 3 days into the evacuation the Germans bombed Guernsey harbour and the evacuation stopped. No-one is sure as to how many more islanders would have wanted to leave.

Well said squirrel

Wish there was a round of applause emoticon!

I am put off wearing a poppy by the fact it now seems to be a requirement and no-one is allowed to question it. People should always be allowed to respectfully question things or give their opinion.

Exactly. That's why I stopped wearing them. My freedom is better displayed by not wearing one rather than pandying to silly bullies tbh.

Virginia - quite. All such rhetoric does is obscure the real issues.

The Afghanistan invasion was to protect Afghan women - hahaha!

And yet that solider seems to honestly believe that, hence my point about young men (and women) being used as fodder to serve political interests.

Also Vietnam vets weren't treated badly because of moral unease at the war, but because they were seen as having "lost" and therefore as an embarrassment, such feelings coming from thwarted jingoism rather then anti-war sentiment.

I buy a poppy but never wear it. But then I don't wear the wristbands/ribbons/sticky badges of other charities either.

Your opinions are extreme and not exactly respectful Ethel.

Though i do agree with The overall sentiment I haven't seen personally a person come on this thread with a well put comment in why it's not for them getting jumped on. Just provocative ones.

Which is probably just what they are after so no big deal.

but squirrel, why should soldiers be exempt from other people's views of them? No other groups are on MN.

They aren't. Clearly.

BUT, just as I refuse to allow the BNP to misappropriate the British Flag for their own means, I refuse to allow a bunch of twats to put me off wearing a poppy.

Love this ^^

Wear a poppy, don't wear a poppy, the choice is yours. I'm not British, though I used to wear a poppy when I lived in England. It was a way to remember the terrible loss of life that war brings and also a hope that there won't be any more wars.

However, I must admit I am really uncomfortable with the oft repeated lines about soldiers who died "for our freedom" and the like. The poor sods who died in the trenches in WWI (the original inspiration for the poppy appeal) didn't do a thing to advance the cause of freedom. They died in a brutal, senseless, entirely avoidable war. They might have believed the rhetoric they were fed, but that doesn't make it true.

You could make the case that WWII was a fight for freedom, and given the historical circumstances, I do think it was a war that had to be fought. However, you could also argue that WWII occurred as a result of WWI and the terms of the peace. So without the first war, we might have been able to avoid the devastation and loss of the second world war.

As for the wars of the past decade, once again I do not believe for one moment that the soldiers who died were protecting my right to voice my opinion or anything like that. That doesn't mean we should forget them. Of course not. We should remember them and mourn their loss and do everything in our power to keep other soldiers (and civilians) safe from the horrors of war. But let's do it without the overblown and (IMO) inaccurate rhetoric about freedom.

It's not an extreme view.

It is quite compatible with modern mainstream Christianity. No, not all Christians agree with me, but ultimatly many Christians view the sanctitiy of life as an important thing and therfore war as an abomination.

Ethel, as I said, I have no issue with people having opinions. What I object to is personal attacks, which all groups are protected from on MN. It's a question of being reasonable; if for example I came up on an abortion thread and called someone a murderer, I'd probably be flamed. Why should you not be flamed for calling a soldier a murderer?

Lt Eve - you're one of 250,000 soldiers? You're not in the British Army then.

@squirrels tbh I am shocked that the military are so thin skinned. Its as though the notion that taking a job that involves killing people might not be everyones cup of tea is a surprise to many people on this thread. I honestly wasn't trying to upset or provoke. I'm sorry if people misunderstood. But I really do think perhaps I was showing people a few home truths which is why they reacted so badly. And I am genuinly quite surprised by that. I thought people might have a few more intelligent rebukes than just suggesting I "don't understand".

I don't think viewing abortion as murder is an 'extreme' view either actually. It's a valid opinion, even if it is a minority view.

I watched a Tv programme last night about the trenches in WW1 which is what rememebrence day is all about well it is how it all started and from that day till now men and women are dying as a result of war and conflict and I will wear a poppy and respect the silence YABU to think it is murder you have no idea YANBU to not wear a poppy nobody forces you

@squirrels tbh I am shocked that the military are so thin skinned.

The Armed Forces are human

Surely it is not about when we were last invaded, but about all the attempted invasions we have repelled and would have happened had we not had armed forces. The Battle of Britain is exactly that. It was fought over the skies of Britain by very young Brits, Poles, Canadians, French, Rhodesians, South Africans, Malawians, Americans, Czechs, Australians, New Zealanders, Irish, and so many more I have forgotten, because they believed it was their duty. And because Nazi Germany wanted to weaken British resolve and attempt a serious invasion - a tactic they had used across Europe to real effect. I do not believe civilians in the streets with pitchforks and axes would have been sufficient, although they played a role in so many ways.

The poppy does not glorify war. It is a symbol of remembrance

Ethel - yes, some of us have feelings. Would you prefer us all to be cold-hearted killing machines? :)