To not buy a poppy

[Hippymum89]

Why is it more important to remember the death of a soldier who died fighting for the country (or so he believed) than the death of every other person who has died?
What about all the others who have died helping others? Were their lives less important? Or the little old lady who died in hospital at the age of 97, she didn't kill any Germans, or rescue people. She lived her life, but doesn't that count?
I think poppys glorify war and therefore murder, so I will not be buying one.

But Mordion i am genuinely asking what education it funds exactly. I do not find their website clear. The only thing on there that is clear to me is their political stance.

I am asking for you to tell me about their educational work - you have asked Mumsnet to continue to add your views about White Poppy/PPU.

I asked and you couldn't be bothered to answer.

You know the saying 'ignorance is bliss', there are a few 'blissful' people on this thread.

My grandfather died in WWI, fighting in the trenches in France. Without him and all the other hundreds of thousands of young men who went to war, many of whom lost their lives, we would all be part of a German Empire today, singing not God Save the Queen but Deutschland Uber Alles and of course, speaking German. Nor would you be on the internet spouting such shit.

If you don't want to buy a poppy, don't buy one

Remembrance is not the sole preserve of the Haig Fund

It hasn't been the Haig Fund for years, do keep up.

Yes I believe it is a gimick and disrespectful to wear a white poppy, on its own, on Remembrance Day - PPU have 364 other days in which they could fund raise for their own pockets, why pick the one day a year set aside solely to remember the war dead?

The Red Poppy is not Political. It is for Remembrance, nothing more, nothing less.

This is where i am confused about the White Poppy - their website clearly states political aims and objectives.

The Red Poppy Appeal has charitable aims.

So i do not understand the significance of wearing a white poppy on Remembrance day when that is what a Red Poppy is for.

@Tess I don't believe I said that. I personally prefer the unambiguous message of the PPU which has not been hijacked by a variety of different sometimes competing philosophical, political and nationalistic viewpoints and motivations. I prefer the unambiguous remember the fallen and their sacrifice but strive to your utmost to find a better way going forward message.

As did my father. Who was actually IN WW2.

I also believe that everyone should have the choice to wear a poppy of whatever colour they wish and not be criticised for it. This is the sort of thing that was important to my dad.

I believe in live and let live. My great-uncle, who through no choice of his own fought in the second world war and contracted diabetes after being a POW would just have felt sorry for someone who is so lacking in intellect.
Remembrance -

The Red Poppy is not Political.

I disagree. Remembering war is a political statment. Supporting charity is a political statement. It may be a majority political view and ideology, but it is a political statement.

To me my poppy does not glorify war it reminds me of its horrors.
Mine is not in remembrance of those who died, but of my Grandfather and my Great aunt who's lives WW1 changed forever.

I'm not a pacifist and I believe that conflict is an inevitable part of human nature.

We should not like it and should do all we can to encourage understanding and tolerance, but young men and women will continue to risk their lives to protect the society we live in.

We should support them, do all we can if they are injured and help their bereaved dependants.

Mordion - I'm not saying you said that, I was simply asking you.

Out of the white poppy wearers I have encountered over the years, some of them have thought the red poppy glorifies war, and that anyone who wears a red poppy does to. The others obviously didn't.

I agree that everyone should have the choice to wear what colour poppy they want, but I object to the image that some non-red poppy wearers try to paint of the RBL fund. Anyone who thinks that the RBL is there to support war, needs to be educated.

My RBL area's County Chairman said at our AGM this year:

"While I am proud to serve the British Legion, and get to be involved in supporting our veterans and troops when no-one else will, I like to think there'll be a day the RBL won't be needed, because I dream of a time when there is no war."

Needless he got a standing ovation after that point from everyone in the room; veterans, currently serving soldiers and members with no forces affiliation at all. The latter is what I fit into.

The Royal British Legion is a charity & one of its biggest fund-raisers is the annual red poppy appeal. When you donate to the RBL at this time of year, it is very likely you will be given a poppy.

The poppy is worn as a sign of rememberance for all those who died in wars. Wars are usually started by politicians, but they are fought by ordinary people. Those ordinary people make sacrifices on behalf of all of the rest of us & it is those who were killed, maimed or bereaved that we remember on 11th November & also helping by donating to RBL.

Hippymum89 We live in a free society & no one is going to force you remember - but I am glad we do and I will be remembering. If ever you get the chance to read about the conditions of those who fought, particularly in the First World War (where they had no choice because of conscription) - please do. It is humbling & heart-wrenching.

Bloody oath! Who do we think is in favour of wars, it's certainly not individuals who may join the services.
People don't start war governments start wars

@Tess I think that possibly some people who wear the red poppy do glorify militarism, if not war itself. There are so many political issues intrinsically linked with defence spending, for example. And the Big Brother/newspeak agenda promoted by the Red Poppy militants - at times evident in this thread - is another example of this. But I also think that the vast majority of people in this thread and people in the UK wear a poppy to remember the dead and be humble when considering their sacrifice. Which is what I also do through wearing my White Poppy. If someone is not a pacifist then the White Poppy might not be for them. For people who do abhor war and consciously believe in pacifism (as opposed to not glorifying war but not necessarily supporting pacifism - taking each case on its merits, which is what I believe is the position of most Red Poppy wearers, just not the ones who shout loudest) then I can see why they wear the Red Poppy and I have no problem with that. But it is clearly a political symbol now, as it was when it was first created. Political symbols aren't necessarily bad but linking them with remembrance is, I feel. The White Poppy has two clear and well defined aims - remembrance, and an appeal to end all war and militarism. Thus, I wear the White Poppy.

These days, people choose to join the armed forces. They join knowing the risks, but do so anyway. Why should they receive any kind of handout for killing people? YANBU. I won't ever buy a poppy. I pay taxes. Let the government fund their rehab. After all, they were following government orders. And the Royal British Legion has thousands of paid workers and a board of paid directors. They aren't all volunteers. Sentimental claptrap.

lovelyladuree

Appalling

Don't buy one then

I donate to the appeal

I wear a white poppy

The REASON being it belonged to me beloved Grandfather - a D-Day veteran who believed in peace and humanity

lovelyladuree

Your attitude is disgusting.

YANBU and spouting utter bloody rubbish.

And lovely Wiley's right, what an appalling post.

I wear my poppy in honour of my grandad who was a prisoner of war in Chungkai, Burma and suffered the most awful cruelty which haunted him for the rest of jis life.

Because of people like my grandad and other the brave men and women like him idiots like you enjoy the freedom you do now.

I am attending a Veterans Day event at my ds's school today, and I will be proud to see my husband honored for his service - even if it was in the British Army. I will be wearing my poppy, which you do not see that much in the US, but people always notice and appreciate. I will be thinking about how hard it has been for dh to come to terms with some of the things he experienced, and that only other veterans can truly understand - I can only try and empathize. I will be thinking about all the veterans, living and dead, and quietly thanking them for everything they did. To me, it will not be a political statement, but simply a thank you.

lovelyladuree - I have a theory about people like you.

You slag off our forces, yet if we didn't have them and we got invaded, it's people like you who would be the first to wail and moan about the fact we don't have armed forces.

I often wonder why the soldiers do volunteer to serve, when they have continue to protect the freedom of people like you.

Oh and also lovelyladuree, yes the RBL does have paid workers, as there needs to be people who:

• Manage the funds.
• Organise respite care.
• Arrange/provide counselling and support for ex-members of the forces, so they can cope with life in 'civvy street'.
• Advise veterans and soldiers on legal matters.

And so on, so forth.

Those of us who volunteer for the RBL put a few hours in here and there, the people who WORK for the RBL put in regular working hours, and thus are paid for that.

You wouldn't work for free would you?!

lovelyladuree - last time I looked the armed forces do a lot more than simply kill people. They also defend, peace keep, rebuild and train.

Would you rather we had no armed forces and took our chances that, should a hostile power ever cast its eyes over our shores, we could defend ourselves by chucking our mobile phones and handbags at them?

You slag off our forces, yet if we didn't have them and we got invaded, it's people like you who would be the first to wail and moan about the fact we don't have armed forces.

Who's going to invade you? And aren't the majority of the armed forces overseas anyway?
And don't you think civilians might rise up against this mythical invading army?

Aw lovely - where did your compassion go?

Do you really think that young men & women (most of them still teenagers) really understand what they are signing up for? How can they possibly get their young, immature minds around what it might be like to live with a limb missing or acutely severe PTSD, let alone death?

I know I am not brave enough to face dying for my country, so I am profoundly, deeply grateful that there are others prepared to do that for me.

When we live in a world where the threat of war has disappeared and all the veterans of war have died - then I'm prepared to consider that remembering those who've died & those who have suffered is sentimental claptrap. Until then, it is a really ignorant & ungrateful thing to say.

I think YANBU, OP.

I think you don't have to buy a poppy if you don't want to, because you live in a free country. You don't have to wear symbols on your clothes that you dislike. You can hold your opinions and they can differ from mine.

Unlike my relatives who lived in Germany and during the period leading up to WW2, actually DID have to wear a symbol on their clothing by state law. It was a yellow star to show they were Jews and should be denied rights. It was easier to discriminate against them and eventually kill them if they were helpfully identified by a symbol.

For me, a poppy is a symbol of terrible loss of life and the horrors of war. I am fervently anti-war but pro-education so I think it's useful for myself and others to be reminded about war and its consequences.

But because we are lucky enough to live in the UK in this day and age, where my husband and sons will not be conscripted, I can also feel that everyone else has the right to feel differently.

As the saying goes "I disagree with what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it". So neither the OP or anyone else who doesn't like poppies has to wear them. But those who wish to, can. That's why we are lucky to live in the UK.