To be proud of DS over this (warning, naughty parent/Operation CHristmas CHild-related)

[SolidGoldYESBROKEMYSPACEBAR]

Ds is 8 and his school will persist in the poxy Samaritans' Purse appeal though I have written and complained at least twice (if you don't already know, it's a racist rightwing evangelical organisation, culturally insensitive, despised by most aid charities and a waste of resources.). I have never contributed to it and never will, and have explained to DS that it's a bad organisation run by bad people, and that good people (like those at his school) don't always understand that sometimes bad people pretend to be good...

Anyway, today, according to DS, one of the teachers asked the DC to guess how many shoeboxes they were going to get this year/how many they hoped for. DS raised his hand and said...... 'ZERO'

That's m'boooy!

Oh for goodness sake.... Try doing something positive instead of pouring cold water over a charity that millions benefit from!

If you are happy with bibles being given out at gunpoint then go ahead and contribute.

There are some others that do them. Some even do shoeboxes all year round.

Really interesting reading - thanks all for the links.

There's always wateraid to donate too as well - get the basics in place like sanitary drinking water - then after that spend money on something higher up the list of needed things for a person's happiness. No matter who you are - not spending your childhood dehydrating from dysentry is going to be better than playing with a plastic yoyo.

For those that want credentials... I have worked MANY Christmas Days in shelters and with young homeless people and I am an atheist who regularly gives money to charities.

This appeal is a waste of time and effort at best and nasty religious extremism at worst. I do think that children everywhere deserve a gift, something fun, something frivolous even when they need water and food. They are children and need to play. However, it should be given freely and without evangelising. And, a Kenyan Christian is going to feel very differently than a Muslim about Christian literature obviously.

I don't actually think DS was being cheeky. He was being truthful. And it's no more wrong of me to tell him what I think than it is for any parents who are dim enough to take religion seriously religions to tell their DC that the parents' beliefs are true and encourage the DC to share them.

Nobody said it was wrong to tell him what you think.

Kind of like Soupers and blockaded West Berliners, a tiny bit.

Wasn't there an MNetter living in Romania once who was slightly bemused to find that her son's private nursery had been the recipient of these boxes one year?

What a pity, it really is a lovely idea.

twice on this thread it has beed said that children only receive their gift after sitting through a lecture and having to recite a sinners prayer.

That is not true

I have posted several times over the years on OCC.
I used to live in Kazahstan where the boxes are distributed. OCC uses local churches to distribute the boxes. The churches are free to choose how they do this. The churches are local churches, not American churches. Each churhc is different, but I have seen them given out purely as a gift, house to house to every child with a smile. Given out at a christmas party, with fun, games and loads of food and bags of sweets to take home. There is story time where the christmas story is told. there is not usually any criticism of other faiths or a 'sinners prayer'. I have seen them taken to an orphanage and given out to the children
None of the boxes I saw actually had any literature in them at all. (I think that may be at the discretion of the church)
The boxes were often given to all children, regardless of poverty levels (and many receiving them where i was weren't really poor)

I have mixed feelings about them, and each year I am not sure whether or not to do it, but I do feel we need accurate information, to decide and not wild accusations

A couple of years ago, was there a Mumsnetter who lived 'overseas' whose children came home from the local school one day having been given these.

steppemum I thought Kazahstan was mainly Muslim. If the boxes are given to Churches, what happens to the Muslim children? Do they get anything? Is the 'Christmas story' appropriate for them?

I'm another who has explained again to the school why no, I will NOT be paying money, and providing tat to bribe poor children into 'becoming God's child ...and telling my friends." Whilst making the Grahams yet richer.

In addition to the above points, other things I abhor about the org are:

• it talks of HIV and AIDS education... yet preaches AGAINST CONDOMS
• it talks of creationism - clearly a dangerous crock of shite
• and of Adam and Eve. Ref reason for Eve's existence: "I will make a partner who will help him". I'm really against the ideology of women as helpmeets, and especially so in desperately poor areas, where educating and empowering women is such a clear indicator of future 'success'.

MrsTerryPratchett and others - the booklet is Bible 101. It's explicitly Christian, and is totally inappropriate for anyone of any other faith. Also, they cannot spell 'pacience'.

link here

Bad spelling . YANBU.

hazel - that booklet wasn't in the boxes that were distributed where I was. Actually I think it may have been against the law to distribute a leaflet like that there.
Mrs Terry Pratchet - Kazkahstan is about 50% muslim. The churches that take the boxes door to door, give them to eveyr child regardless of faith. As a gift.
The ones who invite the children to a party tell the christmas story. Everyone is invited, anyone can come, all who come hear the story and get a box. Obviously the party is in a church building, they know the people holding the party are christians. they are also their friends and neighbours, offering their kids a free party. TBH most Kazakhs are pretty laid back about their faith, and would happily send their child to a party for fun, and actually the basic nativity story is in the koran and believed by muslims, it is the easter story which is not.

I am not defending them, just trying to inject a little balanced view of what actually happens versus what people think happens

The people on the ground are not exposed to the founders rather extreme views on any of the subjects mentioned. But obviously that fact that he holds those views may mean you don't want to be part of it.

missnevermind - that was me, my children got given a box every year, as did all children in the area. hence what I said about them not always being well targeted at poor children (they chose one thing out of the box, and the rest we gave away to local children when they came to our house.)

sorry got to go to bed, if you have any more questions will answer them tomorrow

steppemum I've taken that booklet from their own website. they say that NO booklets are put in the boxes (infact after a check at the country of origin, nothing is put in/taken out of the boxes. NB I'm not disputing this fact.), but that that booklet is offered out WITH boxes.
Am sure they would not actually break the law, so if illegal to distribute that in Kaz, they would not. But they do say themselves that they hand it out.

The secondary school I worked in stopped doing the shoeboxes for the reasons the op mentioned and also the person who picked them up made it obvious they wouldn't be there for Xmas, if they got there at all.
I think it's a good idea in theory but I think the OP is right. It gains more clarity when you work in a multi faith school and many of the children belong heritage wise to the countries involved.
Some charities are corrupt and do waste money - it's important we teach our children to avoid these and to give freely.
OP poster - did you son explain himself? Because otherwise he will just have appeared rude.

HazeltheMcWitch - the US site does say that boxes packed in the US will have religious leaflets etc put inside them and that the charity is working to make this the case in the UK as well (or wording to that effect).

You trained your child to get himself in trouble at school by being cheeky, because of your high moral principles that he has no interest in and probably doesn't understand?

Well done you.

I don't think it's particularly cheeky

Its an honest answer to a direct question.

And I don't think that disagreeing with a charity appeal that aims to quite literally get children to sell their souls for a box of Poundland tat and sweets is indicative of 'high moral principles'.

My DD is 9 and she understood perfectly well why we weren't supporting the appeal.

How would you feel if a radical fundamentalist Muslim charity started giving out Eid presents, Islamic conversion booklets, and Korans to poor children in this country, with the express aim of converting as many of them as possible?

Our local Brownie pack are very specific about what goes in the boxes; soap, toothbrushes/toothpaste, pens/pencils, enamel mug, gloves, flip flops, etc,
No "tat from the poundshop" at all.

Any leaflets enclosed are easily discarded, surely, if they have no relevance?
It doesn't negate the very useful stuff given to children who have nothing.
Your DS will have come across as a jumped up little smartass.

OMG i help process and pack these boxes after people have donated to ensure that the contents is suitable.
I can assure you that the boxes don't contain 'pound shop tat' most of the time, but thoughtfully given, often quality toys and games.
There are UK charities that campaign and raise money for water appeals is deprived countries and i'm aware that they need more, but why not have a little gift at Christmas when they are not used to anything at all?
If you go to the official website, there are real stories, so maybe take a look.

Lagabby - Not at all - she trained her child to look at things objectively and not at face value. She trained him to speak up for his moral values and not be cowed by the majority. Valuable life lessons me thinks.

Lucky children of yours if they are taught to toe the line, accept what they are told without question and think good thoughts for teacher

Real stories like this one from Nepal do you mean?

I quote... "More than 80 percent of the people in Nepal are Hindus, and few in the mountain villages have ever heard the Gospel. When excited children come home with gift boxes and Gospel booklets in their hands, it provides a way for the Good News to reach the unreached for the first time. It also opens doors for Nepali pastors to do follow-up ministry."

The boxes are being used as a tool for evangelism and conversion. Which I disagree with, and is not made clear to those who pack the boxes.

Pieces of tat from the Poundshop? You cheeky madam!

I say this as an agnostic who is not a big fan of religions such as Christianity or Islam but who has allowed my own dts (10) to make their own choice. I'd be sorely disappointed if either of them had answered in that manner & is that not a sign you're doing the very thing you're complaining about.

Our shoebox appeal is done through a local charity, yes it is Christian. The suggestion list always includes things like hairbrushes, toothpaste/brushes, small items of clothing such as hats etc. It is a pleasure to make them up for someone who might not have much in life - surely you can't be sour on a little treat? And I send things like Lego and little cars not tat, we may not be middle-class but we're not cheap!

OP take it you don't celebrate Christmas then? Or is that ok? Tradition & all that.