To think that 60k is a lot of money to earn a year?!

[MinkSlink]

I think it is a lot of money to earn per year but it seems a lot of people on mumsnet don't think so, am I in the piss poor minority here or what?!

" we have a nice house, 2 cars etc. BUT.....we have insurance for the mortgage, insurance for my DH if he was unable to work, various life insurance policies, 2 pensions, medical care, insurance for the cats ffs......all designed to make sure that our home and DD are safe should anything happen to us. "

I don't begrudge you any of it. I am sure that your DH works hard for it. And yes it is sensible to safeguard what you have.

But everything on that list is a luxury.

For catgirl; I earn more than that.

£60k is a very good salary, yes, and better than lots of people but its not huge.

I feel very lucky to earn what I do and to live the life I do.

Where I live (expensive area, but not at all posh), we have a 3 bed house and a mortgage for approx half its value, and between that and childcare alone we spend approx £45kpa, which out of post tax pay means we have to earn approx £65kpa (I've done the tax as an approximation 30%, allowing for some higher rate, some lower rate, child care tax vouchers, blah), for house and childcare alone, before we pay for any transport, food, bills etc. DH has to buy a train season ticket (several grand a year), I need my car for my longish commute, I easily get through a huge wad of cash on these unexciting things. In order for DH and I to have the jobs we have, we need to live here or hereabouts.

However I do know on which side my bread is buttered, having been raised in poverty (not that I particularly noticed at the time, it seemed normal), as a youth I did some pretty heavy farm work for £10 per day, my first proper job was for £2.10 per hour, and I had to spend half of what I earned on bus fares just to get to work and back.

I educated myself out of that poverty, and now have a professional job. I do feel richer, but it's the small things that make most difference, like today I bought some pre-grated cheese for 40p more, it felt so decadent!

talkinpeace2 I hear ya, but we have always felt this way. I worked in an industry whereI dealt with people who have lost everything, and I mean everything due to ill health, redundancy etc etc and its heartbreaking. I vowed that we would never be in that situation.

Now, I'm not daft enough to say that those things come before food - but as I've said before, it's all relative. My DH is the breadwinner, I work for myself but earn a pittance. If anything happened to him, we'd be up the creek. Now I see nothing wrong with making sure that doesn't happen. We are not lavish - we choose to pay for what we see is essential in life, we're not spending on transient luxuries that don't mean anything.

I DO get your point though.

Because there are no rich people in big houses in South Wales, just poor ones. Trying to base this on where you live is ridiculous. I earned less than £12,000 in London and less than £12,000 in Cardiff. I still managed to find somewhere to live and it cost the same as a mortgage would when I rented.

The whole point is though, it doesn't change the fact that on earnings alone, £60k is vastly different to £12k.

And if someone earning £12k was no longer given state support, they would be living far, far below the poverty line.

Stop arguing about how £60k isn't enough, and start arguing about how disgusting it is that employers can pay their staff just £12k a year for a full time job.

I have been in a career where I would now be earning over £60k, prior to my disability diagnosis. Back then, I thought I was hard up.

I was talking BOLLOCKS.

NOW I know what hard up REALLY is. £60k is a lot of money whether you live in Newcastle or Chelsea. £12k is fuck all whether you live in Manchester or Notting Hill.

The average wage is £26k. If you think that earning more than double the average wage is 'hard up', then may I suggest budgeting lessons and a refresher Maths course?

:-)
It's nice to be able to plan. Its what I worked hard on my degree and accountancy exams for. BUT those of us with the luxury of doing so must NEVER think we are the norm.

Couthy, good point. Wages have not kept pace with the economy and some employers need to take a good hard look at themselves. The company I used to work for is currently advertising a full time, 37 hour a week position with a starting salary of £10k. I can't out myself by saying where, but the responsibility that would be required from the employees for that paltry amount is unbelievable.

Eddievedersfoxymop - if you think insurance will protect your family from being in the position my family is now in, then frankly, you are deluded. Even £20k savings did not protect my family from ending up dirt poor.

Because insurance companies aren't always the most scrupulous, and frequently wriggle out of payouts.

You are as deluded as I used to be.

I hope with all my heart that you never have to find out just how true these statements are.

Yes Avon there are no wealthy people in South Wales,just poor people. Nice one.

60k is a lot of money, but I have to say it does go.

I used to work in Brussels. I was paid ?30k. I felt very well off on that. I lived in a shared flat, went on holiday, had frequent trips back to London, went out whenever I wanted. I managed to pay my parents the 4k they had loaned me for university fees back in one year. I moved back to London and completely fell on my feet and got a job that paid £60k. I found a shared flat, but I immediately felt poorer. London is just a money sponge.

TalkingPeace2, do you have a problem with me . I've only made 2 comments on this thread and you've pounced on both. I haven't said what our income is or claimed to be hard up, just commented that in the particular area where I live 60K isn't a lot, but I have also conceded that it is a financial bubble. I don't understand what the problem is that you appear to have with my daring to add in a comment on a public forum. Sorry if you don't agree, but patronising me and calling my post "utter rubbish" is pretty unnecessary (shrug)

And you do realise that you are CHOOSING to pay out this amount on insurances, don't you? You could CHOOSE to rent a house, have no contents insurance, no pet insurance, no life insurances.

You have made different CHOICES.

That STILL doesn't mean that £60k isn't a large income. It IS. Because you HAVE those choices.

People on £12k DON'T have those choices. They don't have life insurance. They don't have a work pension. They don't have contents insurance. They don't have pet insurance. Not because they are CHOOSING not to, but because if they choose to have those things, then they don't eat.

So the fact that you HAVE those choices should SHOW you that it is a large income.

I earn a bit more than 60k but in London it doesn't go far.
I am a lone parent with no family help so my childcare costs are £1000 per month.
My mortgage is £2000 and for that I live in a tiny horrible terrace.
The only reason we are ok is that my exDH helps out. If he didn't then I would have nothing left after paying bills and buying basic food.

Yes Avon there are no wealthy people in South Wales,just poor people. Nice one

For crying out loud, it's a geographical example. Place like Cwmbran or Cwmdare were, last time I went, not populated by massively wealthy people. Obviously I'm not talking about the whole area!

It depends where you live. If you work in London its not that much (assuming full time), and most full time professionals (lawyers, doctors, dentist, IT, accountants) would earn more than that.

Remember that many "well paid" jobs are for unlimited number of hours, not just 9-5.

EleanorBloodBathsket
for reference

AvonCallingBarksdale
It is absolutely not a lot if you live in the Home Counties - it's about half many people's income. You live by your means as well, you spend what you have, so, no, it's not a lot. If you live in South Wales, it probably is. It's all relative.

sorry if you think I'm picking on you but your post was astoundingly out of touch, especially as the links to the REAL NUMBERS are up thread

Woah couthy, simmer down. No need to shout. To rent would be more than my mortgage, we bought before prices went nuts. I know its a good income, I'm merely trying to point out that everyone can have skint times, no matter who you are.

Now please get out my throat, which you just jumped down.

Sheesh. I was trying to be nice upthread.

foreverondiet
If you work in London it IS that much - it is more than 90% of the population in London earn .....

Some people on this thread are saying that 60K isn't a lot with a London mortgage to pay off. I accept that with a large mortgage, outgoings are higher. However, once the mortgage is paid off, a property in London is likely to have a high value. It seems disingenuous to complain about housing costs if the result is owning a high priced asset

I'm not sure it does depend where you live.

I accept costs of living vary across the country. But some people do live in expensive cities or expensive areas, because that is where their job is, and do manage on smaller salaries. Saying 'oh, I have 60k but because I am in London, it doesn't go far' probably feels true when you are looking longingly at house prices for a lovely 6-bed mansion in County Durham. But it is a bit insensitive because you will have someone living close to you managing on much less.

You are well off if you have 60k, which enables you to buy or rent the house in the nice area or the rich city. You are doing well to be able to do that.

Saying 'oh, but 60k barely pays my expensive mortgage/my high rent' makes sense, because it does show how different living costs are across the country, but it is also slightly off if you don't acknowledge how lucky and rich you are to have that choice.

TalkinPeace2, no, sorry, still . I haven't said I feel hard up. I've just commented that where I live, it's not a lot. In the town I live (obv not going to out myself!), the majority of people earn more than that. Now that makes it a financial bubble, out of touch with the vast majority nationwide. I can't personally help that, though and I haven't claimed to be hard up - that would just be weird!

DH and I earn about £52K between us. We have no mortgage currently because we inherited money from DMIL, whom we miss like crazy.

Had she still been with us, we would have finished paying off 6 years early by overpaying and still been comfortable. Our house is modest - a 3 bedroom semi in East Anglia. Our car is 11 years old (but this is by choice - we could afford a newer one but won't replace until this one dies on us).

Right now we feel pretty damn rich - no mortgage, no credit card debts, no childcare costs as since September this year the DDs are no longer in out of school childcare.

But we have been very, very lucky. I can see circumstances in which £60K would still not be enough, because the cost of housing in the south and south-east is insane, and the cost of childcare is even more so. I moaned when our monthly childcare bill was £770 - I see people on here paying £2400 a month!

Everything is relative. However, all those of us who are in the top 10% should still count ourselves damned fortunate.