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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to want to buy a sleeping bag for a street beggar and huffy that my family member wouldn't lend me the money to do so?

74 replies

KelperRose · 18/10/2012 18:20

Yesterday we were in town, I was chumming a member of my family for him to get a few specific bits and pieces so involved a couple of hours in and of out shops in the main area's of Edinburgh.

Anyway it was absolutely pissing down with rain and there was one beggar (I'm sure that term is not pc but unsure what else to use?) who was soaked to the skin with a sopping wet blanket covering him.....he didn't even have a coat.

I felt so bad for this guy I wanted to help in a constructive way but didn't have my debit card on me (I deliberately left it home as I knew I'd buy stuff I didn't need in the shops otherwise and come home with more boots I don't really need)

I asked person with me if he would help by lending me the money to buy him a sleeping bag or a nice warm waterproof jacket and I'd give him the money as soon as we got home.

He refused on the basis of he thought it was a completely stupid thing to do.

So was he in the right and was it a stupid idea or should he have lent me the money for what would have been at max 2 hours?

OP posts:
Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 19:14

The family member I'm referring to is my 19 year old son.

The whole scenario did raise an interesting discussion between us yesterday as I was sort of taken aback by his attitude tbh.

Then he comes back today and says he's signed the protest form thingy from The Scottish Socialist Party today in Princes Street to act against homelessness

I said... 'well if you'd just lent me the money yesterday and let me buy a sleeping bag/waterproof warm coat, we'd both know that that guy we passed 3 times was not sitting shivering in the cold' .

OP posts:
Whistlingwaves · 18/10/2012 19:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LadyMaryCreepyCrawley · 18/10/2012 19:25

There's a bloke who used to beg in the town centre here who looked so sad. His ragged hair was greasy, his clothes nothing more than rags and the only coat he had was a filthy sleeping bag which he'd wrap around himself. He'd sit on the floor, shivering. About 6 months ago there was an article about this man, he'd been given an ASBO as he wasn't actually homeless and destitute, and was happily begging from generous people who just wanted to help. I remember the occasions I'd bought him a coffee and a pasty. I now point people in the direction of the local homeless day centre, where they can get food for free, a shower and some clean clothes.

LynetteScavo · 18/10/2012 19:27

YANBU to want to buy the guy a coat/sleeping bag, but your relative was NBU to not lend you money.

Nobody is obliged to lend anyone money. Next time take your debit card out with you, and use control in the shoe shops.

Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 19:30

@HoldMeCloserTonyDanza (great name btw) are your comments on making them a target for robbery based on experience on working in the area of homelessness or just a a gut feeling?

I think I'd rather help a person, a real person than hand over £3 a month to a registered charity which promises to help but does little due to the fact that out of £3 around 10p which actually go into the coffers to help those in need

OP posts:
MadameOvary · 18/10/2012 19:34

I'd be a bit shocked at a flat refusal tbh, unless there was a good explanation. I'd be worried about a lack of empathy, personally. I frequently buy food and drink for the homeless (if they want it) because if it was me sitting there, a bit of kindness would be welcome.

Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 19:37

me too MadameOvary I think it was the lack of empathy for another that got to me

OP posts:
MrsTerryPratchett · 18/10/2012 19:40

KelperRose those of us who've worked in this field for decades have been paid a pittance from those 3 quid a month donations. I have massive amounts of experience and have prevented deaths, supported people to permanent housing, been in a shelter fire, witnessed an attempted murder and a lot of assaults, been threatened and done more Christmas shifts, overnights and weekends than I would like to remember. I have talked to people about their sex work, drug and alcohol use, family estrangement, cancer and impending death.

I appreciate that you want to help with a coat or sleeping bag but don't imagine that this issue can be solved without professionals.

2rebecca · 18/10/2012 19:41

Next time take your own money. There are loads of beggars, why choose this one. I'd give a donation to Shelter if you want to help the homeless and/or look for old coats.
If you still deperately want to buy a particular person a load of new stuff I'm sure next time you go into town there will be plenty to choose from.
Maybe asking round your friends for old coats and sleeping bags or buying just waterproof outers for sleeping bags (less likely to get donated) and taking them to shelter or handing them out on the street if you like the personal benevolent bit would benefit more people.

TubbyDuffs · 18/10/2012 19:49

Lovely thought on your part, but in future make sure you can back it up. I don't see why you need to post your good deeds here. A charitable act doesn't need to be advertised. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altruism

MadameOvary · 18/10/2012 19:53

I disagree TubbyDuffs - why not tell others? I want to know that this sort of stuff goes on. I want people to know that acts of kindness happen. I like hearing about them. I don't do it to make myself look good, I do it because that is how I would like to be treated.

Pagwatch · 18/10/2012 19:56

I think drawing a line between not giving money to people on the street and a lack of empathy is a bit smug.
I don't often give money to people on the street. That does not mean I don't give.
I think choosing to donate regularly to charities who know what they are doing is as valid a choice as handing out money effectively on a whim.
Sure one can debate the issue but saying 'I would buy a sleeping bag. If you woudn't then you lack empathy' is a bit arrogant.

I also think if you ask to borrow money the person is perfectly entitled to say no.

MrsTerryPratchett · 18/10/2012 19:58

I like the lovely warm feeling that doing good gives me. I've always worked with pretty unpopular groups of people (ex-offenders, including sex offenders, drug and alcohol mis-users, homeless people, First Nations people) so I didn't expect or generally get much praise from others Grin Pick donkey sanctuaries if you want people to like you.

TubbyDuffs · 18/10/2012 20:00

What, why not tell others that a man I wanted to give money to got none because of a relative's unwillingness to help out? Did the guy get any money? What happened in the end? What is the point of the OP's post really?

I am a bit confused as to what the OP expects. Great if you want to give to charity, but its up to you to do that, not to expect someone to bail you out when you feel like giving.

The person being asked for money might be struggling that month and might not want to hand over cash to some random bloke in the street to make you feel better about yourself. Or, who knows, the person being asked to lend money might not expect to get it back from you and therefore may be unwilling to lend the cash.

OrangeLily · 18/10/2012 20:01

Can I ask him where the man was?

Most beggars in city centre Edinburgh are 'professional' beggars and have been there for years with the same stories. One woman has literally been pregnant for about 8 years! Quite a few Romanian beggars too and both me and DH have had abuse from them :( One in city centre Edinburgh removed his blanket, picked up his ultra expensive mobile phone and bogged off too.

anastaisia · 18/10/2012 20:01

KelperRose I feel the same about a lot of bigger national charities, but I don't think that donating to a small local charity the same. They don't have the big executive salaries and marketing budgets or lobbying costs. I'm quite happy to donate things and money to a local homeless shelter/DV refuge/charity.

Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 20:07

@TubbyDuffs........what?

You are spoiling for a fight obviously.......I decline to give you one

OP posts:
Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 20:15

@MrsTerryPrachett I get it.

I can't really make a difference and the work you do and your colleaques do far outway my good intentions.

How what I get involved in helping in the same way? I want to help and I'm really not sure sure I know how do go about doing it?

I don't want to just 'donate £3 a month' because as I have said I don't trust the big charities to give the money to help where it is needed .

But what can I do , how can I help?

I want to do something but don't have the first idea where to start

OP posts:
Pagwatch · 18/10/2012 20:19

Google homeless shelters in your region. They will have details of how to donate.
It's pretty easy.

COCKadoodledooo · 18/10/2012 20:25

kelper where are you geographically? If you're southwest-ish I can put you in touch with a charity which supports homeless/vulnerable adults. Financial donations always appreciated obviously, but time is a biggie too.

OP I don't think you were BU to ask at all. Bit bemused by your lack of self control that means you have to go shopping without means of payment though!

That your son had now signed a protest/petition shows he's now thinking of these things, which is great. Maybe next time you'll get a different answer.

Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 20:29

thank you pagwatch but I want to know how do help the peron you cros in the street of is soaked to the bone .

Another poster suggested if I got him a coat it would get stolen of him.

I know how to donate to charities ...I'm asking how do I help the person, the real individual I walk past who is sitting soaking to his skin in the middle of princes street?

If the charities that you are suggesting I donate to instead of directly helping that individual surely he'd be all wrapped up and warm in a hostel instead of freezing his bollocks of , and living with folk turning there noses up at the INDIVIDUAL 'thinking well I give to a charity so I've done my bit'

OP posts:
Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 20:36

@COCKadooledoo I'm trying to save for Christmas and I know me better than anyone else knows me ...which means if I have my debit card in my hand whilst out shopping with my son I'll us both loads of stuff just coz it looks pretty lol

I am an impulse buyer and also a lazy impulse buyer that can never be bothered to return the stuff I bought......hence me leaving my debit card at home

I hide it to when I watch QVC or I'd buy everything they sell

OP posts:
Original poster
KelperRose · 18/10/2012 20:37

lazy impulse buyer returner

OP posts:
COCKadoodledooo · 18/10/2012 20:40

Ask them. Chat to them and find out what they want/need. Be prepared to be told to get tae fuck though! Find out where your local shelters/drop in centres are, somewhere someone can go to get warm, have something to eat,get a wash etc. They might well know already but if you stop to speak to them then they know someone cares.

Pagwatch · 18/10/2012 20:41

For the guy in my high street my local shelter is the place that can help him. They supply a meal but people cannot stay if they are using. So if they have cash then I know that he can go and get something to eat and a hot drink.
there is also a day centre where they can go, again as long as they are not violent or drunk or using.

So you could find the charity that feeds local homeless. They all detail their activities including stuff 'in the community'. You could volunteer to man the tea stall and meal provision. And you can buy coats of you wish, maybe it won't be stolen. Or you could help out at the day centre.

I would ask the local charities. Presumably they would at least be a good resource?

I am not sure why you think anyone is 'turning their nose up at the individual thinking well I give to a charity so I have one my bit'. That is a pretty judgemental way to look at it
I am not sure if you intend to but you seem to be suggesting that you are the only one who cares.