I feel like i dislike my dd, help

[sprout44]

This thread will come across very bad but its a long story. I have 3 dds the two youngest are pretty normal kids, reasonabley well behaved and loving. Then they is my oldest, who is now 13 but she has always been so difficult, so strong willed, never doing what she is told to do, always testing the boundaries . In the past i tried everything bold step, magic 123 etc i even got her tested for ADD and brought her to a Homeopath but no results.
She is good at school no problems with her teachers and one of the most popular girls in her class, loved by her friends. At home she is just a little,,w..gon I am always fighting with her, she never lets up, fighting with her sisters, also mean spirited. I find her very selfish and mean to them and us. Of course now i am fed up asking her to improve, i am pulling back any affection for her but im sire she notices but still makes no effort.
I know and i dont blame anyone who feels i am the adult here and should improve, but its so hard to have to listen to all the shouting and tantrums, i resent her for all the trouble she causes in the family. It is much calmer and happier when she is not here . I have now given up of expecting any improvements.
I know you cannot change someone but something has to improve, or i dont want to be responisble for ruining her teenage years.

I was like your daughter too, and looking back now, I must have tested the patience of saints when I was a teen.

Home life was one constant battle of wills between myself and my mum, with my dad keeping out of the way as he just couldnt stand the never ending arguments and door slamming. I didnt like being told what to do, and had issues with anyone in authority...

I didnt want to spend time with her, doing bonding stuff... we were happy when we were as far as possible from each other most of the time. I was a hormonal teenager and she was going through the menopause... not a great combination.

But, I grew up, and grew out of it, and by the time I had left school, was working and earning my own money and had the independence I craved, we got on much better.

My sister was your daughter. Strong willed, passionate, boundary testing, acting out, flouting authority, all of the above. She was exhausting to live with and I know my mother, especially, didn't like her very much for years. (I don't think she ever showed HER that though.) In her twenties my sister grew up big time. She is still a strong willed, passionate individual but we all have very good relationships now. If anything I'd say she is the slightly favoured daughter!

Charlie Taylor writes fab books on improving behaviour and relationships here Or the How to Talk books are good.

marking my place!

sorry this is going to sound really horrible but does your dd like you at the moment?
before i get flamed for asking- i have been in similar situation with my ds and one day when i was close to tears at his attitude i suddenly stopped mid nag and gave him a hug.
we sat down and talked about how we both felt about certain stuff.
long story short i was irritating him with all my questions.
anyway we made a pact to be different with each other
it works mostly but the thing is he now can tell me why he does stuff and we sort it out.
kids are v sensitive to our attitudes

veritable I am sorry to hear that you felt worthless as a child but I think you have given some excellent advice from experience to the OP.

Poor baby. I think she can tell you favour the younger two children. Its always the hardest on the eldest because they're expected to "know better" Show her lots of love and cuddles (even if she hates it at first) take her out just the two of you. Keep her busy doing things she enjoys. There is nothing on earth as special as your first child, tell her about how excited you were when she was in your tummy, how amazing it was when she was a baby etc
We all have moments where we want to kill them but its up to us as parents to show them the way to behave.

I saw a lovely article on 'love bombing' - someone further up in this thread has suggested something similar, that is setting aside time to be with your DD on her own and constantly reiterating that you love her, no matter what she does. Sounds like this might be a good thing for you and your DD.

"There is nothing on earth as special as your first child, tell her about how excited you were when she was in your tummy, how amazing it was when she was a baby etc "

Yes to this. It helped with us. And possibly compare her to her siblings in favourable ways (not in their earshot though)

Also as someone else said - we didn't realise the extent our younger ones manipulated us to the detriment of our DD. There may be more going on than you realise.

Sorry but as one of three sisters I also feel sorry for your DD. It sounds like you wanted her to be a submissive and docile child against her natural nature, and as she isn't like that, you have demonized her in your household and made her a scapegoat for family issues.

My DD is strong willed and defiant even at the tender age of 1. I can see it in her personality but I don't want to change it or make her submissive, I try to work with it in order to help bring out her best traits. Being strong willed and defiant is not wrong or bad, in fact it can be a great asset to person and you can use these character attributes to mould a wonderfully assertive, independent and free thinking young adult. It is how you nurture these traits that makes all the difference.

The fact that she is so popular outside of your home environment says a lot about your parenting as opposed to her character.

I'm sorry if that sounds harsh OP.

Maybe a little more info would give a clearer picture as to why you feel she is the cause of the problems in your home life. In all honesty though, I just don't think she is from what you have said.

LDNmummy out of interest do you have older children?

WileyRoadRunner, thank you

Obviously every family is different...I just can't stress enough how much of an effect this dynamic has had on my life. Knowing how I was disliked and yet being completely unable to do anything about it - and then seeing my sibling, who I knew to be a liar/thief/arch-manipulator etc, being held up as a great person, it was like being kicked in the teeth each and every day by all around me. I had a nickname, don't want to say what it was exactly, something like Moany Groany. If I needed anything I had to try (with very limited skills, remember) to find a way to ask nicely without inciting any comments about how I was always asking for stuff. (For some time, I only had one pair of trousers which I couldn't wash because I had nothing else to wear - we were not poor or needy, it was that I couldn't ask for more.) Then I would be called ungrateful because by then something else would have happened. Half the time I didn't understand what the hell I had done, just that I'd been tutted at or snapped at yet again. Meanwhile my sister would have been taken shopping as some sort of reward. I would hear a lot about that from her, as well.

I left as soon as I could, and it's a bloody miracle that my parents have any sort of relationship with me or vice versa. Of course I know my parents tried with me, it was just that the second I didn't keep to their script (I don't mean the second I turned nasty, I mean if I didn't completely agree with them) I was downgraded again to the nickname.

Incidentally they just roll their eyes at the memory of my teenage years although I have had an apology for them not realising what my sister was like (once I'd left home, the focus was rather on her, and she had nobody to position herself behind: it took some years and £££ but they sussed her eventually).

Sorry that is all about me me me, it was just all so toxic and I do think that if only these basically 'nice' people had been sustained with their kindness and better with their parenting of my sibling too, a lot of it could have been avoided. Having said that I can see how insecure they were/are and they also had no option but to attack me, they were really very young and their own parents were shits (frankly) and they were getting a lot of false validation of themselves from my sibling.

Actually, in a way I do. I have been a parent to a much younger sibling since this sibling was just a few months old. This sibling is now a teenager and I still play a parental role in their life.

I have discussed on other threads how in my culture, older siblings can take on parenting roles in a family structure.

How old are your younger children? It is hard being the eldest, always being expected to set an example, or keep an eye on little ones. My Mum, who I love dearly, used to let my little sisters muck up my stuff, break things, and used to tell me not to moan, they are just little. Drove me wild. Be honest with yourself about how you are treating her. She is a teenager, the others are not. They may well be foul one day too.

I was just giving my opinion based on what the OP has written.

That's why I said more information would be needed to get a clearer picture on the situation.

From what the OP has written, I just don't think the child is as horrid as it seems.

Some children are naturally very stubborn and strong willed. It seems like the OP saw this as a personal attack on her as a parent from her young child.

Something has gone wrong along the way with the OP and her daughter but I don't see how the D can be held responsible at only 13 to the extent the OP is describing.

I do feel for her situation as I had a very troublesome sibling who caused a lot of disruption in our household, but as with any child, it can almost always be traced back to the home environment.

"I am pulling affection back from her but I am sure she notices but still makes no effort"

OP, I think this is one of the saddest things I have ever read here.

I'm glad that further on in your thread you say you won't give up on her, if she performs well at school and is popular there it does suggest something at home isn't right.

Sorry I couldn't quite see, does she know you are definitely uprooting and moving back next year? You refer to "going home" but as temporary as you have known it is, to a person her age 4 or 5 years in one place they like will seem like a massive upheavel.

It is very, very hard to be the oldest. You are the guinea pig in many ways, the train blazer. You are the child your parents focus on with the most intensity and your faults can be magnified as a result.

Part of how parents respond to the firstborn stems from panic and fear that you are 'getting it wrong'. You are doing this for the first time and you don't know how it will all turn out, what will become of the child. You probably also have expectations of how the child will be, how she will respond to you, and when she goes 'off script' you are on unfamiliar ground, traversing unmapped territory with no compass. Try to get a hold of that fear and deal with it.

I am the oldest and I know I saw a lot of myself in DD1 and also a lot of my parents in my response to DD1. Being her mother was an eye opener for me in many significant ways. It was a humbling experience on many counts.

All the elements of her personality that made her a challenge to mother (persistence, determination, strong willed, testing the boundaries, competitive spirit, confidence in her own judgement, quick mind and well able to speak up for herself) made her a joy to teachers and ensured she would succeed in university and at work.

OP I think you need to consciously try to see what is good about your DD at home. Write a list if needs be, featuring her good points. Go through whatever photos you have of her up to now and sit with them for a while. If you have kept any art work or other sentimental items, take a look at them too. Try to relax with her. Take it one day at a time do not carry around the baggage from yesterday or the heavy weight of unfulfilled expectations for tomorrow. Though it is hard, try not to take it personally when she is rude or obnoxious. Not only is she the oldest and equipped with her own personality (which you cannot change btw your only choice is to work with it) -- she is 13. It is a very difficult age for parents to deal with.

And please, please remember that this is her first time around too.

You are the grown up and you must take the lead in this relationship, for both your sakes. Do whatever it takes to change what you are doing in order to bring about a positive change. That is what leadership as a parent is all about.

Have you tried to "love the child you have, not the child you wanted?" Sometimes changing your mindset can help- but I don't want to say it like a know all iykwim, as I appreciate you have had a very tough time. I truly hope things improve for all of you

I knew my thread would cause a lot of reaction and look bad on me, of course i take responsibility but i had to tell you from my side not my dds. I needed someone to just kick me and maybe try again. I am not a toxic person but i think its all learned behaviour now on both our parts. I would not be writing this thread if i did not care about her, its all just over shadowed at the moment by negativity. I do know too that we have similar personalities.
Hormones or no hormones i do not think you can let teens talk back and call you names.
Its also interesting to see the side of you girls you were similar to my dd while you were growing up, we forget they are still kids and still need even more love.
Thank you all for all you said good and bad , except Angela Merkel, i think you need to see things from all sides.

I have four children and my second son, third child, is like your daughter and always has been - he is 14 now.He is a star at school and on the sports field but constantly challenging at home, rows with siblings, is aggressive and rude.He is also charming, persuasive, persistent, intelligent, self-confident! The only thing that works in my experience is more time, more affection, more effort, more talking- the most important being affection. You still have to have firm boundaries and consequences, but above all not make them the naughty one. It is very hard if one child doesn't fit into the family dynamic but it can be coped with- you have my sympathies completely but please take it the right way when I say you may need to see the counsellor rather than your daughter.

littlehebear I wish my parents had been more like you!

Thanks again all of you, this has just reminded me , about 6 years ago i went to a counceller myself due to a lot of stress due to when my dm was very ill as i was so down. During the hour i was there i mentioned my dd several times as she wanted to discuss further. At the time it did not sut me to return, i should have, in heinsight. Also i tend to talk to all my friends about my dd, they all know the problems. I will now make a huge effort not to take it all so personal and just move on positively; It will take some time and some more fall backs but i want it better for her because despite her causing so much trouble, i am more worried about her and how it will all affect her. Life is hard enough without your own family againist you.

I was always coming from the point of view, why can she just not change and improve and all will be ok, She has told me she does not want to improve for me.
Phew;
ps The reason i was so angered the other day was she has hit her middle sister in the tummy so badly and i was so mad at her, again;

What had the middle sister done? Not excusing hitting, but it seems unlikely she'd hit her for no reason.

It's really really hard to be the 'less preferred' child. Don't kid yourself - your daughter will know this. If this has been going on since she was young, it could have far-reaching consequences on her relationships as she grows up and into adulthood.
Kids need 2 things to develop in healthy way emotionally. They need to feel loved and to feel safe. People who can't form strong healthy relationships as adults can often trace this - and their repeated relationship mistakes/patterns - back to primary childhood relationships being inadequate.

I was like your daughter and I'm only really sorting things out as I approach 50. You are absolutely right to think about getting professional advice.