To rehome puppy?

[MarsBars123]

Our 6 month old puppy bit our friends 6 year old daughter today.

We were having a meal and gave him his food afterwards. She walked behind him while he was eating and he spun around and bit her, he didn't draw blood but her hand was red.

I am in total shock, he has never done anything like this before, should we rehome him straight away? I'm really confused.

MarsBars, there's a great summary of why the breed I have cannot be let off the lead here - click on 'why can't Siberian huskies go safely offlead?'.

That is not to say they are walked only on a 6ft lead. They run free daily in securely fenced places, 50ft long lines for walks, training and play, they cover miles training for sled dog racing.

Greyhounds and some other breeds are similar and groups dedicated to these breeds often have playdates social groups where people get together to let them have zoomy time in safe places.

Dogs can also be on-lead because they are aggressive to other dogs, aggressive to humans, ditto fearful/nervous/flighty/reactive, they may be injured and on restricted exercise, they may be old, blind or deaf. It's not always the fault of the current owner and they are probably doing their best to rectify what they can. It's a simple courtesy to keep your off-lead dog away from ones on lead just in case.

I think they key with any dog training is to be normal and not ott around them. They don't need pity or a needy do-good owner, just normalcy.

We involve our dogs in our regular lives, whether it is picking chestnuts, going for a swim, meeting people for dinner or buying veggies in a farmer's market. They are part of all of it, and learn good behaviour and manners through normal human interactions with us and others.

Frantic clicker training, fake agility and pretentious puppy classes are no substitute for the real deal, I.e., leading a normal fulfilling life as a part of a family pack.

So you keep instructing your dogs to earn awards to make yourself feel good, while I'll focus on training my dogs so they get to lead a normal, happy life as a part of our circle of family and friends.

Wow, there sure are a lot of mixed views on this thread! Here's my opinion as a dog owner/ non expert/average Joe.
OP, I'm can see you love and care for your puppy and your chosen course of action will probably work for you (although you should really atleast consider giving him more respect when he is eating as well as training him) You were however BVU to consider re-homing over this incident!
Bubblegum, you should not be a dog owner and the PROFESSIONAL (not sure if bold makes them more important) who gave you that nugget of gold about slapping puppies needs to read a book written in the last 20 years.
As for the other two titans flatbread and Goldship, call me crazy but I can actually see sense in both of your posts. I do think it's important to train a dog to be able to behave freely and without provisions around people but I also think it's important and just a matter of respect to stop people (especially children) from invading their personal space. But as I said I'm not an expert just someone who loves dogs =)

Oh and sorry to bring it up but the bloody rape analogy?! Really?! I actually found that really offensive to men with the implication that they are to be given the same sense of responsibility as an animal! Ridiculous comparison

Well I've never been called a titan before :o

And you dont need to be an expert, a love of dogs is a good a place to start as any. Mixed with a bit of the ol' common sense ;)

Absolutely heartbroke today as my dear Star's back legs gave in. She recovered straight away but its a bad sign, especially with her being a boxer :(

So it is your rescue dog you bred from then Flatbread?

Although, I am getting a bit of a fondness for Flatbread. She is reminding me of my Gran (who I love very dearly) a bit. She has all these tales to tell of how when she was a young girl she had a boyfriend waiting on every corner, how her (very much loved) rough collie did this and that and now of how there's this circle of friends with her neighbours, family members etc where she helps them all ou tand it's all soooo wonderful....

But why do the 2 have to be seperate?
My dogs go everywhere with us. They come to work with me every day. They go wherever we go.
But they also do as I ask. They don't jump all over people, they don't run away, they don't approach other dogs or people unless I say it's ok.

The trouble is you are not reading what I'm writing.

If you think the only reason I have taken the dogs to puppy classes and dog training is not to make myself look good.

I take them for 2 reasons. Firstly all the dogs I have had have been so unsocialised it's not true. Not one of them had ever been around other dogs. So training classes are a good way of introducing them to other dogs in a controlled environment. They get high quality treats, they feel safe and it helps.
And the second reason is because all the dogs have different behavioural problems. I'm not an expert. I am a person who loves dogs and will do just about anything to help the difficult to place dogs. But I don't presume to think I know everything or that I know all the correct training methods.
So it helps me and the dogs.

I'm proud beyond belief that my little dog is ready to train for his bronze. And do you know why?

When we first took him to puppy classes he was scared of everyone. No one could go near him. But myself, my dd and my trainer worked and worked to earn his trust and to make him understand we wasn't going to help him learn. And he did. He then decided at 6 months to ignore it all.

I won't have an out of control dog. It's not fair on anyone and it's irresponsible. So we went over it all again. And now he gets it.

So he has come along a huge amount in a small time.

But you won't take in any of what I'm saying will you?

Oh I'm sorry to hear that Goldship that must be upsetting for you :-(

I said they get a tap on their bum if they ignore two warnings. But they don't ignore, because they don't like it when I am not happy with them. Once in a while pup might get overexcited, but he is really a good boy most of the time.

It might be a new concept to you, but my dogs want to please me. I am not needy for their approval, they want mine. And so they listen and obey. No magic there, just that the dogs love and respect us.

All the dogs around here are off-leash, so not an issue at all. The dogs freely interact with each other and the humans around them. I have never seen a leashed dog in our cafe. We go there every weekend and our dogs love meeting the weekend regulars, and they get lots of cuddles in return, especially from children.

I know it seems such an alien concept as compared to the artificial and constrained lives so many poor dogs lead in UK. But if you keep the dog isolated under the guise of a 'private space', it is not going to learn much, is it?

Oh Goldship I'm so sorry to hear that...hugs to you and your pooch x

It really is but I suppose we've just got to carry on and make sure she is as happy and as comfortable for as long as possible. She was fine right after, it was just a momentary thing but it rings alarm bells so vets in the morning.

I don't know what the other two would do with out her, one is her son. Shes a proper mother hen always fussing, but tells them off if she thinks they're getting too big for their boots!

Thankyou for your concern x

Oh goldship I'm so sorry to hear that.
I hope she will be ok. I'm sure the vet will put your mind at rest xx

Although I agree with many of your points flatbread, I do grimace when you refer to smacking your dogs as "tapping on the bum". If it's a tap then they won't feel it and it's pointless, if it's a slap then don't sugarcoat it. Believe it or not ,I'm not here to critisise the slap itself ( totally unnecessary and not something I'd do but it works for you so fair enough) but we all know that a dog would respond no more to a slight tap on the bum then they would to a third, fourth and even a fifth warning.

And for the record your dogs sound happy and I don't think you beat them.

flatbread your advice is as relevant as ever, thanks

Kali, I have no problems saying it as it is. It is a tap on the bum. It is a signalling mechanism that I am not happy. And when the pup is overexcited, talking to him just adds to the noise. A physical tap brings him back.

If I decided, say, to put my hand on his forehead to signal I am not pleased, it would have the same effect.

Dogs respond better to physical cues than words. But we project our own discomfort with physical contact and our need for 'private space' onto dogs.

I prefer to use physical contact more than words, and praise my dog through touch and caresses rather than words. If I lightly stroke my dogs ear, you can see her smile, as she knows i am happy with her. If I want the dog to sit, I prefer to put a finger on her back, and she responds by sitting. If we need to wait, e.g., before crossing a road, I just touch her on the shoulder. Obviously if she is further away, I need to use a verbal command.

My dogs are very responsive to touch and slight gestures are enough to get the message across.

The dog-house nutters love to whip themselves into a frenzy. Fanaticism rather than any understanding of dog behaviour is the norm. It can be quite entertaining and I get a good laugh

And to think, it is the cat ladies who get called crazy...

What is is about dog threads on Mumsnet? They almost always kick off.

That's an interesting way of doing things and sounds more civil than Bubblegums rolled up newspaper I suppose. What would be the purpose of the first two warnings in that case?

Where do you get your 'understanding' of dog behaviour from Flatbread?

I think I can honestly say that my 9 year old DS has more understanding of dog behaviour flatbread

It's all well and good saying "they respond to touch" or hitting in your case.
What about when they are not within smacking distance? Dont you then have to use basic vocal commands?

Ah yes that's right. You do.....and they ignore you. Then you smack them.

You are indeed a walking talking advertisement for puppy/dog training classes. I hope any new dog owner reading this can see that and do the exact opposite of any advice you give.

Is that the 'Dog House Nutters' who include a qualified behaviourist who has told you by your description of your dogs body language they are beind submissive and are not happy at all Flatbread?

I'm a bit confused though, you did say you could show your displeasure to your dogs by a mere raised eyebrow, so I am not sure of the need for hitting or 'tapping'?

I can see why dog lovers may find your posts bizarre at best (disagreeing with actual qualified behaviourists, based on your experience of owning two dogs, one a puppy and an extra one 'borrowed' from your neighbours) upsetting at worst (putting your rescue bitch at risk by allowing her to have a litter because you didn't take proper care of her in order to prevent her becoming pregnant and then having to rehome the puppies via dogs trust)

I was always told that positive reinforcement kicks negative reinforcement's arse. Making a fuss at positive behaviour teaches the dog what behaviour you want. Punishment just teaches the dog what behaviour you don't want, but doesn't teach it an appropriate behaviour. Dogs are (mostly) smart, they really do want to please you on the whole, so lots of fuss, happy excited voices, a game or a treat, are great learning tools ime. I have never hit my dog, but have shouted in frustration. All that happens is the dog looks confused, fetches me toys to appease me, gets anxious etc. I don't imagine that my dog is unique in this by a long shot.

Do as much training now to nip it in the bud quick (no pun intended).
Our family dog was aggressive for most of his life, and it started with food-agression. We didn't handle it properly, it escalated and he was a little unpredictable his whole life..not so bad that we couldn't live with it though.
If he shows aggression like this again I would react immediately by putting him on his back into a submissive position and keep him there until he gives up, not before!