To be really upset that DPs children don't want to spend time with us anymore

[PerditaMcLeod]

I must be feeling very brave this morning? a step parenting thread in AIBU. Either brave or stupid but I could really do with the wise words of MNetters.

A bit of background? DP and I have been together for around 18 months. He has four children from his previous marriage and we all had a good relationship (or so I thought). I love them all and have invested a huge amount of effort in my relationship with them.

They have now announced they don?t want to come here anymore as they get told off all the time.

A slight exaggeration, but with 4 of them in a small house we do have to have some kind of discipline. We don?t expect them to spend the weekend in silence, but the basic rules are

1. You make a mess, you clear it up before tea/Xbox/TV etc.
2. Good manners- standing up and eating at the dinner table for example is not acceptable. Neither is ignoring people who are talking to you if you don?t like what they are saying to you.
3. Any fights over Xbox etc. means they go off and stay off for the rest of the day.

I don?t think that is excessive and DP and I were both really pleased about how much their behaviour has improved in the last year. I have a DD of my own, so it?s not like I don?t know what it?s like living with children. Her relationship with DPs children is excellent.

There is a massive gulf in the way they are treated at the mum?s place and the way they are here (just to be clear, I am not in any way slagging her off) and I understand the difference between what is acceptable in each house can be confusing, particularly for the younger ones.

With this latest announcement, he is understandably devastated. I don?t hold with letting your kids blackmail you, but a compromise is needed to ensure he still gets contact, and by compromise I don?t mean let them come and trash the house every weekend as we used to!

I have suggested that we all sit down and try to get to the bottom of why it is they feel their treatment has been unfair. Both DP and I have demanding jobs and by the weekends are pretty knackered and on a short fuse and I get we do overreact sometimes. If they want to be treated in a more adult fashion (this won?t work for all of them as the youngest is 5) they need to be able to discuss this with us. They also need to understand why things like good manners are so important (God, I have turned into my mother?.) and also that that certain privileges have to be earned and equally they will be withdrawn in response to bad behaviour.

I was awake most of the night thinking about this. There are small practical things we can do like get a cleaner in on Monday to muck the house out and move the Xbox to another room so if they insist on fighting over it, they can do it in their own space.

Will stop rambling now? I just feel awful for DP who is an excellent dad and always has been, often not under the easiest of circumstances and I will do anything I can to make sure they want to come here and spend time with us.

If any of you wise women have any suggestions as to what we can do to compromise I would really appreciate it. I guess I am probably a bit more of a hardliner than DP and am of the view that as a parent ultimately they do what the are told but we don't want to be in the position where they won't want to come here at all.

I guess what I am asking is am I being unreasonable to not want DP to be held to ransom by his DCs and am I being unreasonable to expect a certain standard of behaviour?

I'm not sure you can ever make them feel at home, but you can make them feel welcome, and valued.

Presumably, you and their dad get one bedroom, your DD gets another bedroom, and the the eldest gets a room of his own. That's 3 bedrooms. Where do the other 3 sleep?

I would get rid of the xBox altogether. It's so obviously not contributing to family life.

When I was a child, we had a stepmother whom I saw some weekends. The atmosphere when she was there vs when she wasn't, well it was very different. I can't say we got more leeway when she wasn't there, but things were So Much More Relaxed and Fun.
She wasn't horrible by any means (she's no longer around, has a family of her own, but I still miss her, haven't seen her for 25 years!) she just liked rules, and used to make my dad follow them too.
Nothing bad would have happened if we'd had fewer rules! We weren't bad kids.

He needs to talk to them. And listen. And you have to accept that 5 in a small house will make a lot more mess, noise etc. Yes, it's totally reasonable to expect them tidy up etc, but you need to adjust your idea of acceptable mess when they're around. And perhaps relax some of your rules a little. Rather than having them tidy up every time they stop one thing to do another, maybe have a group tidy before lunch and before bed.

'Any fights over Xbox etc. means they go off and stay off for the rest of the day'

Seriously??? With 5 DC??? How do they ever get the chance to play? Larger sibling groups do have more arguing. There are more people to argue with!

Narked/Veritable, am more than happy with mess- i just don't think its unreasonable for them to tidy up after themselves at the end of the day, or at least before they go back to mum's on Sunday. DP on the same page as me on this, and ultimately I leave the discipline to him as I am not their mother.

I totally accept the noise/mess etc and I love having a house full of children. DP says there is no difference in atmosphere whether I am there or not. I always muck in and play or do stuff with them depending on what they want to do.

We are just taken aback by this more than anything else and yes, we will listen and compromise. This is their home too and we want them to be happy here.

OP you do come across as being the ruler of the house. Your "Rules" were put in place because "You" couldn't cope and now look, they don't want to come over.

You only have them 1 weekend in every 3 for god sake. I'd tear up the rule book. The most important thing is them spending time with their dad.

You sound like a lovely stepmum. Hopefully there's some specific thing that's caused this that can be sorted. Could it be a sports thing the elder one wants to do at the weekend? Or a new friendship?

Have you tried a kitchen timer for the xbox arguments? Set it to x minutes and when it goes off it's all change on the controllers.

I really appreciate those of you who have taken the time to post on this. I agree that the most important thing is making sure they get time with their dad and I can see I have been unreasonable.

Thanks again.

You do sound like you are trying really hard and working together and you really don;t sound like you are being unreasonable

do you think maybe the kids find the chaos a bit much? I know my middle child dislikes too much noise and gets quiet distressed if she can't sit quietly at times.

Can you all agree the rules together - get an agreement drawn up that you all sign up to - it will mean compromise - but by ALL

gordyslovesheep Thu 27-Sep-12 10:14:30
my kids understand that different homes have different rules - at dads they follow his rules and at mine they do as I say - no amount of whining 'but daddy lets me do X,Y Z' works on me and vice versa

This. Top quality approach and you can add that even adults have to follow rules that differ... in different places.

"Why do you live in such a small house, if between you, you have five children? "

It must be very nice to live in your world LittleFrieda

In case you're not aware - not only is housing expensive for everybody, but as an NRP, the OP's DH will not receive any of the usual financial assistance for having so many children. No child benefit, no housing benefit, no tax credits for them etc etc etc. So the cost/space issue is very much exacerbated.

"Can you all agree the rules together - get an agreement drawn up that you all sign up to - it will mean compromise - but by ALL"

When I was a child I didn't get to participate in the rule making by the adults running the house. Nor does my child, and rightly so. Adults make the rules. Why should the situation be different for step-children?

I negotiate with my children - it helps you to choose your battles - and leads to a lot less nagging and moaning since they have agreed to follow the rules

I don't want them growing up in a dictatorship - they do have some rights even as children

Working together as a family suits us and works for us rather than me being in charge and them having no say

also Allnewtaketwo if the rules are the thing making his kids resistant to visiting (I don't think they are) then sitting down and discussing them can't hurt

I totally sympathise with your situation here and can see how hard this is for you. I have a similar family life, I have two DSs from my previous marriage (7 and 4) and my DP has two DSs from his previous relationship (7 and 3)!! So every other weekend his boys come to stay and we have four boys under 7!! It is nothing short of manic! The boys are very excitable to be all together and I find they make a lot (and I mean a lot) more mess than when there are just my two here.
I agree that your rules seem fair and agreeable and since it is your house, any child who comes to stay/play/whatever should respect the rules of the house they are going to. Just as my kids respect the rules of the house they live in. Our issue is that DPs boys clearly have a VERY different set of rules at their mothers house than they do here and they are never really here long enough to fall into the routine of life here.
Whilst I appreciate it is hugely confusing for children to have different rules, it is something that I believe should be instilled at a young age. I notice that his boys break a lot of our toys here and don't appear to have the same respect for things or people. They don't have to tidy up at home or clear the table or really it seems do anything for themselves. I understand that different people have different ways of doing things but I believe asking kids to tidy up/bring their plate to the kitchen when they've finished eating/respect others etc is just good manners and something that stays with them forever? What OP is asking of these kids is bot unreasonable and I totally agree with her style particularly given the age of the children now! They absolutely should tidy up etc!. I have introduced a sticker reward programme for when his boys are here - things can so easily and quickly get out of hand with so many of them it seemed the only way. And they are young enough to appreciate stickers !!
It has taken some time but I think that they are finally coming round and being more reasonable. If they have good manners at the dinner table they get a sticker. If they tidy up the playroom they get stickers, if they bring their bikes back to the garage instead of leaving them lying on the pavement thy get stickers. Thing is, with the more children you have, the more there is to tidy up! We were at the stage where his boys would come for the weekend and leave a trail of distruction which then MY boys had to tidy up (I did help!!) .... But either way this is clearly not on at all! So I've had I put a stop to it.
His boys are always welcome in our home. I should say that we have been together 2 1/2 years so quite a long time and have since moved to a five bed house so that each child can have their own bedroom. We are very fortunate to be able to do this and they also have what is classed as the dining room as a playroom.
There have been some good points made here; for my DP to spend quality time with his kids is very difficult; we tend to do this mostly after dinner and he reads them their bedtime story each night individually as I do to mine. Having the children come separately is a lovely idea but really quite impractical and can even have a detrimental effect on the kids as they don't like to miss out when their siblings are doing something with dad and they're not. My DPs boys hate coming here when my boys are not here ..... It's all so hard!
I hope that you can work something out - its equally hard when parenting styles etc are so difficult .... Blended families are really really hard work but can work well if everyone is open and honest.
I realised that I was shouting a lot at first but you do because there is so much going on, so much noise, so chaotic you feel like its the only way to get heard!! I try to anticipate situations now and the kids seem to respond a lot better If i explain the course of events before they happen. So, if they want to get a game out, that's fine, but once you've finished let me know and we will get it put straight away again so that all the bits are safe and you will be able to play again another day. If you want to play on the Wii, ok, but could you just put some of these toys away otherwise you won't have the room to play.
Everything comes with practice, like I said, I only just feel that after two years of regularly seeing his boys every other weekend we are starting to make things work better. No one teaches you how to be a good parent and especially no one teaches how to parent someone else's children!!
It's a fine line between making them feel at home in your home and letting them rule the roost! I treat his boys he same way that I treat my own. You can't change the rules when the step children come every other weekend because that is equally confusing (and I would say upsetting) for your own children who live there all the time.
I feel like I have somewhat rambled on a lot here, but its just that your situation is so similar to mine and I can totally understand our frustrations.
Good luck with everything - remember that Rome wasn't built in a day!
Take care

clipped phoenix - they have them 3 out of 4 weekends, the mother has them 1 in 4.

OP it sounds knackering! About the fighting over the XBox though - let them resolve their own arguments. They will have to learn to find a compromise between themselves and if you get involved in taking it away you will always be the bad guy.

Why not have one weekend with the XBox and two without so that they can do other stuff?

Perdita, I think you sound like a lovely stepmum and not at all too bossy/stopping all your stepkids' fun! There do have to be some rules. I think some of these posters have been very harsh to you. Sounds like you are doing the best you can and are trying your best to make this work. If you have your dp's four kids 3 weekends out of 4, that is a big commitment.

All the best, and I hope it works out for you.

All I am going to suggest is sitting down and talking to each child or perhaps having a family conference so they can tell you what they're unhappy with and what they'd like to change. Then you can all think about it together. If your dh's ex could help and be on your 'side', that could be good too.

I wish I'd stopped seeing my dad at 12 he was and still is an idiot, at 12 I think you get the measure of people and know who you like and who you don't. These children gave voted with their feet.

Mosman bit harsh, surely?

"I wish I'd stopped seeing my dad at 12 he was and still is an idiot, at 12 I think you get the measure of people and know who you like and who you don't. These children gave voted with their feet"

Wow, you're nice. OP I think you sound nice, and caring and very reasonable. I hope it works out and I suspect it will if you don't force or push the issue. Just keep the door and the communication open. Much love.

"I negotiate with my children - it helps you to choose your battles - and leads to a lot less nagging and moaning since they have agreed to follow the rules"

The sorts of rules the OP mentioned were fairly fundamental (e.g. putting dirty dishes in dw rather than leaving on table, sitting at the table instead of standing etc). These are not things to be negotiated.

I negotiate the small stuff and let my child actively participate in decisions which are appropriate. But not on fundamental house rules, no. That's not a dictatorship, that's being an adult and parent runnnig a house.

Who has given the children the idea that they can just choose not to come? I would tackle that head on if I were you - they are your DP's children, not guests. He has every right to expect them to live with him for some of the time, and their mum probably could do with some time to herself at weekends too. I would try and present the existing pattern of contact as entirely non-negotiable (except on odd ocassions - eg to fit in with a social comitment) but then listen properly to the concerns they have about the rules in your house, and being told off. Which of the rules do they not like? Or is it the sense that they have been told off for things they didn't realise they weren't allowed to do? That can be unsettling for young children in particular, and a cause of resentment for older ones.

I've recently moved in with my DP - we have his 4 DCs every weekend, and my two who live with us most of the time. His are aged 9-15 and don't get a say in the fact that this is where they live at weekends (though the oldest can and does vary the contact times to suit her social life). One thing we've done is to write down the house rules. We asked the kids what rules they wanted, and they all jumped on the idea and started writing their own bedroom rules (which are now pinned up in each bedroom). We then wrote down the house rules. These include bedtimes, time on computers, and rules around food, personal posessions, etc. The kids had a say in them, but DP and I finalised them. His younger two seem happy for me to enforce rules, but I always leave it to him with the older two to enforce them if necessary - because their relationship with me isn't so solid yet. I'd recommend making it clear to the kids that the rules are their dad's as much as they're yours.

The kids really did seem keen to have the rules all written down, and I think it helps them not to feel they'll get told off for things they hadn't realised weren't allowed.

Your rules sound sensible to me - with the exception of the fighting over the x-box rule - I could see this being problematic as one child may perceive that they didn't cause the fight, and were then punished for it. I'd suggest having an agreed time for each of them when they have the rights to play on it, and can choose to allow others to play with them if they wish. But this is a good one to ask the kids what they think would work.

Does seem highly unlikely this is coming from the DC.
Children of that age tend to be fairly accepting of their environment.

How exactly was this announced ?
Have you asked your DD whether they seemed at all unhappy/disgruntled ?
"Your mum's a bit strict" or anything ?
Is DP

Either you're a witch or it's the XP.

What is the DP doing to resolve this?