to be amazed at the price of prams

[Greavesey]

Firstly, Hi. Post Number 1. Ever. :)

Went pram shopping with DW the other week and was massively shocked at the price and complexity of these previously unknown machines. I mean I've looked online as well and its mental. DW wants the full-monty travel system with Isofix pebble cabrios etc, we're talking the best part of £800. AIBU for two things.
1 expecting prams to be cheap
2 expecting hoping DW to consider 2nd hand, ebay etc

Short and sweet.

Definitely work out what you need.

We did get a new pram as we found what we wanted at a factory shop(?)

But I would have gone for 2nd hand.

I loved looking at the new stuff in the shops-but prices just put me off.

Can´t resist a bargain, me!

My 3 DC's all had Maclarens umbrella type pushchairs, they were practically flat and I never had any indication that they were not cozy enough. If it was really cold I put them in a snowsuit. They always faced away from me but I never saw that as a problem either. I used to walk a lot with them often with an older sibling hanging off the back of the pushchair.
I did use to be in and out the car a lot so the ease of collapsing the pushchairs was a big plus for me.

I like our Maclaren Techno XLR for DD age 2 (and sometimes her 4yr old brother when he's really tired ) . Umbrella fold for planes too.

But my fave buggies / prams have one long handle + can be pushed one- handed. Maclaren MX3 is no longer made but is around 2nd hand - large 3-wheeler for car boots but FAB to push - literally with one finger. I love it!
Can also get carrycots for it in theory.

For newborn it depends on what you like - I was adamant that I wanted rear-facing pram-style (bit PFB!) but did go second hand both times. Large M&P old-style bouncy pram was bulky for buses but great suspension for walking.

Double FirstWheels pram for baby/toddler combo - half price immaculate condition through second hand shop near us.

Agree with other posters to consider sorting your car seat separately - Isofix click in base for Maxi-Cosi seats seem like a pricey extra but are great when baby is crying and you don't want to faff with seatbelts.

Okay you don't have to read this but it might help, my pram history:

DD1, we were offered a free travel system from friends (old style as eight years ago) which was great as it saved us several hundred pounds (I was looked at similar new ones at the time.
It was also great as I realised within three weeks of DD1 birth it was much too bulky to meet my pram needs.
We purchased a from birth stroller as we took DD1 to Spain at two months and that was all I used for the next 12 months.
I then purchased (for nearly £400 at the time) a P+T double as DD2 was born with just a 15month gap.
This was worth the ££ as I didn't have access to a car during the day and couldn't have bussed anywhere with a conventional double.
We had several strollers throughout the years and my favourite a quinny zapp (you can now get the zapp extreme suitable from birth).
I currently have two DD walking and one in a Petite Zia Star which I love. Apart from the P+T and a couple of strollers everything has been second hand from ebay and fine. Gumtree is also good as you can view.

Anyway I would buy a NEW Maxi cosy car seat and a frame second hand that it's compatible with (there are many).
HTH

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/pushchair_chat/1573313-Research-for-Child-Transportation-design-project

please share you thoughts on buggies and prams, with a product designer who want to improve design.

Going against the grain. I hate the Maclaren xlr . Have as plane buggy. Even now at a year and a half little one slumps in in and basically hangs from the straps! Must be awful for spine for every day. When used in newborn mode it's drafty, rickety, and uncomfortable to push.

The bugaboo cameleon we have had 3 years, have used everyday for that time ( with two children). It's larger but goes on buses easy, bounces up curbs great, easy to push with one hand ( actually with a buggy board on also it easier that just pushing the xlr). They hold there value too so I expect we shall get a good return back a few years down the line

I love my cameleon too! The one hand push is a good point. I found my maclaren quest impossible to push with one hand, and the suspension is hopeless for country roads. But it folds really small and takes up no space in the car. And as I have said already, you need an umbrella fold for the plane.

Yabu. I mean yes they are v spendy but they are a v personal thing. I still balk at putting a new born baby in a second hand pram - though I know it's daft because obviously they can be cleaned and also because I don't bat an eyelid at second hand clothes toys etc for dd! I just am my grandmother on this one!

A friend of exp told him big travel systems were not worth the money and not to spend more than £100. This was a bit rich since I later spied a Phil and reds in their house! And this from a man who drives a gleaming new Audi estate.

I digress......if you insist on eBay there are some prams which are worth looking at second hand die to the quality. For example I covet a friend's bugaboo gecko which still looks beautiful 3rd hand! I imagine this is also the case for mutsy, iCandy, concord and the other high spec brands.
I am currently selling my Quinny biz and I think it looks great after 3 years!
I'd be cross if I was coerced in to having a 2nd hand graco - sorry.

You can buy a 2nd hand isofix/easy base though - it's not like they get scruffy but my god they make life easier especially if you drive a hatchback! I bought mine for £47 on eBay - saving of £50 I think

Its worth really sitting down and thinking about what you will use the pushchair for.

I don't drive so I walk and take the bus a lot so I opted for a light weight pushchair that I could fold one handed. I wanted something narrow so I could zip in and out of shops and not get stuck behind clothes rails and with a really deep basket so I could carry lots of shopping. I got something along the lines of the Graco Citisport/Chicco Simplicity (they don't make my version any more but these two are a similar design and price).

The basket is deep so I could get loads in (6 bottles of wine at least ), I tied other shopping bags to the handles and could balance another big bag on the hood. When the DC wanted to get out then I could push the buggy one handed and hold their hands too, something I struggled with when I got another pushchair with the standard two handled design. I could also put one hand in my pocket when it was cold. It had a seat I could recline easily and not jerkily so when DD/DS fell asleep I could lay them down without waking them up.

It was crap in the snow/sleet/slush so I bought a cheap (£100) three wheeler with pneumatic tyres for the winter (I lived abroad at the time).

I had them in a Moby wrap sling for a few months which was fab, really made life easier as no shop/building was off limits and it helped them with colic etc.

The buggy lasted five years, two children and lots of weekly 'big shops' until the wheels fell off; the three wheeler is still going, if a little rusty around the axle.

I had a standard pushchair that I kept at my mum's house (mother care bottom of the range thing) but I didn't get on with the two handled design at all and it was really hard to push. We also had a 1980's Maclaren that my dad 'rescued' for us, that we used for flying and it was lovely. I was really sad when it got broken by baggage handlers.

We didn't have the money to spend on a top of the range pushchair but

posted too soon:

' but I was very happy with our cheaper pushchairs because they suited our lifestyle and needs perfectly.'

The public transport thing is a good point - buzz bloody hopeless (but great if you walk miles) zapp amazing and tiny for bus and boot
I can't hack umbrella folds as I am alone and can't fold them one handed. You can fold a baby jogger one handed but they don't go up kerbs v well - its a bit of a mine field!

Just get a bugaboo bee +
One handle is a must in this day of mobiles and texting (which is impossible with a maclaren)
The best stroller to get once baby is 1 is a baby jogger citi mini.

There is a new baby jogger coming out versa or something. If I was doing baby time again, then this would be the best buggy ever for me ( and I have tried most of the ones mentioned on this thread)

Crackcrack
The baby jogger citi mini 4 wheel goes up kerbs a treat!

If you are quite analytical about your lifestyle and likely usage and choose a travel system well, it could be your perfect choice. I do wonder whether all the people saying "oh six months later we ditched it for a maclaren" really thought carefully about what they needed before they bought.

We got a Britax Vigour travel system and it has worked out very economical for us. The group 0+ car seat is sooo handy and quick for when you are doing multiple errands and need to nip in and out of places without disturbing a sleeping child. The carrycot fitting was great for the first 5-6mo (winter baby and very cosy) and doubled as a downstairs moses basket and for when we were staying away. The seat attachment reclines flat so for longer walks it is very versatile and can face either way - great for when you want to chatter to each other AND for when you want a bit of peace or the baby to be able to watch the world go by. And the total cost was much less than your OP mentioned - around £400.

My only regret was not buying the double version straight away. We didn't think we were going to be able to have another child, especially not so fast! If you are planning to have 2 with a fairly small gap, I'd consider going for a double option. When we bought the double chassis (only 19mo after buying initially), the carrycot and carseat both fitted, so it wasn't a completely new system. I love the B-Dual too though it is heavier - but with 2 under 2 there wasn't much option other than some kind of double buggy. It's going strong and #3 is due soon - I'm pretty sure it'll last us until we're done having kids and they can walk.

We've used the BJCM from birth, and got the carseat adaptors so we could fit the carseat on top if necessary (I think I got them off ebay for a tenner). It was the only one that fit in the back of our Ford Ka but it's been brilliant in many ways, particularly on planes as it just folds in half and is about the same dimensions as a suitcase. We paid just shy of 200 pounds for it together with a couple of accessories (fleece liner, rain cover and bar) at an independent shop.

It's been fantastic so far, particularly pushing DS around till he fell asleep and then putting the wonderful blackout hood down and going for a coffee, but I needed my slings too - Moby and Wilkinet when he was tiny, Boba once he hit 20lbs. We were given a BabyBjorn style one too, lousy piece of shite which did our backs in (DS is a chubster).

Can't remember what the new version of the Britax Vigour is - sorry! But definitely go for one handle, and an adjustable height one if possible. That has been a lifesaver when I've struggled with SPD and sciatica in subsequent pregnancies. And for very tall friends.

Shattered - 4 wheels you say.....I just found mine so hard to push and the handle is a weird height! I thought it was the buggy of my dreams but I couldn't get on with it zapp extra is the closest I can get to dream buggy

Look at your lifestyle & budget then decide. We bought an Oyster which has been brilliant. DS is 15mo and we still use it every day.

We don't have a car but walk a lot & take public transport a lot. It's narrow enough to fit down most London bus aisles. I've never been asked to fold it on a bus. It would be a bit bulky for a small car boot but it's robust & comfy for long walks. Great & accessible shopping basket too. But a bit heavy.

I also LOVE that it's parent facing. We can turn it round and sometimes do but generally have kept it parent facing so we can chat to DS - otherwise I get a bit lonely pushing him around & not being able to chat/sing to him as easily! I didn't expect that at all but DH is the same.

If I were buying again I'd buy it again. We got it online for just over £400.

I'd consider: bugaboo bee if cheaper; maclaren xlr or city jogger if parent facing

But that's just what suits me. You might have other needs.

2nd hand or not is just a case of your budget & whether you want something you couldn't buy new (or don't want to). If you & your DW work out what you want first, maybe the 2nd hand or not decision will be clearer!

Either way YANBU really.

We've bought a mid-range one - considering how much we'll be using it and how much design and engineering seems to go into them, I think they're fairly reasonable. I expect there is a parent-premium but I compare them to bike prices and they seem to fall into the same range.

Given that you're going to put the most previous thing you'll ever own into it on a regular basis, you kind of want it to be special and feel safe as well as being practical. And of course there's always eBay etc for the cheaper options.

Just a snippet of info - when I had my PFB, I bought a travel system, the complete works:- pram chassis, carry cot, pushchair seat, car seat, sun shade, rain cover, cosy toes etc. etc. all big brand poncey stuff, and the whole lot cost me approx £350 new, in 2005. I've noticed now that exactly the same make and model travel system is still available, but now costs £800.00. So in 7 years the price has gone up by 2.25x (checks online calculator...) I've noticed this general trend in baby gear, it's all now being pushed as a lifestyle luxury type of value added thing, rather than a commodity/essential thing.

It was all so massive that I used it for approx 4 months, until poor DD could be strapped into an upright position in a much cheaper, more practical umbrella fold buggy.

I reused it all for my second-born DS, and I got much more use out of the travel system second time round, as we'd moved house, we now have a 3m x 3m hallway, anything less couldn't accommodate it.

I am amazed how many posters are talking about the prams( plural) they have had. If this is an exercise in saving money, then surely you only want one. Look at your lifestyle, and think about where you will store it. These things take up tonnes of room, so IMO, you don't want 3or4 cluttering up your hallway. Will most of your walks be from the house, or from the car? That should be a major factor. Ask other mums with. Similar lifestyles what they like, don't like about their prams. You also might think about 2nd child. Good quality lasts, and you can get seats that fit onto some prams, rather than facing about with a double buggy.

Yy to baby oysters - if I had a bigger gap between my dc (and dd1 wasn't so bloody lazy!) I would be buying an oyster for dd2- no question about it. They are lovely, compact, stylish and v reasonable prams - I really covet them! Def a v decent cheaper alternative to a bugaboo bee.

If you plan 2 dc close together you might as well consider a Phil and teds - upfront investment for a v durable buggy which converts. I'm getting one for dd2 to share with dd1 - did I mention she was a lazy bugger? As cant cope with her out of a pushchair just yet. They are much lighter to push than they look

Got a 2nd hand baby jogger citi mini for $180 In 2010. Bought it because it was light, from birth up, and we lived up 3 flights of stairs at the time DS was born, so light-and-easy-to-fold-and-carry was vital. We still using it now to cart a VERY tall 36lb DS, who's 2, about the place (mainly cos I can't physically drag him away from the swings, etc, he's too heavy to carry when protesting. But I CAN buckle him in. Mean mean mummy..)
You can use it from birth, we LOVE the one-hand-fold (that's what sold it to DH!) and I've taken it twice on transatlantic flights.

Think about your lifestyle. What're the pavements like where you live? (bad pavements/ lots of rough tracks and you may want air tyres). Do you want to jog with the baby in the pushchair? Will you / dw be mainly walking around your home area and on public transport (light, easy to fold with one hand) or using it out -of- the-car (weight less important).

For us, it really mattered to have a single handle (because I'm often walking the dog at the same time, therefore only have one hand for the pushchair, and also to have a decent hood as we live somewhere that can get v. hot and sunny.

That put me off the Maclaren XLR, which was our other best lightweight, from-birth 'other option' - it's a 2 handled pushchair. But otherwise well worth your consideration :)

Now looking at 2 seaters - but the Citi Mini has seen out 2 kids over 5 years and doesn't have even a rattle, it's a bloody good buggy. You can also clip a carseat into it for a few months, which if you have a sleeping baby in the car and just want to clip the carseat on, is a GOOD thing!

Every single mother I know who bought an expensive travel system got rid of it within the first 6 months and got a MacClaren or City-Mini/Quinny style thingy. EVERYONE. Even if you can't persuade your DW to go second hand, I'm fairly sure you can talk her down from the nearly-a-grand models to the 200-300 quid new models. You really do need to find the one you like and think will work, it's like a car, you'll use it multiple times a day.

Oh! And get a sling. Ergo worked v. well for us, used it for nearly 2 years. DS was happiest in there for the first 6 month of his life, wayyy happier than anywhere else. And we could get other stuff done so easily! :) Good luck!

(oooh, crackcrackcrack the P&T's is the only 'one that got away' for me - now we're looking for a double I wish I'd had one from the start (as I wouldn't have to buy another!). SIL loves hers. The reason I didn't go for it back in 2010 was that they're less common here in the USA and so far far harder to find a good deal, or second hand. But that's pretty much the only stroller I wish I'd got instead of the citi mini! :)