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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think allowing children to pick teams has no place in a modern school

121 replies

ReallyTired · 21/09/2012 21:44

Ie. the set up when sadistic games teacher picks two favourites as team captains and then the team captains pick children for their team. The last three are the fat kid, the kid with smelly breath and the kid with hearing aids.

Surely its possible to have a hockey lesson in a primary school with without the painful experience of being last to be picked. I feel that a teacher could have games groups just like they have groups for maths and english. There could be two top groups, two middle groups and two bottom groups. Each group of children would be challenged competition wise and there would be no popularity contest.

My son's teacher has been using this approach and I have made a formal complaint to the head teacher. My son was the second last to be picked as he is very uncoorindated. (Ds has had child phyio in the past) He felt sorry for the kid with bad breathe that no one wanted on their team.

My son's school will not give out any prizes on sports days to the winners for fear of hurting the feelings of children who don't get prize. It is not logical that they don't chose to spare the feelings of the rejectee child who is put off sport for life.

OP posts:
Seenenoughtoknow · 22/09/2012 09:21

Backforgood - yes I agree with with you, they are just our opinions, but I think I was taken aback by eviltwins' "don't you have anything better to do?" question, which I thought was very patronising and a bit offensive. I have to assume that she/he does not have children yet, as I would think anyone watching their children going through such a difficult time would be doing anything to help the situation. It is heartbreaking to think your child might be suffering.

Agentzigzag - I was quite sporty at school, and was lucky enough never to be picked last but I felt DESPERATELY sorry for those who were, so I don't think it's a case that you don't see it if it doesn't happen to you. The only people who don't see it are those who are insensitive to other people's feelings, and I can only assume that brings them their own troubles later on in life.

Seenenoughtoknow · 22/09/2012 09:24

Reallytired - that's great news - I am happy for both you and your child...really well done for doing something about it. :)

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 09:57

Yes, I have kids. I was also pretty shocking at sport at school and was often picked last. I just think that the hysteria about PE Teacher's being evil bullies is ridiculous. Honestly, the fact that EVERY education thread ends up with people piling in and citing their OWN school days, 10, 20 or 30 years ago as evidence of how it must be now really winds me up. Many posters have no idea about the research which has gone into groupings in classes- I have attended two INSETs about it! It's right at the beginning of the school year- many schools are still getting target grades in their systems and internally assessing students' levels, after which teachers have far more information available by which to group students in their classes for activities.

Oh and as for the classic MN teacher insult (I'm glad you don't teach MY child) - how do you know where I teach? Wink

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 09:58

Ugh- iPhone has autocorrected teachers to Teacher's.

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 09:58

PE "Teacher's" are very often evil bullies. Sorry it's fact.

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 10:01

No it isn't. What a ridiculous thing to write. Unless of course you've carried out extensive research, watched EVERY PE teacher in the country teach, interact with students and observe them running extra curricular activities. None of the PE staff where I teach are, so that blows your theory.

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 10:10

well no funnily enough I haven't carried out research using cronbach's alpha to verify the co-efficiency of the variables, I am just speaking from personal experience, as are you.

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 10:20

Yes, but in this case, my personal experience is more extensive than yours. I hated Geography at school, 25 years ago. However, I also accept that not ALL geography teachers are tedious middle aged bores with no interest in educating children.

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 10:23

ah but how do you know that?

Seenenoughtoknow · 22/09/2012 10:25

Eviltwins - my children's secondary school is small so there is no designated drama teacher - it is usually a second subject for another teacher who's main subject is something completely different - so I know ;)

Anyway, that aside, I understand that teaching is a million times better than it used to be, and as another poster mentioned, teachers are taught how to do the team division 'thing' in a fairer way now, but it doesn't get away from the fact that the sports teacher in 'reallytired's' school either didn't listen in that particular class, or has chosen to take no notice of it.

It is genuinely not a reflection on the way you, or any other teacher teaches, as in every school there are wonderful teachers and some not so good teachers. I think most people wouldn't tar them all with the same brush. I understand why you would want to defend a fellow teacher, but not if they are doing wrong and not adhering to their training.

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 10:32

besides I never said ALL PE teachers are evil bullies, I said 'very often' they are which is subjective.

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 10:35

Nelly- I know because in the school I teach in, one Geography teacher is a very glam 20-something woman and the other is a male NQT. They're both enthusiastic and care about their students. So that's at least two who aren't like mine was Wink

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 10:38

oooh Iknow it's beside the point but for some reason London in the seventies was full of Welsh teachers, and there was this dreadful pair of rugby boys who used to steam through the dining room on the way to the sport lessons, where some poor kid who had haemophilia would be sitting doing his homework, shouting WIMP at him....
its OK I know 30 year old personal anecdotes are rubbish but still.....

YouMayLogOut · 22/09/2012 10:42

YANBU

Kalisi · 22/09/2012 10:52

Being a teacher does not necessarily give you a greater knowledge of teachers. Infact, knowing other teachers on a personal/work colleague level is probably more likely to create a biased view so I don't agree with you EvilTwins on that respect. I do however see what you mean about people using out of date experiences to form their opinions. I for one am very guilty of that. I went to three schools and went through atleast 7 different P.E teachers. All except one were complete knobends :-(

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 10:55

EvilTwins says that her experience is more extensive than mine because the two teachers in her school are very nice.
The logic astounds me.

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 10:56

I think that being a teacher gives you a better knowledge of teachers than being a person who went to school 30 years ago and has nothing to do with schools or teachers since... I've taught in 3 school, and have never come across an evil bully in the PE dept. I accept that there may well be nasty PE teachers elsewhere but the assumption that all/most/a great many are is ridiculous and unfair.

EvilTwins · 22/09/2012 10:57

Nelly- I was being facetious. My experience IS more extensive than yours. You are basing your prejudices on people who taught you in the 70s. I am basing my opinions on current practice.

Meglet · 22/09/2012 11:00

yanbu. Another (almost) always picked laster here too. TBH the 'Queen Bees' probably didn't want me on their team, they never threw the netball to me anyway, I used to stand there on the court being ignored.

Not that it still pisses me off 25yrs on

NellyJob · 22/09/2012 11:06

I do base my opinion on my own experience yes, of course, but also on what I have seen at the schools that my children have attended, and that thing of picking the two most popular and sporty kids and getting them to pick a team one by one, DOES still go on, trust me.

Also i will never forget peeping in through the school gates and watching a great fat, no actually obese, class teacher all wrapped up in a wooly coat, screaming at some small children running around in their underwear. It made me feel ill.

Rosebud05 · 22/09/2012 11:40

Good for you reallytired. Hopefully this practice is a dying one.

LucieMay · 22/09/2012 11:58

I never understood why they put people he ability groups for every other subject except PE. I was academic but rubbish at sport. PE was an horrific experience and I'd have enjoyed it much more had I just been in a class with people who were just as rubbish as me, rather than half being the year's top athletes.

Viviennemary · 22/09/2012 12:03

It's a horrible idea. A girl at my school was always last to be picked. She was hopeless at sports and wasn't very nice either but even I felt sorry for her. Not that I was a exactly a sports star myself. Grin

dysfunctionalme · 22/09/2012 12:05

Not really relevant but this thread reminded me of a boy I was at primary school with. He died youngish in a car accident as he was haemophiliac. And my most powerful memory of him is when he had to pick a team and he pointed at me and said, "her". The teacher gave him hell for calling me "her" (although I, at 8, didn't actually mind or notice, I think we were all a bit patchy with respect). Anyway, my most enduring memory of him is being told off for team picking and him standing there looking sheepish. And now he's dead. Weird is life.

Kalisi · 22/09/2012 12:41

People with school age children or who know school age children can base their opinions on more than just their experiences of when they ' went to school 30 years ago'

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