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AIBU?

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Original poster

Having a baby to get a council house

70 replies

Tryingtobenice · 20/09/2012 13:10

I've always thought this was nonesense and the sort of thing spouted by men of a certain age and type but since becoming a mum I've realised what utter utter bollocks it is.

Having a baby is so much harder work than work. Certainly than sitting on your arse in an office (like me) and even standing for hours on end in a shop or behind a bar (always found this much harder than office work!).

It makes me feel real contempt for anyone trotting out the line that girls have babies to get a house. Especially if they have a child themselves.

Also gives me new found respect for the teen mums I know. I may not respect their lacklustre approach to contraception ( this comment is person specific, I know genuine accidents happen all too easily) but boy do I respect the way they've handled the result. I'm too selfish to parent well in my thirties, at 15 I would have been a disaster.

Given that so many people have done the newborn baby thing how on earth can such prejudice survive? Teen mums (and dads) need awards not vilification.

OP posts:
Noqontrol · 20/09/2012 14:08

I know someone who did do that to get a council house. The problem is you don't know how hard it is to care for a baby until you've actually had the baby.

NellyJob · 20/09/2012 14:11

if there were more opportunities for school leavers perhaps fewer girls would do this, but it's a fact that some of do get pregnant in order to set up their own home, something that would otherwise be out of their reach.
there's a whole culture of it in certain towns and cities, and to pretend otherwise is naive.

Original poster
Tryingtobenice · 20/09/2012 14:14

Well if it is as prevalent as all that I'm starting to pity people who mistakenly think it's an easy ride.

I'm baffled by people having second or third kids for a bigger place. They must know how tough it is.

OP posts:
TroublesomeEx · 20/09/2012 14:16

But, sadly, parenting is only hard if it is done properly.

BlackberryIce · 20/09/2012 14:22

Where are the dads in all these scenarios?

Nancy66 · 20/09/2012 14:22

folkgirl is right

parenting a baby is hard if done right.

But if you: forget to feed it, ignore it when it cries, get drunk all the time and go out and leave it alone for hours on end then it's probably piss easy.

CheeseandPickledOnion · 20/09/2012 14:23

It's naive because it won't get you a house, but I don't think you can say it hasn't been done in the past.

And just because they may eventually handle motherhood well, and that motherhood is hard, I highly doubt anyone who took that route realised what they were getting into before it actually happened.

I certainly know of several girls I went to school with who made it clear they were taking that route out of having to work, and followed through. And got houses.

Chigley1 · 20/09/2012 14:23

I teach in an area of considerable deprivation. The fact is many local girls who leave school and don't have the qualifications necessary to get an even averagely paid job just have no other way of moving out of their parental home. Having a baby seems like an easy route to independence in many cases.
They are then caught in the benefits trap.

70isaLimitNotaTarget · 20/09/2012 14:28

YY come to Romford.

I hear mums (with their buggies) openly chatting to mates and on their phones about their 'plans' their 'rights'.
I'm sure alot of it is blah blah blah to annoy the Daily Mail Reader Pearl Clutchers.

But when I'm wandering round, (I work 3 days a week) on my non-work days, I look at them and think "Is this really how you saw your life panning out? Is this your life-plan? "

It's Sad because I know how difficult it is (we have no family near) so DH and I have to manage everything. And even with 2 people working it's difficult.
I cannot seriously believe that someone thinks "Oh, I'll have a baby. That will save me having to work" but I hear to the contrary.

And yes, parenting is hard work if done properly.
So when I see children being ignored, shouted at , told to "shut up" or "I'll give you a slap" without even looking up from their texting, ...... Hmm

Original poster
Tryingtobenice · 20/09/2012 14:29

I know a few teen mums. My cousins mostly, and their girlfriends. I am just so much more impressed with the great job they've done with bog all money and so little life experience. They didn't do it to get council housing (as far as I know) and now I'm doing it myself I just realise quite what a feat it was / is.

Maybe that is my real point more than the council house thing, if I'm so naive as it seems.

OP posts:
melliebobs · 20/09/2012 14:34

Not had chance to read this thread but I have to laugh at people who say this or even the deluded little girls who think having a baby will get them a council house! Dh works in social housing and in applications for past 6 years and believe me having a baby isn't necessarily going to get you a house. No matter what a lot of people think. A room in a women's refuge/hostel maybe

Tamoo · 20/09/2012 14:34

Agree with Chig. I don't think having a baby to get a house is the norm, rather having a baby to start a grown-up life, as they perceive it. For a teenage girl with no academic aspirations, and perhaps a difficult home life, having a child might be a way for them to make the transition into adulthood, where more educated or privileged teenagers do this through further education and by following career aspirations.

Also, don't discount the fact that a lot of them simply meet a partner, fall in love, and take the next instinctive step (by accident or design). One of my best friends at school had a baby at sixteen; she and the father planned it and they were very much together. Years on they're still solid and actually the most successful couple I know. Obviously it rarely works out so well but it's easy to say after the event that they were being "feckless" when many teenage parents do start out with good intentions to work or get further qualifications when their children are a bit older.

Anonymumous · 20/09/2012 14:41

I don't think that having babies is harder than work. Confused Being at home with a baby is a delicious life of doing what you want to, when you want to, and having endless cuddles with an adorable and adoring infant. Going to toddler groups or the park, meeting up with friends, having time to experiment in the kitchen... I have such a nice, easy life as a stay-at-home Mum that I feel guilty for it sometimes! Maybe I've just had the three easiest babies ever, but I suspect that would be a bit of a coincidence. I just can't work out what's so "Hard" about it.

I'm a bit Hmm at Tweasels' comment (and others) that if someone doesn't find it hard it's because they don't give a shit about getting it right. I care desperately about giving my children the best and happiest start in life possible, but I also know I am doing the best I can for them. If it turns out in twenty years' time that I got it wrong, I will be looking back with the benefit of hindsight. Right now I have nothing to feel guilty for (except perhaps for not doing the housework quite as often as I should...!)

(Oh, and just to confirm, my baby is breastfed often, picked up instantly as soon as she utters even the smallest cry, I have never been drunk even once in my whole life, and I would never, ever dream of leaving her alone anywhere. OK?!)

Kayano · 20/09/2012 14:42

I don't think being a mother is harder work than a job either.

No way. (Speaking as a new mother)

Latara · 20/09/2012 14:42

It doesn't happen here in the South coast area where i live - because there is minimal spare social housing - i think i said this on another thread.

My cousin was stuck in a tiny bedroom at her parents' house aged late 20s for 2 years before getting a flat.

Also, a young woman who i know with a baby & a 5 yr old recently became homeless so she's been stuck in a hostel for months with the baby & child.

In both cases they'd conceived their children in what they thought would be long term relationships, hopefully leading to marriage. But their boyfriends left them.

TroublesomeEx · 20/09/2012 14:44

mellie I agree that it doesn't happen quite like that anymore, but it doesn't mean some people won't still be getting the message that it's an option from other people who managed it in easier times.

The fact that some people think it's an option doesn't reflect the reality. I'd suggest that if they had the ability to critically evaluate the situation, they wouldn't be go ahead with it in the first place. Those who recognise the reality of the situation are the ones who don't do it.

Shagmundfreud · 20/09/2012 14:44

YABU

I'm sure there are people who have children in order to get a council home.

I would do it myself if I was them.

Girls from the most deprived families often leave education with no or poor qualifications. Even those who do OK in school often end up earning less than 18K a year in poorly paid admin or childcare jobs. What hope do they have if they DON'T have children of getting social housing. Being poorly paid and living in private sector accommodation is a one way ticket to a life of poverty. It's also a benefits trap.

So as I said - YABU. And I both understand and support some women's decision to do this.

Kayano · 20/09/2012 14:49

18k is a canny good wage in the north east

That's what I am on with my degree and 11 years work exp

(Just sayin')

TroublesomeEx · 20/09/2012 14:50

I'm a bit at Tweasels' comment (and others) that if someone doesn't find it hard it's because they don't give a shit about getting it right. I care desperately about giving my children the best and happiest start in life possible, but I also know I am doing the best I can for them. If it turns out in twenty years' time that I got it wrong, I will be looking back with the benefit of hindsight. Right now I have nothing to feel guilty for

That's not really the scenario people are talking about though, is it? I'm sure you realise that really. Everyone makes mistakes despite their best efforts. My DH and I make mistakes all the time! I know I do things better with DD than I did with DS because I had 7 years of parenting and life experience under my belt when she was born and I still don't claim to get everything right with her. But it's the caring about doing your best that is relevant.

Not everyone is trying to give their children the best and happiest start in life. I know this because I used to work with some, live amongst some and am now related (through marriage) to some. Sometimes selfish incompetent people have babies. Although that is applicable to people of all ages.

ArtfulAardvark · 20/09/2012 14:53

I'd like to think no one was so stupid that they would have a child as they think it would get them a home - unfortunately I have come to the decision that I should never underestimate just how stupid some people are.

I dont think this is helped by the fact that I live in a leafy rural quite expensive area, one of DHs school friends had always worked in farming but the farm he worked for decided it would like to sell his (rather lovely) farm cottage. He phoned the HA and said "hi losing my home, low paid farm worker what are my chances of getting housed" their response "if you have a girlfriend get her pregnant, otherwise practically zero"

Friend, to his credit, didnt consider it for a moment.

Fishwife1949 · 20/09/2012 14:53

I think that might have been true years and years ago my sister was 18 when she had my nephew and got house stright away but she is 41 so that was yonks ago

But i dont think that happens now the council waiting list were i live is 10 years and 25 if your single

I have a friend who has 4 children and was waiting for 3 or 4 bed to come free well a 3 bed came ip on a well dodgy estate

The housing guy told her off the recored that she should take it because this is the first 3 bed that had been free in 6 years and if she didnt she would likey wait another 6 years to get housed and this is somone of whom one of their children is blind

Original poster
Tryingtobenice · 20/09/2012 14:54

Huh. I do 60 hour weeks in the sort of role where I fly into moscow at 11pm, meet clients until 2am and then get up to run a 60 person workshop at 7am. I genuinely thought my job was pretty demanding and having a baby would be easier but 4 months in I'm just not finding that!
It's the mixture of constant demand on attention and repetitive boredom that I find hard. Maybe a personal thing.

OP posts:
TroublesomeEx · 20/09/2012 14:56

Oh no Trying. It is hard! At least at work you get a scheduled coffee break and no one bangs on the door demanding a conference when you're sitting on the loo! Wink

Fishwife1949 · 20/09/2012 14:56

Even ss cant ge people housed even when the children are likey to be taken into care because of housing issues (confused) so i really dont know were people get this from

OneMoreChap · 20/09/2012 15:01

FolkGirl Thu 20-Sep-12 14:56:06
At least at work you get a scheduled coffee break and no one bangs on the door demanding a conference when you're sitting on the loo!

Depends where you work. I've had someone banging on a trap door wanting me to join a conference call - even offering to get me a cordless handset Sad