to not understand the issue with photos

[crazybutterfly]

Ds (10 months) attended his first party today. One of the organisers conmented on how cute he looked ib jyst his nappy (I'd stripped him down for food) and party hat, but followed this up with a conment about not being allowed to take photos. When i queried why she explsined that to do so would require them to get get written consent off all parents (party was organised by church).

Also, earlier in the week when completing forms etc ready fo ds to start nursery it was explained to me that they take photos of the children doing activites etc to hmgo in learming records and that they used to sebd dvds of these home but since somepne put them on facebook they have had to stop.

So aibu:

1. not to understand the whole permission thing
2. not get what the issue with facebook

Oops forgot to add and if i abiu please enlighten me :-)

The issue is that people feel there is too much open access to photos of their children and they don't want photos being on the internet when they have no control over them. Some people fear that paedophiles will use the photos for kicks but I think that's a rare enough concern.

I have no problem with people including my DS in photos or putting the photos up on the internet, but other people do worry about it and I respect that so I'm careful about who I photograph and where I put them.

I think the issue in some rare cases can be child protection if they have been removed from their birth family and the family manage to track them down through photos put on facebook.

Its a child protection issue for adopted and fostered children and those who have escaped domestic violence.

Some children are adopted/fostered and may be subject to orders which mean that their pictures cannot be published, the general population would not know who these children are so may inadvertently post their photos on places like FB and the www in general.

Some families just do not want pictures posted of their children, if that is how parents feel it is their right to withhold permission to do so.

Well I don't have a problem with putting my children's pictures on fb or other social media but some people like to keep things private. At least I have control over them and who sees them

My childrens photographs that I ordered from Truprint have recently got lost in the post though, and THAT I am very worried about. I had some naked first bath pics of DS and some of DD in the bath. These types of pics I would never make public on FB or the internet.

Child protection issues are VERY common, you wouldn't even know they don't tend to be in the media for obvious reasons, but kidnapping by extranged (usually for DV reasons) fathers or MILs etc is quite common

I'ld say in any group over about 30 there are likely to be one or two children who have someone who for one reason or another the primary carers don't want knowing what church etc they attend.

Ok that makes sense, will make sure that it i take photod with other people's children in i speak to them regarding their view on facebook.

Just one more question though what if i take a photo of ds in a public place and there you can see stranger's children in the background does that mean i can't post it (I live far from grandparents so like to share photos). Btw i have stict privacy settings due to work

*strict - stupid phone

In the old days, you got your picture in the local paper, that was as far as it went (save for private newspaper archive).

Nowadays, letting people take a digital photo of your child is like dropping a feather off a tower block. You let it go and it's proper gone.

That's why I don't like it - aside from obviously issues with people who might want access to your child, and aren't allowed it, seeing those photos and figuring out where you live, where they go to school etc etc.

I just find it very uncomfortable not having that control over who sees what.

Some families just do not want pictures posted of their children, if that is how parents feel it is their right to withhold permission to do so.

Just in case people read this as a statement of fact I want to point out that parents have no legal right to withhold permission. In England you have very little recourse over photos taken of you or your children by someone else.

public places like beach etc with unidendified people in background, that's okay IMO

but if it identifies what school etc the other children in the photo go to or similar (so say sports day with logoed kit with other people's children in the background) then I would check or just make sure there weren't any

Does that make sense?

because for say a beach or theme park, it doesn't give any information about the other children, they could live near there or they could be visiting as a once off it doesn't add any info to a bigger picuture does it?

But church groups, nursery/school events etc that's a huge piece of the puzzle

just to add, that's for kids in the background. If a child is in the foreground with my child anywhere I always ask, I just don't for background if its a public place that doesn't really identify anyone

and if say I take a cute pic of my DS with a friend's child I ask how they want me to share that photo with them, often they ask that I email it not facebook but some ask to facebook it, when I do facebook it I put it on a limited album which is just visible the parents of the kids there

I think you are misguided if you think you have control of ANYTHING you put on the internet crazybutterfly.

Have a look at the CEOP site for guidance.

From a data protection point of view, she's wrong, it's fine to take pictures of children and their friends for person use according to the Information Commissioner's Office

I would try and keep pictures of DCs of mine off the internet as much as possible, not necessarily because of child protection issues, crazy paedo-fear etc, but because I feel it's not really my place to decide to do it on their behalf. When they're adults they can decide what kind of digital identity they want.

We forget that we (or the vast majority of us posting here except the youngest adults) grew up without a digital presence. We have one now, but on our own terms. And certainly any baby photos of us on the internet are there with our knowledge and co-operation. I think as much as possible it should be the same for the next generation (though it's obviously very difficult to enforce).

As everyone else has said child/adult protection issues, if you're hiding from an abusive ex and helping out at the local church kids party you don't want your photo to end up on facebook where anyone could see it.

Ultimately though you don't really need to understand it, you just need to respect it. Some people don't want their/their children's image online, so just don't do it.

Some parents object to photos being taken of their children, so organisations get positive permission.

Copyright of a photograph is owned by the photographer and the subject has no rights to it or where it might be posted or sold on. Out of principle, a lot of people will object to having no control over photos of them or their children.

Some families have safety fears, for example need to be untraceable to abusive relatives, and will live in fear of their whereabouts being revealed in newspapers and social media.

I understand the permission requirements. Most schools now have a blanket sheet to fill in, and if every parent is ok with pictures then they are allowed to be taken.

If there were children who needed protection then a blanket ban would be issued, and parents would be advised.

However if it was a party I would have assumed verbal consent would be sufficient in the circumstances?

Our local hospital had to have signs put up telling parents that pictures are forbidden due to CP. This was strange as why would parents want pictures of their child in hospital anyway ( nb, this is a basic child's ward - not a ward with neonates, and is a short stay ward).

My concerns over photos on the internet is due to a violent birth family living not too far away. If I see anyone taking photos I move us out of shot esp if he is in his school uniform as that gives far too much information away to where we live and how we could be found. Birth famililes have been known to wait around school gates and follow the child home.

I can manage the situation to the best of my ability and I hope that friends and family also respect my wishes and not put pictures on FB.

If the party is hosted by a church, they will have to follow their diocesan policy - which will require written consent.

It's bureaucratic, but the church is held to a very high standard for safeguarding and will get a kicking if they get anything wrong.

I wanted to take pictures of my daughter and her friends at an ice -rink she went to for her (15th) birthday. I was stopped by a member of staff who said it wasn't allowed...unless I paid for a licence ( a few pounds) at reception!! I was a bit miffed by this, and no, I didn't pay!

Also, I can understand the CP angle, as I work in a school, but I think most parents are happy for their children to photographed, especially for newspaper articles. There are some who aren't of course, and it is sad when those children have to sit out when pictures are being taken of acheivements or events.
But where do you draw the line?
I like to have photographic/video memories of things my children have done, and I hate it when we are told we can't take photos at school events. I think it is wrong to assume everyone with a camera has dubious intentions.

"I think it is wrong to assume everyone with a camera has dubious intentions."

I don't think its that, I think its to do with the infinity of digital photography, and how one it goes online it can be added up to all the other bits online (face recognition is getting better all the time so not tagging doesn't mitigate) to tell someone's life story..
now IMO its fine if YOU choose to have YOUR lifestory online, but for me personally it is up to my DCs to decide when they're old enough if they want their whole childhood online or not. If they do, fine, but I want it to be their decision not mine and not parents of their school friends IYKWIM

What MadBusLady said.

My DB has just put a picture up of his 9 months pregnant naked wife on the internet with little or no privacy setting and I just dont get why you would do that (although she does look amazing).