In thinking 40k income really isn't a fortune??

[mummymacbeth]

Yes, a thread about a thread kind of. And I am fairly sure it has been done before but still!

I really don't think a forty grand gross income is a fortune. Our income with two kids is currently a bit less than that, though has been that in the fairly recent past. It is - and was - a bit of a struggle. We are not in the south east, we do not have a huge mortgage, expensive cars, kids are at state school and we don't manage to get abroad every year. We are living from month to month. A "fortune" it ain't!! (ref the post about someone wondering whether to have a fourth child)

"we got a 2004 citreon c8 in immaculate condition with less than 60 000 miles on the clock for under 4k"

I should bloody hope you did!

Oh and ditavonteesed please tell me you have just remembered my name, as its catchy (i hopes!), and not that i have a boring life when ds isnt around and i spent the day on here lol!

Emsyj. Yes someone who is intelligent enough and want to be a doctor will need to go to university. It can be the same thing because if they don't go because of the cost then they may well feel unfulfilled. So i was saying both.

Myself i would have been unfulfilled not being able to follow my love and ability in art and design. Although its not hugely paid its a lot more then i would have got staying at the supermarket.

Im surprised you only know one who needed their degree, i needed mine, my partner his, his sister hers, my few closest friends theirs. Depends i suppose.

i meant undet four thousand.

I know, but really, I already have a car a bit like that (bought from new), and now I'm thinking I should get a new one. It looks a big tragic in the car park at work, and on the drive when the neighbors have much more expensive cars. (Maybe they know some magic place where you can get an X5 for £5K)

I went to a selective (grammar) school and all my close friends went to uni. One of them went into nursing (didn't need a degree then, no idea if you do now), one works for a university (non-academic non-teaching role), two are SAHMs and have never had full time jobs, one works in a fairly low level marketing job. Actually I tell a lie, there are 2 who needed their degrees - one is a special needs teacher and one is a university academic.

Obviously my 'work' friends are all lawyers so they all need their degrees. DH did A-levels then went into work. There are plenty of choices for non-graduates that don't involve the supermarket, that's all I'm saying - and I do think there was a tendency at my school for teachers to peddle the myth that university = great prospects and not going to university = a life on minimum wage. I just don't think that's true these days.

On the issue of housing, have any of you in London with kids ever managed to go from renting to mortgage? If so, how did you get the deposit etc together while paying silly rental prices?

i dont understand why people would buy a brand new car. ours would be twrnty grand new! why pay that when you can get a perfectly good car for mu h less. esp as a new car does not hold its value well generally.

married
utter tripe!
30 years ago I entered Nursing and none of the top Schools of Nursing would touch anyone without good A levels - certainly to be an RN you needed them.
Enrolled nurses had 0 levels in those days.

Most of the old school RNs wouldnt have a clue in the modern day . I think your neighbour probably doesnt like the fact that modern day nurses dont bow and scrape enogh
Degrees have been brought in because most Nurses are so highly qualified that it makes sense to bring graduates UP to their level!

Yes you need a nursing degree now.

I should add that as a midwife I take the basics of care as my bedrock - the foundation of good care.
Having a degree does not mean you ignore this.

Do you still get a bursary to fund the degree? My friend did do a degree (by choice, not necessity - this was 15 years ago) but got an NHS bursary and so didn't incur any student debt - which was a fantastic option and she enjoyed every minute of her study and loves her job.

5madthings, DH would agree with you, but there was some strange reason why he bought it for me. Probably partly to do with the finance deal he got, as well as the new style about to be launched = an incredible deal.

I did a degree in psychology and a postgrad in teaching, and used both, first as a developmental psychologist and then as a primary teacher. I am a SAHM now and I work very part time as a magazine editor, so technically I don't use my degree any more, but I'm still glad I did it because it was a fantastic experience.

DH has a degree and PhD and uses both. After 9 years at uni and nearly 4 years in employment he's on £30k which on the scale of things really isn't much I suppose. His income will go up (slowly) over time. He could earn a lot more by not working in academia but academia is what he loves so it makes more sense for him to stay there, despite the comparatively low wages.

Mrs Baggins Point proved. Please re-read my post. It says 35 years ago. There was a world of difference between requirements in 1982 and 1977. 20/30 years ago nursing and midwifery still benefitted from those who qualified in the 50's and 60's. Perhaps by the 1980's the top schools required good A'Levels but they didn't require degrees and an awful lot of UK midwives come up through local routes rather than through the top schools. SEN's required 2/3 O'levels I recall - SRN's a somewhat fuller set.

I recall lots of girls starting nurse training in the sticks (SRN) with 4/5 O'Levels in the late 70s.

married the point of education if it doesn't get you money? I am not sure where to start really with an answer to that. I find it so depressing that academia is only valued by such a money centric society if the only point people can think of is cash value.

For what it is worth is so much more. A love of learning. Developing a questioning mind. Deconstruction of arguments. Media awareness. Knowledge of a subject you are passionate about which will develop over your life. Just pure joy for joys sake. Knowledge for knowledge sake. The cost of the degree was far less than the value I have gained.

I agree with spuddy - I didn't do a degree just for the money it could earn me, I did it because I loved the subject. Incidentally I'm lucky not to have any student debt because I went to uni in Ireland where it's free and I lived at home and worked so I had plenty of money to keep me going. Not everyone who attends uni ends up with debt.

Oh and i used to recruit nurses and midwives for Uni's. You do still receive a bursary and subsidised accommodation from the NHS. You can leave without debt and not having to work for the NHS for day if you don't want to - you can go abroad and work for private if you wish.

You need A levels now or an access to nursing course. There used to be diplomas which accepted lower qualifications but that changed about 2/3 years ago i think.

Emsyj
All NHS course are bursaried. As far as i am aware anyway. The only instance im not 100% sure about is for those training to become doctors as the course length is different.

But the point is spuddy that rafts of people who now have degrees are well qualified rather than well educated. They cannot construct grammatically correct sentences; they cannot handle anything other than the simplest calculation; they watch and talk about X Factor and look askance if I happen to let slip we have been to the opera; they never visit a gallery or the theatre.

Admittedly I'm talking about people who went to former polys rather than traditional universities and who have studied "soft" subjects rather than academic disciplines but it really isn't just about money for degrees; it's about the innate difference between being well qualified and well educated.

I find it rather tragic that so many people have been given the impressin they need a degree and that it is the be all and the end all when for many it isn't.

LynetteScavo

I know, but really, I already have a car a bit like that (bought from new), and now I'm thinking I should get a new one. It looks a big tragic in the car park at work, and on the drive when the neighbors have much more expensive cars. (Maybe they know some magic place where you can get an X5 for £5K)

Not sure if serious, or trolling. An X5 looks tragic wherever it is, ugly as sin.

And there is a magic place where you can get an X5 for £5K - it's called Autotrader.co.uk

Will answer thread first: 40k isn't a fortune if you have huge outgoings - we couldn't live on DH's wage alone. I am happy to work.

Secondly, as I am a nurse (a degree one at that) can I just say that the job has changed massively over the last 20-30 years. As MrsBaggins states, the basics of care forms the foundation. Nursing has (rightly or wrongly) taken on many roles that traditionally drs performed. I think this is for the better. So, yes i need and use my degree everyday.
Where it has gone wrong, is in NHS managers deciding on nurse patient ratios, leaving many wards completely over stretched. There are many reason to why I work in intensive care, but one to one nursing is the biggest reason.

no.not all health courses get bursary at all
ot,salt,physio,medicine all undertaken without automatic bursary funding
medicine is 5yr undergraduate degree

My DBro is a dentist (NHS) and didn't get any NHS funding for living costs, although this was before tuition fees so I'm not sure if the course is still fully funded. He got a student grant (we both started uni in the same year and got 50/50 grant/loan) and preferential rate loans for the years when he was unable to work due to the hours being essentially akin to working hours with very limited holidays, but he didn't get a bursary from the NHS.

Well, i agree with some points and disagree with others married having worked in 3 unis over the last 5 years. Yes, there are third rate unis there which churn out graduates unable to do what i could at gcse level. But sadly employers specify that they want graduates for almost all jobs now.

I worked for a pretty 3rd rate uni brokering internships with companies so they could perhaps get a foot in the door. Trying to prepare the grads for interview was like herding cats. I had to teach basic things like eye contact, what to wear etc. It was amazing that these things weren't automatic in a supposedly educated 23 year old.

Also they were under the impression they were some kind of hot shit. They were usually the 1st in their family to go to uni so presumed they were going to be on the big buck on graduation with a 3rd in business from a 3rd rate uni. THey would often write on job apps 'i wont accept less than 45k'. They would say to me incredulously 'but i'm a graduate' erm, yeah, so am i love!

But all employers just now ask for degree as minimum. I placed one grad in a job doing data entry in Southwark for 13k per year. They insisted on a graduate.

So what's the answer?