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Original poster

to be so moved by the Tony Nicklinson case?

95 replies

Wigglewoo · 17/08/2012 07:10

The poor man :( .. Totally sound of mind but unable to move or communicate except for moving his eyelids ... Denied the right to die.

One of the things that really moved me was how tenderly his wife was caring for him, they have been together so long and there is real unconditional love between them. The kind of love that lasts beyond everything.

So so sad.

OP posts:
achillea · 17/08/2012 08:35

OK so his life is hard, but many people would say that. If a non-disabled person feels depressed we don't tell them - OK, why don't you just put yourself out of your misery. It is our moral duty to help them to feel better.

I do wish people would think things through.

FreeBirdsFlying · 17/08/2012 08:36

Assisted suicide is not murder.

EasilyBored · 17/08/2012 08:36

But he doesn't have the right to go to Switzerland, its. He would need help from his wife to get there, and if she helps him, then she is commiting a crime.

He is a fully mentally capable adult, and should have the right to choose to live or not. If it was a situation where he was refusing a medical treatment that would buy him more time, but offer him no quality of life, no one would judge him for that.

FreeBirdsFlying · 17/08/2012 08:37

Someone who is depressed would not be considered to be of sound mind though.

danteV · 17/08/2012 08:39

Fortunate that he knows what's happening but can't do anything about it. Fortunate he can do nothing for himself?
Do you even know anything about 'going to Switzerland'. Do you realise the person that accomapnies him could be prosecuted here? Do you think he wants that, the risk his wife could be prosecuted after he is gone?
Is he wrong to want to die in his own country with people he knows and loves around him?
I get people have differing opinions on this but honestly itsjust, while I can usually see others pov, your posts are not a reasoned argument against. They just baffle me, you have a strong opinion on something you don't know much about.

EasilyBored · 17/08/2012 08:39

This man's life is not 'hard', it is HELL. To be trapped inside your own body, unable to speak or move, for the rest of your life? That is not just 'hard'.

ThisWeekonFancyPuffin · 17/08/2012 08:39

I know the following is probably impossible, but...

I think it should be decided on a case by case basis in a 'secret court' not because I think there is something to be ashamed of but to save the pain of the families being publicised.

Does that make sense? I'm not sure it does on screen, it does in my head though Hmm

MrsPnut · 17/08/2012 08:40

I felt so wretched watching him on the news last night. He is so adamant that he wants to die but because he has no way of committing suicide he can't do it.

I did hear that someone has offered to pay for him to go Dignitas in Switzerland if he wants to. I think though that Tony wants to exhaust all options here first.

I think that each case should be taken on it's own merits.

Sparklingbrook · 17/08/2012 08:41

But he shouldn't have to fly on a plane to die in strange surroundings in a different country. Sad

FreeBirdsFlying · 17/08/2012 08:42

I can see your point ThisWeek . True dignity for the person involved.

Binkyridesagain · 17/08/2012 08:42

'His life is hard' - he has no life, he just exists, he is a mind locked inside a body, his only means of communication is to use his eyes. He cannot be cured, there is no hope for improvement, he will spend the rest of his life in this state, all he can hope for is his organs to begin to fail or an infection, then he has to hope for a doctor that is willing to not treat him.

His existence is in the hands of others why can't his death be?

FiveMonths · 17/08/2012 08:42

I was trying to explain this to ds1 last night, though it wasn't in the context of this case which I have to admit ignorance of.

I think it could be fairly clear cut, IF a person had to go through hoops and legal arguing and court in order to get the permission for assisted suicide.

If people were allowed to do it randomly without legal application, it would be a disaster and there would be a lot of murders I'm sure.

But if you make people apply and if each case is rigorously examined then I honestly don't see a problem with it.

EasilyBored · 17/08/2012 08:43

I Think that would make sense thisweek. Have a set of guidance and criteria, and conduct indepth interviews with the individual, their friends and families and their doctors, give an audience for any objections and then make a decision.

I'm not denying it is a difficult law, and that it would be hard to legislate and protect vulnerable people. But it almost feels like people are saying; 'well, it's too difiicult to decide, I can't condone murder, so tough, you have to suffer'.

danteV · 17/08/2012 08:44

His life is hard? That's a major understatement.
My uncle was in this situation, long before assisted suicide (not murder) was even questioned. As he lived in northern Ireland, it would be a massive no no

It was hell, he screamed every day through frustration. I can't imagine, what's its like for your body to be a prison.
Its not murder, its assisted suicide. For people who deemed mentally capable to make the choice. It would be available for those with MH problems/ issues.

Sirzy · 17/08/2012 08:44

I think in this case they needed to go public to show just how wrong the system as it stands is and to fight for the rights of people to make their own choice on whether they live or die.

ThisWeekonFancyPuffin · 17/08/2012 08:44

I'm not denying it is a difficult law, and that it would be hard to legislate and protect vulnerable people. But it almost feels like people are saying; 'well, it's too difiicult to decide, I can't condone murder, so tough, you have to suffer'.

Totally agree Easily

SoupDragon · 17/08/2012 08:45

As EasilyBored say, he can not go to Switzerland without the person who assisted him getting here being liable to persecution for assisting suicide. So, he can starve himself. That's his choice.

I do agree that there can not be a blanket law allowing assisted suicide in these cases. The vulnerable need to be protected. There should be scope for cases to be decided on an individual basis though.

Itsjustafleshwound · 17/08/2012 08:46

I know it isn't just so easy as getting on a plane and going to Switzerland !

I have this funny belief that the law should be there to protect the vulnerable and I think setting this sort of precedent is a dangerous one.

threesocksmorganwinsgold · 17/08/2012 08:47

I feel for this man,
but..I hope the law is not changed. it could lead to terrible abuse

EasilyBored · 17/08/2012 08:48

And somehow it is not a terrible abuse to force this man to live like this when he can clearly understand his situation and wants to die? He is not a vulnerable person who is being abused by the current system?

fluffyraggies · 17/08/2012 08:49

I too really find it unfathomable that we can't find a way to decide these cases on an individual basis.

:( Just so sad for the man.

Sirzy · 17/08/2012 08:50

Surely all that means is we need in place clear systems which ensure that any decision is in the best interest of the individual. We aren't talking about allowing one doctor to make a decision we are talking about a system whereby the person needs to be able to make it clear that this is what they wish for themselves?

Binkyridesagain · 17/08/2012 08:50

Did anyone watch the terry prachettt programme, it was a couple of years ago now, his argument for assisted suicide was read by Tony Robinson?

danteV · 17/08/2012 08:50

So who is protecting him.
What will happen is, people will be diagnosed with a disease that will lead down this path. They will commit suicide while they still can, even though they may have many healthy years ahead because they will be terrified of being in this position.
How is that protecting the vulnerable?

EasilyBored · 17/08/2012 08:50

They have ethics groups and ways of deciding other difficult issues, in an objective manner, why can't this be the same? It would be the only way of allowing assisted suicide, whilst protecting other vulnerable people from abuse of the facility.

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