Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flip

1 2

Original poster

Alzheimer & baby in the house

35 replies

Thaleia · 15/08/2012 08:27

I am sure that is not the right place to ask this question but ....

Would/ could someone with 2nd stage Alzheimer harm a baby? Especially I am concerned about nights.

My DF is out of bed and around the house more than half the night: going to bed at 8pm, having a shower at 2am, shaving, dressing before going to sleep for a bit more on the sofa before being up again at around 4am.

We are going to visit and DS (4months) is staying in his own room.

Could he come to harm, does anyone have some experience? Would Dad pick him up out of his bed and leave him somewhere or put a blanket over him? Or worse, do something to make him stop if he's crying in the middle of the night?

Please don't suggest that he should sleep with us as it is not really possible.
Thanks!!

OP posts:

DawnOfTheDee · 15/08/2012 08:29

I'm can't answer the question as to what someone with Alzheimer's may or may not do but if there is any potential risk the only option is for DS to sleep in a room with you or for you to stay elsewhere.

Housespouse · 15/08/2012 08:30

Why is it not possible to have DS sleep in with you for just one night? (Just wondering as this is indeed the obvious solution).

Does your DF live on his own generally? If so, this is something that needs to be addressed as he is no doubt a danger to himself at this point, sadly, and it sounds as if he needs your support. If you can't stay with him, then it will be tricky for you to get a measure of the situation.

I am sorry you are in this position.

pjmama · 15/08/2012 08:31

The fact that you're concerned is enough - you're more aware of your father's health than we are. If you can't all be in the same room, then maybe a hotel?

Sirzy · 15/08/2012 08:31

I very much doubt he would come to any harm, but I'm not sure I would be happy and I would personally try to sleep in the same room as the baby.

I would be more concerned for the safety of your father TBH

Pooka · 15/08/2012 08:32

If your ds cannot be in your room, is there any way you could be in his room? Blow up mattress on floor?

ll31 · 15/08/2012 08:39

surely in circs you just have him sleep with you-cant think of any reason that having ds in room with you wouldn't be possible

MrsTerryPratchett · 15/08/2012 08:41

You have to tell us why cosleeping is not an option.

NatashaBee · 15/08/2012 08:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

limitedperiodonly · 15/08/2012 08:43

Don't know, but disruption to your father's routine such as a visit, especially with a new baby, could unsettle him and make for an unpleasant stay whether he harms the baby or not. I'm not saying he would hurt your baby btw.

Can you give a few more details of what you plan to do?

iliketea · 15/08/2012 08:43

How long are you staying for? If it's longer than a day or 2 and your ds can't stay in his own.room, you could look into motion senser alarms / pressure mat alarm which would alert you if someone goes into the room that your ds is sleeping in. There may be a local NHS service which provides these sorts of devices (for your father, rather than wherever you're registered). Or you could contact a charity like alzheimers uk or age concern and thet may have ideas of some gadget or other which you could rent or buy to use in your fathers house to help keep him and ds safe.

BagofHolly · 15/08/2012 08:44

It's very hard to predict what your dad might do, especially when faced with a change in routine and a crying baby, so on that basis, the baby can't leave your sight. That's it really.

StanleyLambchop · 15/08/2012 08:49

My Mum is early stages of dementia. Sometimes she is ok, other times she does completely random things. She is ok to look after the children for a short while, but they are older now and probably more sensible than she is. If I had a newborn now I sadly could not trust her to look after it. I think you need to re-think and have baby in with you, or stay in a b & b nearby, for everyones sake.

Original poster

Thaleia · 15/08/2012 08:51

I am staying for 4 weeks, so it's not just the odd night ...
The guest room is under the roof and it gets so hot, I don't think he'll be comfortable. He already did not cope well when it was so hot here recently.

My mum is looking after my dad and he is not so much gone that he's a vegetable. And even so, a care home is not an option, we will always look after him at home (with additional help if necessary). He just forgot ... who my mum is, that he has children, when he was born, that his mum is dead. But sometimes he does remember.

I guess, I just want to know if it's in the nature of the illness to harm a baby? It is different if you forget to turn of the TV or to flush the toilet vs. taking the baby out of the crib to perhaps play with him and then just forget about him?

OP posts:

DawnOfTheDee · 15/08/2012 08:57

I don't have personal experience but what other posters seem to be saying is that Alzheimer's is unpredictable so no-one can say 'It's fine...you Dad definitely won't bother your ds in any way'.

Taking that into account it's not safe for your ds to be unattended really so you need to look at doing one of the following:

having ds in your room (how hot is it? open a window & put your ds in cooler bed clothes?)
you sleep in ds's room
get one of the alarm type products posters have recommended
stay in a b&b nearby

hurricanewyn · 15/08/2012 08:57

The nature of the illness means thst everyone is different with it. Some people with dememtia can get very aggressive, but that doesn't mean your DF will.

None of us on here can tell you for definite that your baby will certainly be safe or will certainly not be safe.

Sirzy · 15/08/2012 08:57

I really think you need to talk to your dads care team before going, such a massive change of routine may not be good for him.

IHeartKingThistle · 15/08/2012 08:57

What a sad situation. Has your dad ever shown aggression when confused? DH's GM did this and once attacked her own daughter (my MIL) with her stick when she came down from the toilet (GM had forgotten there was anyone in the house, thought she was an intruder, had no idea who she was). The problem was that FIL leapt to his wife's defence while holding my baby DD. At that point I said I was never taking her to the house again. Very sad.

Having said that, even at that stage of her illness she adored DD - seemed to have an inbuilt gentleness around babies even if she had no idea whose baby she was. It's such a difficult one. I hope you find a way to make it work.

ll31 · 15/08/2012 08:58

i think i'd be happier personally with 4 wks of disturbed sleep than risk something happening. also would not be so dead set against nursing home-your mother may not be able to cope or able to do so without damaging her own health

pjmama · 15/08/2012 08:58

"taking the baby out of the crib to perhaps play with him and then just forget about him"

If you're worrying that this might happen, then you're not going to be able to sleep in a separate room. Nobody can tell you if this is likely or not, but you are concerned that it might be and that should be enough for you to find an alternative.

CrazyShake · 15/08/2012 08:59

My mum had dementia and I stayed here for a few weeks when dd was a baby. She was fine. Mum ignored het, just stared at her really, like she didn't know what to do.
But - every person with this illness is different. Some people do hit and get violent when frustrated, others are relaxed and couldn't harm anything.
Ask your mum what she thinks as she is his primary carer and will have an idea of his temperament.

Also- my dad installed those little screw locks on all the bedroom doors, with little screw keys in each... She couldn't figure them out and we could lock from inside too to stop her coming in in middle of the night. U could always do something like this.

MrsHoarder · 15/08/2012 09:01

He may not harm the baby in a malicious way, just forget that babies shouldn't be left unsupervised on a raised surface, near water etc.

TroublesomeEx · 15/08/2012 09:01

Having seen a relative through alzheimer's, I would be very cautious.

I don't think it's in the nature of the illness to harm anyone, including a baby, as such, but the unpredictability of behaviour associated with the disease might cause them to harm a baby accidentally or without awareness of it.

My grandmother had alzheimer's and (whilst I don't know anything about 'stages') we became quite frightened of her. If something was out of the ordinary she would scream and shout, and my parents had to eventually put her in a nursing home because she attacked my mother when she went round to care for her. Oh and because she was sitting so close to an electric heater in the living room that it melted her stockings into her legs. And she forgot she had put toast under the grill and started a fire.

She initially shared a room but she had to be moved to a single room after she started attacking the lady she shared with with her zimmer frame because she didn't like some of the noises this other lady made. She would stand at the window screaming at the lady in the house backing on to the home that she was a whore because she hung her washing out on the wrong day.

It was sad and tragic yes, but terrifying and dangerous. She stopped recognising us and accused my parents of having children without telling her (she was very distressed which manifested in anger aimed at us) and she eventually forgot my mum and thought my dad had taken up with a "slut" and her "bastard offspring". We weren't allowed to visit in the end and it was another couple of years before she died.

Obviously, your Dad isn't my grandma and I don't know how he would react but this is my experience and I would be very careful of it. Sometimes she had lucid moments and was aware that she was 'losing it' which upset her greatly. She wasn't herself and she wasn't in control. She wouldn't have done any of these things before Alzheimer's, but that is why it is such a cruel disease.

You have to do what you think is best and safest for your family. x

Lilicat1013 · 15/08/2012 09:02

I doubt he would harm a baby intentional if he doesn't behave in an aggressive way usually. However accidental harm could be a possibility, as you said he could take the baby from the cot and put him down and then forget he has done it.

I wouldn't personally be comfortable in that situation and would aim to make other arrangements where it would be possible for the baby to be more supervised. If other arrangements aren't possible the Angel Care monitor sounds like a good idea.

pumpkinsweetie · 15/08/2012 09:06

I don't think a person with Alzeimheirs would intentionally hurt someone or a child but unfortunetly they can become agressive as it is part of the disease.

Imo i would bring a travel cot and let your ds sleep in room with you just in case.

saintlyjimjams · 15/08/2012 09:06

You need to keep your baby near you or use some sort of locking arrangement. I have a son with severe learning disabilities who used to climb in ds3's cot with him (not saying your father will do this obviously) - my point is it wasn't fair to put ds1 in the situation where his lack of understanding could have harmed ds3 so we were very very careful about supervision.

Also I would encourage your mum (for the future) to think about how she is going to get some respite. Caring full time for someone is hard work - respite can save sanity - short breaks are not a bad thing and needing a short break isn't something to feel guilty about (obviously there are places you need to avoid but there are some great places out there as well).

Flip

1 2