to think this is a total pisstake and turn the job down?

[WaterGypsy]

Was offered a job as a CM assistant months ago by an aquaintance. Had to do 1st aid course, CRB check etc.

Have just been informed that I can start next week as the paperwork is all back. Apparently I need to register as self employed, and am then expected to do 2 school runs and a nursery run, plus trips out to soft play, parks etc in my own car and 'claim the fuel back'. All for the princely sum of £5 ph. Apparently 1/2 mile each way is too far for the 4year olds to walk to school. It is probably also worth mentioning that I walk almost eveywhere as my old banger is on her last legs and when she goes I won't be able to replace her.

Is this legal? Will my insurance cover me to do this? And most importantly is it even worth it? She also wants me to fork out 40 bleeding quid for 2 printed work shirts!

YANBU to think this is a pisstake and YWNBU to turn the job down.

The tops are to make me look professional at the school gates. (And provide free advertising no doubt)

Doesn't sound a great deal to me. You should try to at least get a decent mileage rate (HMRC reckon 45p a mile usually) rather than just reimbursement for the cost of fuel.

The OP isn't being paid per child - that would be her hourly rate!

When I said tax back I wasn't referring to income tax - more her expenses.

She is taking the piss!

(I have always had business insurance for my car and it doesn't necessarily put the premium up, it might even be on your current policy but I still don't think you should do it!)

Oldgrey - from the tax man apparently, via my tax return!

You can't be self employed if you do work for one person, it's not legal, you are classed as an employee, it's supposed to prevent situations like this.

You are unlikely to earn enough to pay tax and therefore claim back petrol etc. As I understand it, you should not just be working for one person/business if you are self-employed, though it's a bit of a grey area.

£5 an hour is not a lot to start with and with the cost of petrol, the work shirt and other expensese you are not going to take away a lot of pay.

PVL is right, she cannot enforce you to register as self employed. My partner was self employed for a while but when he started doing the majority of his hours with his current employer he was obliged to take him on. There are no end of court cases about this very issue. I would not take the job, it won't be worth your while especially at £5 per hour and she is royally taking the piss.

Is she maybe expecting you not to declare your income at all?

If she is expecting me not to declare it she's going to be disappointed. The main reason I was interested is we're saving to buy a house and I need to declare my earnings on the mortgage application.

You can be self employed if you only work for one person. I am. You cannot claim back expenses. You can claim back the tax you pay in the money you spent on expenses. You can also claim tax relief on car running costs, something like 5p per mile i think. You will probably find that you don't pay much/any tax. Adding business use to the insurance in my case only added £20 a year. Could you do the school run with a double buggy? Get one on the cheap from gum tree? £5 an hour less expenses seems daft. I'd have a re-think and consider setting up on your own!

I run a business and although legally a self employed person can be paid below the NMW of £6.08-I think she is absolutely taking the mick.

Just to add the going rate for travel expenses is £45 p per mile. You need to remember travel expenses should cover more than the fuel cost (which tends to be around 15 p per mile) as you also have to consider wear and tear and depreciation of your car.

I would tell her to find another mug.

from what you've said, HMRC wouldn't agree that you would be self employed (can you send a substitute? Do you use your own equipment? Can you set your own hours? If no, then it's employment, not self employment). And even if it was SE, then the hourly charge woudl generally be higher than if employed, to cover yourself for sick leave, holiday pay, insurance etc.
She's taking the piss IMO.

You can work for one person when self employed, set yourself up as a limited company contractor, and you would pay less tax that way.

But fucking norah that is for contractors earning hundreds of quid a day, it's not to be used as a wheeze to get round paying you a fiver an hour. And the claiming the fuel back from the taxman is a load of old crap.

And paying £40 for shirts?

Tell her to piss off.

not £45 per mile, 45 p sorry

If you are self employed most mortgage companies wont include your income for the first year or more of your self employment.

Don't set up as a limited company for such a new small venture-it will cost a fortune in accountants' fees.

Of course you can be self employed and only work for one person, a lot of nannies are self employed but only work for one person.

Set hours, her equipment (in her home) and no, if I am sick or whatever she would arrange cover.

The national minimum wage applies not just to employees but to "workers" - which includes employees, but also anyone carrying out services personally for another, other than a client type relationship. To be blunt - even if you're not an employee (and you may well be depending on all the circs) you are definitely a worker. You are entitled to the minimum wage of £6.08. I wouldn't touch this job - you will end up out of pocket and royally screwed over the way she's already shown she'll treat you.

No definitely don't bother setting up as a limited company contractor for this daft job. Totally not worth it.

Cheeky beggar.

Blip - at the rate we're saving that won't be an issue!

If you will be wearing shirts with her company on, and working entirely for her, that's a good sign to me that you shouldn't be considered self-employed and that this is a dodgy setup. Also I'm sure you would need additional insurance for your car (and possibly for yourself as well, for liability - did your acquaintance say anything about that?).

I'm interested in what your acquaintance will be doing while you do all this? Also how much money will she be getting for palming off looking after these children?

In your shoes, now that you've done at least some of the training, CRB check etc I would see if you can't get a better childcare job elsewhere - maybe a nursery, or setting up as a CM yourself? (Not sure if you would need any additional training or certificates for that, but it sounds like you've already ticked several boxes). Then you can run things the way that makes sense to you (4yr olds can definitely walk, for a start!), avoid any dodgy setups and quite possibly earn more too (or at least get more protection, sickpay etc if you go down the nursery route). She does sound like she's trying to pull a fast one!

You wouldn't be self employed doing this, she is trying to get out of her obligations to you, don't have a word of it and turn the job down.