To think that this behaviour is not acceptable?

[missduff]

I have 2 step kids who are 5 and 7 and my own DS is 3, and I was just wondering if people could confirm whether this behaviour is acceptable or not? In my eyes it isn't but my DP keeps trying to tell me that it's normal for their age....

So in 1 day this week we had the following from my step kids...
Numerous tantrums from the 5 yo which involve him throwing himself on the floor, crying like a baby, hitting his dad
The 5 yo also kicked DP's car, my furniture and my garden fence (3 separate instances)
7 yo shouted 'fatty!' out of the car window at a chubby kid in the street
Bad language which is also in front of my 3 yo, I now have a son who says 'mummy im going to smash you!'
No manners, no pleases, no thank you's, no table manners.
Constantly kicking and smacking each other
Name calling eg 'fat slag'!
Damaging my ds's toys
Trying to steal my ds's toys
Telling takes, lying etc

I don't expect them to be angels, I expect kids of their age to test the boundaries and maybe be a bit cheeky, tell tales, ignore me when I ask them to do things, to have the odd tiff etc. my main concern is the violence and the bad language especially as my son is starting to copy it.
My other concern is that DP doesn't see it as an issue so how can we ever tackle it if he thinks it's ok?
I wouldn't accept that behaviour from my own DS so why should I accept it from them? It annoys me that DP will discipline my DS for something quite minor but just stand back and let his own 2 be naughty, it's like he just doesn't want to upset them.

Sorry just to clarify my DS isn't DP's but has been his step dad since he was a baby

What's the relationship like between their parents?

They sound quite mixed up and angry to be honest.

I dont know, my DS certainly never behaved like that...but then he has never had to cope with his mum and dad splitting up and getting used to a new step mum, half brother etc etc....I imagine thats a pretty tough thing for a 5 and 7 year old to deal with!

My DD (just turned 5) wouldn't dream of doing any of those except the last 3 on your list. I see the last 3 as fairly normal (but annoying) sibling stuff.

My DSDs were 4 when I met them and were the same - wouldn't have done anything on your list except the last 3.

So IME no most of it is not normal or acceptable, but my experience is fairly limited.

Oh no. Bugger that.
I'm crap with rude kids. Cba with them at all.

Good luck - you're going to need it. Eeek!!

Sorry I meant last 2 things rather than last 3 things - all 3 girls have damaged toys but never deliberately, more just through carelessness

If their father isn't setting the boundaries then they are going to test them to the limit aren't they?

Are they welcome in your house, to be relaxed and comfortable?

Just the warning sign for me was them kicking your furniture?

Testing their boundaries. dad isn't at home. They want to see how far they can push him (and you). They probably don't behave like that at home either.

You need a co-operative approach between your DH and his EXP.

YANBU That is not acceptable behaviour.

My dc were 6 & 7 when I split from my ex but were never allowed to get away with that type of behaviour. Yes, they misbehaved from time to time, they would wind each other up, but I would always pull them up on it.

Your dp is making excuses and quite frankly being an hypocrite if he disciplines your ds over stuff he allows his own to get away with.

I think a certain amount of tantrumming is normal at their age (esp the 5 year old) but I wouldn't be letting it go unchallenged. They may well be mixed up and angry and this may be due to the parental break up, but they still need guidance and boundaries.

The kicking/smacking/name calling is particularly unpleasant. My two three year olds do their fair share of smacking each other (unfortunately) but I always separate them, the smacker gets told off and told to say sorry; the smackee gets a cuddle and generally made a fuss of. We don't have issues with language due to speech delay. You and your DP really need to have a frank discussion about discipline in your house - I have a DSS and the same rules apply to him that apply to my own children.

I think the quickest way to nip this in the bud is for you and the DC's parents to sit down together and talk about it - set some rules....so you're all singing from the same hymm sheet.

Kids know how to play adults off against each other and that's always going to be easier if the adults don't communicate very well.

Also, some NRP parents feel as though they don't want to 'be the baddy' and tell the kids off when they only see them every weekend or so....and that nearly always leads to rotten behaviour.

No. That is not acceptable. At all. Such behaviour should be dealt with.

Look at it from their POV for a second.

Your child has their fathers attention and time 24/7, and they get him maybe every other weekend? They are pushing it to see if they rank the same in DHs eyes as your child does. Testing his love and commitment to them.

Funny things kids. When you see where they are coming from, only then can you resolve the issues

Mine might try some of that behaviour but would be told off for it.

If they have no boudaries they will just keep doing it.

Their relationship with their dad is great, me n 7 yo girl are quite close but me n 5 yo boy have never really bonded.
I don't think it's so much of an issue with being at my house, they also behave the same at DP's parents house and I know their mum has problems with their behaviour and has even sought help for 5 yo boy's behaviour and has been referred for parenting classes.
I think he does have some real anger issues which are partly due to his parents being divorced, their mother palms them off on anybody who will have them and spends very little quality time with them and I think it's also not helped by the fact that he has speech problems so I imagine he probably gets frustrated that. He's been going for speech therapy but there's been no progress at all so I can only assume his mum isn't doing his homework with him.

Before I get flamed BTW for 'my own children' I just mean that they are here full time, but to say 'the children that live here full time' just seemed weird!

missduff - don't assume that about speech therapy - my boys have it and are not progressing very well despite me doing a lot with them. This may be contributing to his frustration - he doesn't have the understanding he needs to deal with some situations?

This is what SALT said to us anyway - it's not just their speech that is delayed, it's also their understanding.

Discipline them for behaviour that isn't acceptable, be friendly but firm when they are messing you around, and just say your Mum or Dad wouldn't let you get away with it, so neither will I.

Sounds like fairly normal testing, just OTT and needing reigned back in to normal levels, so cutting out swearing and damaging things. They are probably feeling a touch insecure, as you would in this situation as a child, and they need extra loving and strong boundaries so that they feel secure with you and their dad.

cavejohnson thanks I never saw it like that.

But then I look back at my own childhood and how I behaved - parents divorced when I was 3, I had speech problems, my dad was violent. But I would never have dreamed of shouting 'fatty' at a kid in the street. Partly because I was taught to be kind to people and partly because I knew I would have got a sharp clip round the ear hole (I'm not saying smacking is the answer btw). But I do think kids need to know their are consequences for bad behaviour.
The trouble is I can't discipline them on my own.

Plus to make matters more complicated we're having a baby any time now so of course things are going to get even more stressful and yes I think I need some serious luck!

I must admit I never did until the SALT told me! I just thought it was the inability to verbalise - not that they had actual issues with the understanding.

That's not to say they don't get a punishment if they do something naughty btw.

I remember a bit of back story now

Haven't you just recently had a baby with their Dad...and you've had an on/off relationship with him for a while?

If I remember rightly, your family don't see your step kids as part of the family at all and their Mum doesn't want to spend a lot of time with them?

It seems the poor kids feel wanted by no-one and they have very little stability...their only 'stability' is a Dad who's been on/off with someone (you) who has a child of her own and now has a baby with you too.

I can quite understand their behaviour...though obviously something has to be done about it

Oh cross posted....my mistake the baby's due soon

Why can't you discipline them on your own?

No, most of that behaviour is OTT and needs sorting, but I couldn't help picking up on an "us and them" tone to your post: "my furniture", "my fence", "his own DS" "my DS isn't allowed to behave like that". Children are very quick to pick up on that sort of thing.

You need to come up with a united front and a common strategy.