. . . to be really shocked that some people don't know in which years both World Wars began and ended?

[squoosh]

Was saying to a friend at the weekend that I was really shocked when someone I knew admitted that they didn't know in which year WWII began.

The person I said this too then said 'hmmm, was it 1935 that WWII began? I think WWI was 1910'. And this from a really intelligent person too. I thought those were the sorts of dates that everyone just knew. Even if you've never studied history in any capacity surely those dates just seep into your mind via films and tv programmes etc.

AIBU?

Tilop in a uniquely beautiful moment, we are both right

(although it looks to me as if you have the historical advantage.)

YANBU. Then again I remember meeting an American teenager who was seriously confused about past conflicts. After one bad-tempered exchange session his parting shot to his British hosts was 'At least we kicked your ass in the war!!!!'

Am LOLLING at 'cumbustion engine'

Sounds like something out of 50 Shades of Shite.

My darkest moment was DEMANDING that someone explain why objects are reversed in a mirror.

My mistake was to think the answer to that question lies in physics or geometry, when it is in fact a question of semantics.

I shouted at my Dad over that one

I am a bit shocked at people not knowing the dates, they were 2 massively important events in world, not just British, history of the last century, having a huge impact on the shape of the political, economic and social world we live in today.

Mind you, think I was more shocked by my friend who didn't know John Barrowman was gay .....

jodie, you and me both, race you to wiki to check dates of boer war!!!

And to add, i have the deepest respect for all those who participated in defending us in the war, for without many of us would not be here, for someone like me if hitler had got his way goodness knows what he would have done to black people if he hated Jews so much.

"They will never grow old".

I just don't understand how it doesn't bother people not to know stuff

I take it you know everything then

YANBU. Even my 8 year old knows the beginning and end dates of both world wars.
It's not just trivia and well know facts, it's something you should know and I'd have been a bit [shocked] as well.

Jodie, I've had that explained before but never really understood it, am interested in your comment about it being semantics. Might start another thread about that sort of thing...

It wasn't "mid-30's onwards" in much of Europe, its only dated from when war is actually declared, not the build up to it. It started in 1939 (sept 3rd to be precise) when Germany invaded Poland, and Britain, France, NZ and Australia declared war on Germany. Not before.

Ahh, American war rhetoric. 'The time we opened up a big can of whoop-ass on you at Georgetown'

There's a lovely sarcastic bit in Michelle Magorian's Back Home about a lass who was sea-evacuated to American in WWII. She comes back and is sent to a scary British private school, where when the teacher asks someone from the class to talk about 'the civil war', she launches into the American version. Teacher is horrified that she hasn't learned any British history (in America?!), and announces tartly, 'American history would hardly cover a term, my girl!'

I just loved it and this thread made me think of it.

What I want to know now iis why my data won't load

It's not just trivia and well know facts, it's something you should know and I'd have been a bit [shocked] as well.

Why should I know it?

I don't know the dates. I'd think I'm reasonably intelligent as I have a PhD in engineering, and have worked as a postdoc in a Russell Group university. But I'm not British, and not educated here. At school in Hong Kong, I learned a very different version of WW2, nothing about WW1. (It's all about the Japanese occupation, rape and pillage of China if you are interested). In New Zealand, there is a lot of Gallipoli, about how the British sent all our men to death fighting a war that's not ours. And how the Japanese would have invaded Australia with all our men overseas, if it's not for the US bombing Hiroshima.

Oh I don't know the dates of any of these events really btw!

As someone upthread said - it depends on what your thing is. I studied history and could talk at length about causes of the ww's but actually i think i'd be hazy if someone pinned me down on dates of ww1. It is because concepts interest me rather than numbers.

DP is super clever with 3 masters, and is a military man too, and i doubt he could tell you the dates. (he's dyslexic so numbers aren't a strong point).

My school never covered either of the wars in history (they taught it in a very odd way tbh - it was shite) so unless any peers went out looking for the facts no one from my year at school would know it.

Interesting about the different people of the same ages relating to the war differently too. My dad was born in 45, the same year as Mil, and dad doesn't consider himself to have been in it, whereas Mil does and talks about it non stop. She often asks about my dad's experiences and i say he had none, yet she has loads of 'personal' anecdotes. She acts more like my grandparents - i wonder if her parents were so traumatised that they passed on their memories to her and now she actually thinks they are hers.

From Wikipedia, re carsey/ khazi:
Lexicographer Eric Partridge derives khazi, also spelt karzy, kharsie or carzey, from a low Cockney word carsey originating in the late 19th century and meaning a privy. Carsey also referred to a den or brothel. It is presumably derived from the Italian casa for house, with the spelling influenced by its similar sound to khaki. Khazi is now most commonly used in the city of Liverpool in the UK, away from its cockney slang roots.

Why should I know it?

Because it's basic, primary school stuff, and it is pretty poor if grown adults don't know! I'm no history buff, and don't know every trivia thing (trivia's not my strong point) but this goes beyond that - it's just basic stuff that you should KNOW!

Onelittle - i dont think many realise that other countries may not necessarily share their enthusiasm for the world war.

Someone mentioned further up that not studying it in school is not an excuse, afterall you could pick up a book and fill in those gaps, true, but Why would someone from another country feel they need to pick up a book and read about the world wars ? If its not part of the curriculum surely that speaks for itself that its not of great importance to that country, there are other internal wars or conflicts that have had far far reaching impacts on some countries than the world wars.

tilop

No, it's definitely khazi.

Those who excuse their ignorance of the dates of the two world wars by virtue of not being British are missing the whole point of this thread. No one expects everone in the world to know the dates, but anyone who had a reasonable education in the UK should.

WW1: 1914 - 1918 (1917 - 1918)
WW2: 1939 - 1945 (1941 - 1945)

(Dates in brackets refer to the USA view of the Wars)!

i was educated in this country and never taught it in school. Certainly never in primary school.

I also went on to study it in Uni and while i knew the dates for exams they were 'bathwater' facts for me - something you use till you have finished then dispose of. I find retaining information like that very difficult. I am more interested in the human concepts and social history. I can circa most wars to within 5/10 years tho.

So would you say the UK should know the US dates too, pendeen? I think more people would know about different bits of Europe.

I am surprised if people educated in the UK don't know the dates, but I'd probably assume it was either a memory blank, or they'd known it one and forgotten. Some people do forget things they learned in school. It wouldn't necessarily mean they weren't respectful of what happened, I think.

Because it's basic, primary school stuff, and it is pretty poor if grown adults don't know! I'm no history buff, and don't know every trivia thing (trivia's not my strong point) but this goes beyond that - it's just basic stuff that you should KNOW!

It wasn't covered at my primary school. We did dinosaurs, the stoneage, the bronze age, the iron age, the Egyptians, the plague and fire of London. At secondary school we did Greek and Roman history, American history, Chinese history and for GCSE, the Tudors and the Stuarts.

So why should I know it?

I know the dates roughly, was never taught in school here.

I wouldn't remember them even if they did. My brain just will not store dates at all.

I know what happened in both wars, who the protagonists were, why it happened, etc, etc. Just not the dates. Never realised it was an issue until this thread.

Yes, we didn't do WWI at primary school either. We did do WWII, but honestly I don't think dates were the focus - I remember lots of details, writing poems about it, that sort of thing, but not dates.

It depends when you went to school, I think.

I had to learn the dates for GCSE history and used to be able to reel off all the different events in the lead-up to both wars, but I can't now.

The "US dates" are just ethnocentrism. You don't count the start of a World War from when you joined it, when its already been going on for 2 years. Thats like saying an 8pm dinner party only started at 10.30 because thats when you crashed in through the door clutching a bottle of bubbly.