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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to worry that I'm racist.

59 replies

manicinsomniac · 14/07/2012 08:35

I have never before considered myself to be racist in any way, shape or form. I don't judge people on colour, I don't assume things about them and I have many friends of various and mixed ethnicities. My children are mixed race.

But last night/this morning I was out in London and we were looking for a bar/club that was open after 2am. We thought we knew one in Dalston but when we got there it was closed and there was a black bouncer on the door of a small looking bar next door who told us it now always closes at midnight. So we asked him if we could go into his bar instead. He looked at us strangely but nodded and we went in. The bar turned out to be an all black one. I have no idea if it was a special night, whether it is exclusively a black club or whether it just happens to be popular with a certain group but there wasn't a single non black person in there (about 150 people at a guess).

If I had told myself about this situation yesterday afternoon I would have shrugged and said 'so what?' but, in the event, I couldn't. I felt really awkward and strange and like everyone was staring at us (which I really don't think they were!) We didn't even buy a drink, just left again after standing around awkwardly for a minute or two (group I was with were all either white, asian or mixed race).

The bouncer raised his eyebows at us when we came out and made a remark about being quick. One of my friends said it hadn't really been our scene and the guy laughed and said, 'thought not.' I then felt like a piece of total racist scum.

Was I being racist to feel uneasy in that environment? Nobody did a thing to us or explicitly told us we couldn't be there. Shit, I was being racist wasn't I! I wish I could work out why I felt like that.

OP posts:
AmberLeaf · 14/07/2012 09:47

*racist not tacist!

MrsRhettButler · 14/07/2012 09:48

Agree with Amber

AmberLeaf · 14/07/2012 09:52

did the OP say they left because everyone else was black? No. So you calling racist is just shit stirring. OP left because they didn't feel comfortable/atmosphere wasn't agreeable

Erm well actually yeah she did leave because everyone was black! It wasn't because of any 'atmosphere' it was because of how she felt being the only white person.

EugenesAxe · 14/07/2012 09:53

I wouldn't have left just because it was all blacks to be honest. If they had a problem with me and my group of friends then I would have left, but the bouncer let you in and there was no real indication you would be treated badly. If you did pick up a bad vibe then I think it was OK for you to leave.

At least you didn't do what I can envisage some groups of people doing, which is dealing with it by acting all 'oh aren't we just so cool and free-thinking, to be happy sat in an all black bar'. That would be worse.

Tangent... but one of my favourite moments in film is in 'Road Trip' when the clever guy performs a perfect Psi-chi handshake/greeting with a bloke of an (unbeknownst to him) all black fraternity. It's the greeting that makes me laugh more than the 'mix up' - but anyway in the film they are welcomed in wholeheartedly, so it's a nice scene.

LimeLeafLizard · 14/07/2012 09:58

In most areas of the UK it is fairly unusual to have a public gathering of 150 people with no white people at all. The only time I've ever been the only white person present in that size of crowd was in Kenya.

So perhaps your discomfort came from a feeling that you might have stumbled into a private club, to which you were not invited?

In which case, no, it is not strange that you might sheepishly smile, apologise and leave. If you'd realised you'd stumbled into a private bar or club populated by mostly white people you'd have reacted the same way.

marriedinwhite · 14/07/2012 09:59

I work with quite few black ladies. I know most of them would feel uncomfortable if I took them to my predominantly white and very middle class "tennis" club. Not because they would be purposefully made to feel unwelcome but because they would feel like fish out of water and their feelings wouldn't be because they were racist. I would feel the same if I went to environments in their comfort zones.

Similarly, DH and I would feel uncomfortable at a Festival or anywhere a bit "woo" regardless of anyone's colour.

marriedinwhite · 14/07/2012 10:02

Amber your post made me laugh and I know it shouldn't have but if I'm perfectly honest, I think what's in my head would make me feel uncomfortable wherever I was in Dalson. Blush

kim147 · 14/07/2012 10:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheSpokenNerd · 14/07/2012 10:05

There was a bar near my old home in Camberwell that you never saw a white person in....the type of music was very agressive and the crowd was young...Rude Girls and all that...I never went int there just as I never went in the other bar that was frequented by Hoxton types...I didnt fit in....I went to places that were more varied....different music and a good mix of all races.

cheeseandpineapple · 14/07/2012 10:06

Not racist, OP, unless you left because you felt superior because of your race which isn't what your saying.

But does sound like you were being prejudiced ie you were pre judging the situation, didn't stay for a drink when you could have had one (and were wanting one) because you formed an impression of the place based on the colour of the people in there.

Same principle in reverse ie if someone of one race walks into a place full of people of another race and chooses to leave because they feel uncomfortable, it's potentially pre judging the situation and other people, based on race.

Rightly, wrongly, it happens. It's human nature to feel uncomfortable if you are in a minority.

I often am but I don't mind it, I like to be different!

Doesn't mean that you are prejudiced against a particular race per se, just a particular situation at a particular time.

JamieandTheOlympicTorch · 14/07/2012 10:07

Dalton gives me the willies. All those silly haircuts and men with trousers that stop at the ankles

JamieandTheOlympicTorch · 14/07/2012 10:08

Dalston

Ps anyone knw how I can turn off autocorrect on an iPad?

MamaMumra · 14/07/2012 10:08

Maybe you guys were just a bit dorky looking? This is east London btw? squeaky when exactly was your eye opening experience? Grin

AmberLeaf · 14/07/2012 10:09

I'm 'lolling' at 'agressive' music.

This is what I mean about buying into ideas.

eslteacher · 14/07/2012 10:11

Nobody likes feeling like the odd one out. Wouldn't you have felt the same if you were the only woman in a bar full of men, or the only over 30 in a bar full of students, or the only normal looking person in a bar full of supermodels, or the only house wife in a bar full of lawyers?

Whilst no-one should be discriminated against because of race, that doesn't mean we are all meant to be literally colour-blind...

Smellslikecatspee · 14/07/2012 10:11

I'm white OH Asian, I come from a very very white rural area, first time he came home with me he gat antsy the first time we went to the local. He felt everyone was looking at him because he was asian. I was more of the opinion they were looking 'cause they're all nosey buggers.

It wasn't til another 'stranger' who was white came in that he realised I was right (big night that, 2 strangers in one night. . .honest there wasn't someone playing a banjo).

Chances are you wandered in to a very local pub/ club and made your outsider ness worse by acting like a lemon. The fact that you're wondering about it would lean towards you not been consciously racist, but having been with OH for nearly 2 decades, I'm shocked and still surprised how many people use racist language and have racist attitudes without actually realising.

MamaMumra · 14/07/2012 10:12

How very 1970s, this idea about people and comfort zones - married you may be surprised what your black ladies feel comfortable with!

This reminds me about the discussions we used to have at school, carry on!

MamaMumra · 14/07/2012 10:14

Aggressive music and violent haircuts!! Insolent trousers and disrespectful derrières!

kim147 · 14/07/2012 10:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AmberLeaf · 14/07/2012 10:17

Ok if someone went into a bar that was mainly 'cool hoxton' types they may feel out of place but not in danger and would probably have one drink and move on or stay if they felt like it.

That's a normal reaction.

But if someone who isn't part of that scene goes into a bar like the one OP describes and leaves because they feel uncomfortable or threatened that's because in some way they have been influenced by racist stereo types that black people are dangerous, hate white people and will attack at the first opportunity.

That doesn't necessarily make that person racist but its certainly something that any decent person should question-which the OP has.

I really don't think you're racist OP and I think you're right to ask yourself why you reacted the way you did.

Jinsei · 14/07/2012 10:19

Hmm, it's a tricky one. On the surface, I'd say it was a bit racist to leave because there were no other white people there. However, if you're used to being in the majority, it can be quite weird to experience what it's like being in a minority for once. I have been in that situation loads of times, and though I'm used to it now, I did find it disconcerting at first - felt very self-conscious, like I stuck out like a sore thumb, and kept if other people thought I shouldn't be there.

Of course, for some people, being in that minority is a daily reality. Not a bad thing to experience it. Maybe next time it happens you'll be more comfortable with it.

WilsonFrickett · 14/07/2012 10:30

What Amber said. OP I don't think you are consciously racist, but we all carry all sorts of (media-led) stereotypes with us, and sometimes these lead us to act in certain ways. What's good is you are now thinking about it....

MrsRhettButler · 14/07/2012 10:34

Aggressive music does exsist though and with it comes aggressive attitudes. Its silly to say it doesn't.

I don't go out much anymore but when I did and I was younger a lot of the places I went to played dancehall, (homophobic hate music?) Rap, (trigger finger? Gunshots with your hand) garage music, (lots of jumping around and pushing each other in the crowd going on there) I don't think its fair to laugh if someone not used to the scene would feel uncomfortable and think it was an aggressive place to be.

AmberLeaf · 14/07/2012 10:40

garage music, (lots of jumping around and pushing each other in the crowd going on there

I don't know what sort of garage clubs you went to but that doesn't fit my experience at all.

Again I think its down to perceptions. Music is not agressive.

AltruisticEnigma · 14/07/2012 10:50

I think it's being a small number in a larger crowd that you do not fit into, like the others have said. For example I walked into a pub once where they had about 50 men who had just played in a rugby league and some friends/supporters. The only other woman was the barmaid and this left me feeling uncomfortable the same way I'm sure you did.

If you're not used to having a multicultural atmosphere it can be hard to get used to as well. It doesn't mean someone is racist but we all are used to what we are used to and it's not our fault if we find something we aren't used of uncomfortable. If you overtly disliked the people because they were black or automatically thought they'd attack you then yes, I would see racism. If you just felt like you stood out like a sore thumb and didn't know how to proceed, I don't think that's racist.

One of my friends goes to Jamaican rasca festivals all the time and he loves it. Whereas I love Jamaican music but have never been to one of those festivals, so may not feel comfortable as I don't know how the crowd reacts, don't know what is done at them etc.

It's all about perception though.