Young Earth Creationists? Really believe it? Really?

[balotelli]

Cant believe that anyone actually thinks that the earth was created by a god 6000 years ago!

I have to agree with Richard Dawkins who said they are either ignorant, stupid or insane.

If you do believe it, explain dinosaurs!

It's a bit like doctors who believe in homeopathy, I expect. Cherry pick the evidence, ignore the bits you don't like and when you come across something that you can't explain, appeal to a higher power that isn't properly understood. Like quantum mechanics, or god.

Since none of the believers have come back to explain or defend their belief i've been having a good look at my new favourite website, still desperately trying to understand how you defend the indefensible. Some more choice quotes from AiG:

Scientifically, we do not know if the Bible is true, and we never will. That, of course, does not derogate from the truth or authority of Scripture, for two reasons: Scripture is self-authenticating; and science cannot prove anything true.

David had to battle the enemies of Israel militarily. Our war with the enemies of Christ is spiritual and intellectual in nature, but it is just as real, and even more deadly. As Christians our posture should be one of righteous indignation against the giant of skeptical archaeology that slurs the truth of the Word of Almighty God. Who are these archaeologists who think they can disprove Scripture with a piece of broken pottery dug out of the mud? Who are the ?moderate majority? who dare tell us what parts of the Bible are ?reasonable? to believe? Let us be as eager to confront the giant of archaeology as David was to confront the Philistine champion. In the struggle between the eternal Word of God and secular theories, we know by revelation that God will crush all anti-Christian arguments and imaginations under our feet.

So, if i understand correctly, the bible is literally true. Science that supports the bible is fab and great and lovely. Science that contradicts the bible is just wrong, because it contradicts the bible, which is literally true. The bible is right and unchanging, while scientists can't be trusted because they change their theories as new evidence comes to light. Is this right? Have i understood correctly? Please have enough confidence in your beliefs to defend them, not just get affronted at people questioning them. Show us some righteous indignation.

That's right, the bible is true because it says so in the bible.

I know a Young Earth Creationist. Who has a PhD. In Biochemistry. From Cambridge

I can believe that, in that biochemisry largely deals with what is here now rather than how it got that way, and a PhD requires knowing more and more about less and less, other stuff is Not Your Department - so you are less likely to see the big picture things in a systemic way.

Scripture is self-authenticating

The Mandy Rice Davies Rule of Self Authentication - "Well 'e would say that wouldn't 'e" :o

Scripture is self-authenticating

Oh silly us. That really is a knock-down argument.

I'm sorry, but surely no-one who has read not only Genesis I but also Genesis II and noted that they have different chronologies can believe that every word is the literal truth?

That's it. To most/all young earth creationists (as well as in various flavours of Christianity), if it's in the Bible it is without question True. Therefore anything that goes against what it says in the Bible is axiomatically False.

Snorbs - so what happens if someone points out the incompatibilities within itelf? Do their brain circuits short out and wipe their memory of the event so they can carry on believing? I expect someone has written a slippery standard answer to the Gen I/II question and they can just spout that.

Oh, do we all know how the human population propagated from the offspring of Adam and Eve's offspring - both boys, Cain and Seth? Maybe there's more than one answer but the one I've heard is a humdinger.

Not a creationist, but, the starting point for people who are is that the Bible is the literal truth. It is the inspired Word of God, is self reliant, self sufficient, self referencing and self authenticating. (See Reformist pillar Sola Scriptura).

Anything that doesn't agree with, or contradicts, God's inspired, revealed Word is NOT TRUE and, usually, is designed to lead us away from God's truth. Science not done from a creationist Christian perspective is not to be trusted because it's usually done by godless heathens who are trying to lead people away from God and basically give Him a bad name.

Anything that supports your interpretation of literal Biblical truth is to be expected and can be used as evidence that the Bible is, indeed, true. But you already know that so this evidence is only to convince other people.

The crux of the matter is that anything that contradicts the Bible is wrong on the basis that it contradicts the Bible which is never wrong because it is God's inspired Word and, therefore, always right and to be taken at face value.

That's why lots of more fundamentalist women cover their hair, only wear dresses, don't wear gold jewelry, are submissive wives, don't take positions of responsibility in church.......

That's what i'm struggling with Snorbs. I can understand how someone can develop a particular belief system, but i cannot understand how they can then hold onto it so blindly, wilfully twisting and misinterpreting the evidence, or simply ignoring it.

Its sad - there are none so blind as those who will not see.

Grimma, there are no inconsistencies in the Bible. Any that you think you might have found merely demonstrate your inability to understand god's message. You should read the Bible more carefully and pray that god will show you the truth.

Or, at least, that was what I was told by a Jehovah's Witness one day.

RedMolly, the mindset of the Bible literalists appears to be one that is very black and white. It's a "If you're not with us, you're against us" thing. So the act of pointing out contradictory evidence simply demonstrates that you have either been deceived by satan or are actively working for him to promote his satanic ways.

Oh right. And the JWs have prayed so well that they've found extra nuggets of truth in there that have eluded even other fundamentalist sects, such as celebrating birthdays and donated blood being bad ideas.

You don't need to go to America to see the answers in genesis arguments. Try Noah's Ark, the creationist zoo and fun day out for all the family in Somerset.

They have an education centre and are really keen on school trips.

Well exactly Grimma. It's amazing what you can find in a holy book if you try hard enough, isn't it?

sciencelover, I think there are some suggestions that the speed of light could have been faster during the early moments of the universe when it was expanding incredibly fast and things were downright weird anyway. But that wouldn't explain the sorts of gross effects you'd get by believing a 14billion year-old universe is only 6000 years old.

I've also seen YECs claim that there are, indeed, galaxies billions of light years away that are only 6,000 years old. When asked how we can therefore see them - because, after all, it would take light from those galaxies billions of years to reach us and if the galaxy is only 6,000 years old the light wouldn't have reached us yet - they say aha! When god created the universe he also created the light from those galaxies.

So what we think is a photon that's billions of years old and that originated in a galaxy on the other side of the universe is actually a photon that's no more than 6,000 years old that god aimed at the earth to make it look like it came from the distant galaxy.

Euphemism, you should take your DH to the zoo. I think they've got a poster up (or at least they used to anyway) saying 'if you find any inaccuracies in our information, please let us know'. Alongside a family tree showing tracing the family tree of a lot of kings and queens back to Adam and Eve... We went there once when on holiday not realising it was a creationist outfit and were when it slowly dawned on us. They seem to have become a lot more slick and professional since then so I suspect money is coming in from somewhere with a vested interest.

Molly, you don't understand because you have been fooled by Satan and sucked in by his lies so you are unable to see God's truth. All the "evidence" that the universe is more than 6000 years old is put there by the Devil to mislead and worldly people are so consumed by their arrogance that they think that they can dismiss God. That's basically how it goes.

it is the case that if you find inconsistencies or mistakes, you are just not having enough faith/studying and praying hard enough.

Isn't satan a bit of a christian paradox?

Well, yes, he is. But every fundamentalist of any colour I have ever met sees him behind every lamppost and under every bush. I've lost count of the number of times I've been told about his greatest trick has been fooling people that he doesn't exist and is, instead, the evil tendencies within us all.

I belong to a Christian online women's group and there is absolutely no debate with most of them because if you say anything that contradicts their world view you are inviting in The Enemy. Most of them won't even say the Devil or Satan in case it draws his attention.

I just showed that site to DH, a prof of evolutionary biology. He's currently spitting feathers
That's remarkable, surely our common ancestors with birds predate the evolution of feathers?