AIBU to think the current Queen has been a mediocre to poor Monarch?

[ComposHat]

Anyone else think all the praise lavished on her is undue? We are all told that she has done a 'good job' but has she really? The servile media, including the supposedly balanced BBC won't broker any attempts to criticise her in any way. We are simply told that she has been 'beyond reproach.'

I'd argue that she's been a dull and unimaginative Monarch, clinging to hidebound tradition and fighting to preserve arcane privileges like a Royal Yacht (actually a mini cruise liner) and resisting paying tax on her income. At crucial moments in her reign she's dallied and shown weak leadership.

On her watch the monarchy has at best stagnated and at worst slipped into an inexorable decline and has begun to feel like an anachronism.

I'll venture that history will not judge her as kindly as all these fawning contemporary commentators do. Her reign will be seen as the point at which the rot set in.

As for him 'borrowing' a helicopter, it would have been worked into a scheduled training flight and will be quite common with aircrew. I was on a training flight and they factored a fly past of my mum's house in for me.

headfairy, i did actually think of that, but i wasn't going to let that thought get in the way of my argument.

Hermione I don't long for an elected head of state, the only people who put themselves forward for that sort of thing are massive egotists. I'm not saying there aren't massive egos in the royal family by the way, but in one way, now we've got past all this divine right bullshit, all they did to get their position in life was be born, and we've all done that. Nothing special. Someone's who's head of state on an elected mandate would be an insufferable ego, and no cheaper IMO.

Queen's the best of a bad lot.

:o creighton

surprisinglycurvaceous, didn't we already establish it was Edward Viii who was the full on flag waving Nazi? Not sure if George Vi was ever shown to be too much of a fan of the Nazis, though don't forget, it was quite fashionable amongst the upper classes of that time to hold far right wing views. Doesn't make it right, but the royals were no different to any other upper class family in that respect.

YABU
She is a good head of state. I would rather have her than someone elected or apointed.

She makes an "average" person like me feel special. I saw her once outside a chapel and it is a special memory. Imagine how many thousands of people have seen her and have a special memory as a result.

So in my eyes she has international standing and personal appeal to me as an individual.

Gwlondon, she makes you feel special? Eh??!

Yes. She could have just left. But stood around a bit outside. Okay "special" is a bit over the top!

Going back historically, and obviously although to look at me today you wouldn't believe it I wasn't around then and probably none of you were either, but we have progressed further than those past views and in many respects our Queen has helped that along by stepping back from being so politically focused and concentrating on "good works".

It is a little unfair to compare our Queen to some of her ancestors, just as you aren't responsible for your parents actions (you all of you, me included.....just to clarify) and also unfair to use the actions of her children to have a go at her, just as if your children go out and do something as adults that you disapprove of you wouldn't be held responsible.

And WW1 was truly brutal, so many young men died and it was relatively soon after the Crimean War, they then had huge economical issues (the Great Depression) and then they were facing another all out war. Right not wouldn't we do a great deal not to go to another Afghanistan? By all accounts it was a truly shitty period, in an era where women were only just starting to be recognised generally, had only just got the ability to vote. All those things we would now think are truly bonkers, were everyday back then. And our Queen has seen nearly all of it happen.

sovery you are back! I have been hanging out here on me todd it seems

And obviously making accidental insulting remarks to some posters too

Poohbearshole

See she's damned if she does and damned if she doesn't - with Diana she took her grandchildren away to grieve and was criticized, she didn't lower the flag - well as you aren't particularly royalist then why are you bothered? Its just a flag in that situation. And Diana wasn't actually part of the Royal family when she died.

I mentioned the flag as she insisted it wasn't to be lowered despite the public - her public - calling for it to be lowered as a mark of respect. Diana might have been divorced by then but she was still the mother of a future king. She was totally out of touch with her people. I think she only did a U turn as her advisors were telling her that her popularity would plummit otherwise.

OK so she didn't visit Aberfan until 9 days after the disaster - perhaps she was letting the village recover itself, there was mayhem there and the press were not particularly sensitive to what had happened, and a Royal visit even in sympathy was not something that was so easily achieved with all the security detail that is required to move HRH and it was far more stringent then than it is now. And reports of that time did say she was close to tears on meeting the survivors.

See, I think she should have done a low key visit - shown some warmth and humanity for people that were suffering. I can't believe security detail as you put it was more stringent then, in fact I think it's probably more stringent now.

If she cried in public or let down her guard you would be equally as disgusted so she really can't win.

How presumptious saying I'd be equally disgusted. You have no idea what I would feel. Actually I'd like to see her guard down a bit more - someone a bit more human. As the OP says she's dull and unimaginative.

she had to stop herself from crying when she went to dunblane, her eyes were red. if she is dull and unimaginative she probably learned that this was the way to go. sister was very lively so was her uncle on her father's side. maybe duty and dullness were seen as the order of the day. as she isn't a warlord or managing the country's books, she doesn't need to be exciting or innovative. she needs to keep the mornarchy and her family on an even keel so that they are not asked to leave like, the german, bulgarian, albanian, greek, spanish (for a while), portuguese, italian, russian etc etc royal families. that's why she is the senior royal in the whole european tribe and can make the others travel by bus to her grandson's wedding!

I think you (general you) fall into a Diana or Non Diana camp, I didn't particularly like the Doe Eyed Little Girl image that she portrayed, she really was in it for the lifestyle. Again when I refer to you here in the flag terms I am referring to those who would like a republic, but then they also should not have been that bothered.

I am no expert of Aberfan so I am sorry, however from what I do know there is no way she would ever have been allowed to do a low key visit due to the amount of press that were there at the time. It just wouldn't have been possible. Also we will have no way of knowing if she wanted to go prior to that moment in time or not.

Sorry, last bit was meant to be disappointed not disgusted I was distracted at the time of writing. I wasnt intending on being presumptuous although no doubt there is someone hanging around who would have been disgusted as opposed to disappointed

creighton I made my boss travel by bus to my wedding............ I am not that important though. Can you imagine a logistical nightmare of all the royals from here there and everywhere wanting to bring their security detail etc etc in the manner of our lesser royals who think they are super important but none of us really give a shit!

(I do give a shit about the Queen though. Not much bothered about the Princess Pushy style or Andrews children)

diana wasn't in it for the lifestyle, she came from a very rich and (self)important family. she married charles to have her children become monarchs. her sister tried before her. everyone from their 'class' tried to get into the royal family. it is a business of being royal and and privileged. it is a good place to be as there are so many people wanting to fawn all over them.

Pooh, that is precisely my point. she can pull rank and get them to leave their egos at the door.

Pooh, she said herself with hindsight she shouldn't have left it 9 days. I'm not against having a monarchy, I just don't like being told by the press how wonderful she is when I think actually to my mind she doesn't do anything that wonderful - at least nothing that couldn't be carried out by someone else with a bit of training.

I don't think Diana was in it for the lifestyle. She was 19 and I think in love. She already had a certain lifestyle. Now I do think that it something that could be said of Kate though - I think she definitely had her eye on the lifestyle.

I disagree, I see that as being in it for the lifestyle and all the trappings. She was young and possibly naive, but I think she had pretty good spin and wasn't necessarily a wonderful person that many believe. Whether that was a product of her upbringing, or the lifestyle that she found herself in we will never know but I would have thought it was an isolating place and an uneviable position that made everyone connected to them very unhappy. I think many people at the time would have had this impression of a golden lifestyle, however I think it has become apparent that it is a gilded cage rather than a brilliant life, the only people who really benefit are those on the fringes (think Pippa Middleton). BUT to her credit the Queen tried to help where possible and was incredibly kind to her.

And I have now spent so long doing this sodding post it probably isn't relevant any more and I have probably insulted someone else

Best post so far was from WhyAlwaysBoris at 16:42.

(sorry, can't copy & paste on phone)

If she can pull rank amongst other royals then they must admire her a fair amount and think that she is worth listening to . I think quite possibly she is more well respected in many other countries and seen as a treasure.......good for the tourist industry

Tabliope - I expect there are many things that she has felt regret for and wished she had done differently. She is Queen but she is also human, although not allowed to make mistakes.

If you took away the Queen side of things for a minute and she was a nice lady whose son & dil had had a very messy and public divorce and then the dil is killed in an accident pretty soon afterwards having flaunted her fancy man in front of her children (its the best example I can come up with at this moment ) and loads of other people then you would probably retreat to take stock and let your family recover. I would have thought at that moment in time a decision about raising or lowering a flag would be one that wasn't made by HRH. Just like not insisting on going to Aberfan immediately.

diana had a fancy man after her marriage went to pot. charles had his fancy woman before during and after the marriage, undermining his wife in front of the children. diana may not have been perfect but he was nothing to be proud of.

OP_YABU- I doubt if you could have done a better job.
Personally it wouold bore me ridgid listening to people who meant jack shit to me, day in day out.

(and during )

I think the whole thing was misguided and sad, he for protocol not allowed to marry the person who he was in love with due to her "history", she was probably as forced into it as he was and neither were happy.

However she really used the press for the pity factor (there is no way especially with her family history and her sister etc that she would NOT have known about Camilla, just not possible) and my disgust appeared with that well publicised photo of her in an operating theatre and her tv interview. Bleurgh.

But you've just said she can pull rank Pooh so I'm sure she could have pulled rank about lowering the flag and going to Aberfan. In fact, the flag thing was her decision - there was a big thing in the press at the time and in the end she saw the way public feeling was going and she allowed it to be lowered. She is the Queen after all, I'm sure she can make these decisions.

Also, you make it sound like she was there every minute for William and Harry when their mother died yet this is a woman that barely saw Charles in his first two years as didn't she choose to spend time with Philip on Malta where he was posted? So I'm not sure the normal motherly instincts are truly there.

I think Charles flaunted his fancy woman as much as Diana if you can call Diana having a boyfriend (Dodi) after she was divorced.

You can't convince me she's wonderful as I just don't see her that way. As I said, I don't mind having the monarchy, I just don't see her as anything special or the expectation that we all have to think they are and that everything they do is beyond reproach.