to think there is not much difference between private schooling and moving into catchment area of a good school?

[knowitallstrikesagain]

Lots of people I know consider themselves to be against private education. But the vast majority of them aspire to live in an area with a good high school. These area are more expensive to live in, so basically they are talking about using money to get their children a good education, they are just going about it in a different way.

AIBU to think you should not be 'morally opposed' to private education if you move into a desireable area just to be near good schools when you are well aware that other people cannot afford this location?

Hello Poosh - Nice to meet you [offers hand in greeting]

In my defence, at least I admit I'm a hypocrite and always have done. But just because I don't believe in private education/health doesn't mean i'm going to let my kids down by not giving them the best I can in the unfair system that currently exists.

Exactly, knowitallstrikesagain - much more succinctly put than I ever could!

Aaaaaarrggh. So sorry knowitall - it was vj.
Made me cross - had to respond and can't flick back on my phone!!!

YANBU OP. I completely agree with you!

I am a long way from having school age children but I have no moral problem with private school and would consider it. I would also be happy to consider good state schools and would take it into account when looking at areas to buy in. To me both of those options involve using money to get the best education for your child, so there isn't some big moral difference. I think it is natural to want the best for your child.

I have encountered a few people who were quite hypocritical about schools. I went to a state grammar. There was also a good comprehensive in the area which had a "grammar school stream". The kids in that stream were not in any mixed ability classes and for all intents and purposes it was like being at a grammar school. The mum of one of my friends who went there used to go on and on about how she opposed grammar schools, yet she was happy for her daughter to be in the "grammar school stream" of the town's best comprehensive. Funny that she didn't send her daughter to her local comp, which was a dump (I wouldn't care where she sent her kids if she didn't have so much to say about other people's school choices). The worst of it is that as soon as her daughter left, she started to campaign for abolition of the good comp's grammar school stream as it was elitist - you could not make it up!

conors That's ok. I am a knowitall and it is annoying!

Lauriefairycake,
Those properties are all over the LHA rate, and that's assuming the agencies renting them out don't have criteria (such as you've got to earn three times the rent in order to be deemed a viable tenant, or no housing benefit). That's also forgetting about the cost of moving (all the obvious costs as well as the possible hidden charges from agencies).

I don't mean to pick on you though. I think the main point I'd like to make is that of course there are grey areas in most questions about what the right and wrong thing to do are, so obviously in response to the OP my answer would be: yes of course there is a difference, but I suppose what you might really be asking is whether that difference is morally significant - so you'd have to tell us what you think is the right/ wrong thing to do in chosing your childrens education.

Hi shew - [takes hand offered in greeting]

That was the exact defence used by my boss when I called him a hypocrit (I was too young (or too stupid) to know not to say that to a boss :( )

I should add that my kids are at private school.

You, me and him will use money to buy a better education for our kids or so that we can jump the queue for an operation. If your actions are the same as mine then your higher ideals are meaningless.

Its a bit like listening to the U2 front man Bono go on about how first world banks should forgive the debts of third world economies. The man is worth £700 million for fecks sake. That is problably the GDP of some of the countries that he is lobbying for.

The way I see it, unless one is prepared to walk the walk then one shouldn't be lecturing others.

.. I seemed to dropped the 'e' from hypocrite. Oops.

Yes i agree my higher ideals are meaningless Poosh.

But I've never lectured others and have said in the past in RL that I'm a hypocrite.

So we agree.

shew - how do you expect me to demonise you if you keep agreeing with me :)

Poosh.

I'm just a nice person without the guts to stand up for what I believe in - especially at the expense of my family.

You'd like me really!

Well, if you don't know of a state school with an entirely middle class catchment you haven't seen Collis school in Teddington!

You need to be able to afford Teddington house prices, but not having that £1m spare I don't live there.

We send DD private and I know full well that there are parents of Collis kids who earn about 3 times what myself and DH do...but they must have huge mortgages. I've decided against a mortgage and pay school fees instead.

Interestingly in the state school infants DD was at prior to going private, in a school of 300 children there were 3 black children, 5 Asian Children and one Chinese. Her private school is nearly 50% ethnic minorities, and certainly is not a white middle class ghetto, despite me living in a West London white middle class ghetto.

But I suspect W London severely distorts the national average when it comes to schools, the catchment areas are about 1-2 streets near the school and that's it.

We knew that we could get DD into the local private school more easily than we could move house in order to have a chance of getting into the local state school. It also worked out about the same in money terms and frankly, I didn't want to move house.

I'd really prefer not to pay school fees but I don't think feel I am doing a terrible thing opting out of state and those people who lie about where they live or rent a house for 6 months just to get a school place are doing a lot worse, they are taking a place away from someone, I'm just deciding not even to bother applying for that place.

So , I think the Op is NBU.

I am sorry if I upset people before, I came in without reading the thread and obviously got peoples backs up and it wasn't really my intention. I just often feel sad that people cannot understand that your local state comp is going to have a mixed intake and that it is par for the course they will have mixed results, it doesn't mean they are necessarily crap it just means they have children of all abilities and cater for those of all abilities.

Miggsie, i don't agree with you re. ethnic minorities being a London thing. The Ashford school in Kent is mainly ethnic minorities I would have thought having worked by it.

I don't really understand the arguments on this thread, but wanted to say aren't schools just one of a number of things you take into account when you're choosing a house? We needed to be near the station, I wanted to be close to my parents, near the shops, a pub, childminders, etc etc. AND we did have a look at which schools were close.

We wouldn't have moved to our area if the schools were rubbish, but equally we wouldn't have moved there if there was no transport. Or no shops.

I don't understand why that's a bad thing?

Because of the economic uncertainty a lot of parents who would otherwise put their kids through private schools are now going down the state route. Which means more competition for those coveted state school places. Which means that those parents that can afford tutoring will have an advantage over less well off parents.

Its kind of ironic, at least in my opinion. If some of the people out there have their way and private schools were to be banned then those displaced parents would be using their money to drive up property prices in your area and you would be pushed out or face having your DCs compete in 11+ against kids who have professional tutors. And with the influx of pupils your taxes will have to go up so to pay for more schools and more teachers.

So be careful what you wish for :o

The 11+ system has always been like that in my experience

mrs I don't think anyone is saying it is a bad thing per se.

Just that if you've made those choices, you're in no position to lecture others.

shew - I once worked with a contractor who would regularly rant about how rich people and large corparations dodge paying their share of taxes and how The System favoured the rich and powerful. His beliefs didn't stop him declaring his kitchen furniture as 'office furnishings' and his monthly trips Oop North to his parents as 'business mileage'. And taking stuff from the stationary cabinet was not stealing in his eyes.

Unlike you, he refused to see the hypocrisy so at least you can pride yourself on being a self aware hypocrite so here, have a bunch of

It may be a bit dubious morally but it is sensible financially as you only have to pay the extra once no matter how many children you have and if you buy you can recoup the money when you sell.

Babybarrister ARF at pray rather than pay

I would prefer to stretch for a lovely home for the whole family and have my dc educated in the state system. I wouldn't educate privately ever no matter what sort of property it was.

Very true. Look at the average house prices in areas with outstanding schools. It's paying for education whilst being able to put on a pious face and say you support state education.

I could have afforded both tbh but didn't.

If you have a council home, I assume you can't put in a request to move because you don't want your children to go to a particular school and would prefer to be in a different catchment area?