To think that this is not really normal behaviour for a 5yo?

[lecce]

I have had a really rough day with ds1 and would love to hear some views from others about whether his behaviour is fairly typical for a 5yo as I keep getting these niggles about him.

He just seems so incredibly negative and moany about every little thing. "It's not fair..." "You think you're the boss..." "I've got nothing/never get to play" and other similar complaints frequently come from him in the most whingy whine ever.

We mainly try to ignore/distract when this is happening and have most success with techniques that use humour eg, "Oh ds, stop laughing, it's not funny, you've got to put your toys away and that's so unfair.." said while he's crying about tidying up type stuff and it does work but it's getting wearing having to turn on the comedy routine several times a day - I just wish he'd stop it. Sometimes, like today, I just can't do it and end up shouting .

We went to the park this afternoon and he was (loosely) dressed as a Roman soldier with props. The park was packed and he spent the first 15 minutes or so trying to get random children to play Romans with him but none were interested. He spent the rest of the time wandering around by himself, (I was busy with ds2 (2.10) who needs watching as a is a nutter live-wire) chuntering on about being a Roman and cried on the way home because no one likes him. I tried explaining that maybe he could suggest more popular games, like chase, and that not all children will want to hear about Romans as soon as they have met him, but he just seems so sad.

I work ft so the weekends are all I get and I just feel terrible that we haven't really had a nice time today. Also, and this bit I am sure is unreasonable, I keep thinking that, because dh is a sahd but insists there is no problem, he is not picking up on ds's problems and is letting thngs slide - things I would be dealing with if I was at home. This is bollocks because dh is a great dad but I can't help feeling crap about the whole thing just now.

My as is the same, aged 8. Could have written your post. I feel ur pain.

Have a massive glass of wine on me. Sounds like a hard day, and your son sounds v normal! Horrid when you don't see them as much as you'd like and it's like this, but honestly nothing to worry about. Promise.

Ds.

Oh dear, poor boy. I know a tiny girl who wants other 3 year olds to play Narnia, but they don't know how either.
He sounds normal to me; he will find more like-minded children as they all mature.

I don't have a huge amount of experience with 5 YOs, but to me, whining, being negative, having to be taught the rules of how to play nicely with other children, and just generally going on don't sound anything out of the norm.

Could your post be more about how you feel about your DH being the one to stay at home with him?

Seems a bit of an obvious thing to zero in on, but it must mean something to you or you wouldn't have included it.

GS is 5 and doesn't whine unless very tired, but a lot of his peer group seem to whinge pretty much non-stop.
Some parents get annoyed, some let it wash over them.
I guess playing Romans is playing sword-fighting? Teach him Latin :)

Very normal...my DD is 4 and is very hard done by according to her...all day long! The other night it was "I've got no friends at home!" because her sister had been invited to a party....tonight its "I want a wooooorm....get me a worm! Why will nobody play worm digging???" for HOURS!

Thanks for replies - have cetainly got .

I probably do have twinges about dh staying home but for us it was really a no-brainer as he didn't really have a career and I do. Moreover, he has MS (though not really affected by it atm) so it was always clear I'd be the bread-winner. I took a year off for ds2 and that taught me that I am really not cut out to be a sahm. Still, I do feel I'm missing out a bit sometimes and what makes it really hard is that I'm so tired. Ds2 still sleeps badly and I deal with most of it as I'm scared dh could get ill if he did it. I'm a teacher and just snowed under atm so I feel terrible that they're really not getting the best of me.

Bunty no, not sword fighting (though he did have a sword). He had a backpack (a spider-man one ) with a plastic chicken leg and frying-pan and, from what I heard, was regaling other children with tales of how far Roman soldiers had to march etc!

My DS is very nearly five and moans in this way all the time. It's exhausting. He'll suddenly snap out of it for a while but then as suddenly start up again. His twin sister doesn't do it so much but I figure it's a maturity thing. I really hope it's just a stage, I can't handle it for much longer. DD goes out of her way to push his buttons and then be the angelic child.

Am going down the wine route here.

My nearly 5yo would love to play Romans with your ds. He was most disappointed when he typed in www.romans.co.uk that it didn't come up with a Roman soldier site, but an estate agent. he'd have been phoning the trade description people if he'd lnown about them

My ds would probably have listened to the Roman facts and recited them back to me later. But your ds might have had to listen to either WWII facts (he's upstairs reading about doodlebugs at present) or possibly military airplanes (his ambition for the last 2 years is to become a Red Arrow pilot, which recently he's added he also would like to fly Spitfires too)

Not sure it's normal, but it's very sweet.

sounds about normal to me - my 5 yr old often insists on spending the day in costume and has quite an array - from Spiderman to (ahem) Kat Von D (don't ask) Enjoy him when you can and don't worry so much - he sounds quite a character, and the whinging is just something they go through (my 5 yr old doesn't so much, but my 7 yr old could make a living out of it!) Enjoy your wine!

something similar here with 5 yr old whinging. For a few weeks there it seemed constant and it was doing my patience reserves no good. we talked about good ways and not so good ways to get attention and now she will say she wants some attention instead of her previous air raid siren impression.

She sometimes feels a bit isolated from some other kids. She loves "Horrible Histories" and tries to get them into her own interpretations of "savage stone age." Thankfully her best pal is now being assimilated into this after implosion on sleep overs and they are getting better at finding the common ground in their role plays.

My dd 6 is like this it drives me insane if u don't let her do something I get "no one round here loves me, you all hate me" it's ridiculous!! She gets told everyday we lover her!!

I had a bad day with her today too, being a lovely day I took her and my other dc out for a walk to the shop to spend there money nanny have them and she went in got what se wanted like everyone else did and then cried all the way home because "she doesn't want what she bought anymore"
"she never gets anything" give me strength .. Her crying and whining but ruined the whole day for everyone!!

But she is now sitting here with me watch BBGT and she is cuddled up like a little angel :)

Your sons would love it where I live...it's one of the walled cities and we have "real" Roman soldiers on the march almost daily in term time....they shout orders to the DC who all march behind them...fab.

Sounds like a bog standard child to me.

What's he like schoolwise? Any problems?

My 5yo DS would have been THRILLED to find a Roman soldier with a spiderman backpack and a frying pan and a plastic chicken leg in the park.

Chester, houseonthecorner? :)

At school, I'm not sure. He didn't seem to have made any friends - there are only 5 other boys in his class, though there is one girl we already knew but they don't seem to mix a lot in school. He often comes home and says no one played with him but dh insists that he goes in and comes out very happily. However, on the 10 or so occasions I've taken him/picked him up he's seemed a little withdrawn - though that is only based on seeing him come out and go in - he just doesn't tear in like some of the others do.

Anyway, dh spoke to the teacher last week and she said his confidence has improved hugely (before school started he always seemed hugely confident anyway...) and she now has to tell him to let others have a turn talking. He also started mentioning a slightly older boy a lot who he was playing with at lunch - though that seems to have gone off the boil over the last few days.

I am quite worried about him socially tbh.

you know what, i think there is a HUGE amount to be said for motherly instinct.

reading your OP, he sound a LOT like my 7yr old who has high-functioning autism.
that isn't to say your son has it, because so many of the traits are things that we ALL have, after all it's a spectrum and clearly I am reading about one day in his life.

but things that stood out to me were bits like:
trying to get random people to play his game (can he tell they are uninterested or does he keep on at them?)
crying because no-one likes him- cos he just doesn't understand how it all works
the negativity- DS1 always will find something negative about pretty much anything we do ever (even thing he really wants to do)
difficulty maintaining friendships
preferring older children/adults to people his own age

i'm not generally a diagnose people on the basis of one thread on here, but there were just so many similarities, coupled with your own gut instinct.

I think, if you are concerned then it's worth writing a list of your concerns and taking them either to the school (ask for meeting with class teacher and SENCO) or to your GP.

fwiw i did several of these "is this normal" threads on here before getting up the courage to go to the GP, and got many "yes totally normal" replies - so it's really worth going with how you feel about him. also, if there are any specific things you're concerned about then come over to the special needs-children topic and ask away

also the turn-takign when talking. potentially because he can't "read" people or "get" that you need to let other people have a go at talking.
equally could just be down to age and being excited and more confident!

Yes, I worry all the time about the autism thing .

to address the similarities you highlighted:
-I think he does get the message pretty quickly when children aren't interested and that is what causes the upset.

-It's not that often he cries but is quite often 'down' about no one liking him, though he can also sound matter-of-fact about it and at other times he does talk about playing with others at school. Sometimes at a park, he will 'gel' with someone and have a great time - it's not like he never plays well with his peers. Just how does it all work when you're 5?

• Yes the negativity is a nightmare but he generally does enjoy things once we've got into them- would that be typical of an autistic child?

-Don't know if he has difficulty maintaining friendships or just forming them in the first place I do sometimes get the impression other children don't get him, rather than he not getting them, but I suppose that's just my bias?

-He spoke well pretty early and used to make a bee-line for adults. He's pretty much stopped that now but often seems to have more success with slightly older children - not always the case though.

• Can't think of any examples now, but sometimes he seems realy perceptive and able to 'read' people exceptionally well.

I have discussed this with dh and he thinks I'm being absolutely ridiculous so don't really see how I can take it any further and, tbh, I would realy love to discuss it with a professional .

My dd1 is nearly five and the same. Does your ds keep his worst behaviour for you and is actually alright in the week with your dh? I sometimes wonder if my dd1 does her whiniest best to get my attention and doesn't care if it's negative attention when I get cross with her... (esp as dd2, aged 2, needs more attention/watching). I keep reminding myself that she's still really quite small and doesn't set out to annoy me on purpose (I hope).

Leece My 7 year old DD is a bit "odd" in some ways...struggled socially when she was a bit younger and gets obsessions...no DX though...it has taken a looong time to get her to "try" a bit with other kids...she finds a ot of them a bit boring. Brownies has helped ENORMOUSLY and I reccomend you see about Beavers for your DS>..another great thing has been cycling!

We cycle as a family and DD loves the freedom and her confidence has shot up.

well getting the message quickly is good (although clearly my answers are based mainly on my own child) certainly ds1 doesn't realise when people are uninterested and will carry on talking to them even if they're ignoring him/turning away etc

ditto "reading" people in general. this is something that people with autism have really big issues with normally.

the negativity thing i think for us is partly DS1 not handling change well (common with autism) so he is very negative if we say we need to go somewhere or do something, even though once we're there he is fine.
and he is very analytical, and very honest so if there is something he doesn't like he will tell you about it, which i guess makes him seem very negative

So it may well just be that your son is just being 5 and will "get" all of this in his own good time.
But I also think that you need to talk it through with someone. I certainly got to that point where I said I just wanted someone who knows what they're talking about to meet us and give an opinion.
so i would still say either go to the school or the GP and see what they say.

your son won't be diagnosed with something he hasn't got. so even if you get as far as having him assessed it's no bad thing. they'll either say "no, he is fine" in which case all is well and good, or "yes there is something here" in which case you can make sure he gets any help he needs.

there's nothing to lose by talking it through with someone

Thank you - that is pretty much where I'm at - really wanting to talk to someone about this stuff. Dh will be fuming if I bring it up again. Would it be dreadful to go to the gp or someone without telling him? I know it would be but I just so want to talk this through and I know dh won't agree at this stage .