to feel seething resentment towards those who profited from the house price bubble and hot anger at the Governments who allowed it to happen?

[TartyMcFarty]

You'll have to forgive my naivety here - I'm ranting about something I don't really understand.

DH and I are stuck. In 2006 we bought a (modest) property on a 100% mortgage. Foolish in hindsight, I know, but based on the advice of our IFA, the unshakeable faith of our families and society that property ownership was the way to go, and the increasing pressure at the time to get on the ladder or miss out, that was the decision we made. We then found that the lender, bastard bastard Northern Rock were unwilling to remortgage based on our lack of equity, despite us having overpaid by several thousand pounds. We couldn't shift the place, and with the agreement of a different IFA, remortgaged against the equity in my DM's property (love her!). It gets more complicated than that, but that's all that's needed here. Now we still can't sell it , our tax credits have suddenly disappeared, my pension contribution has increased (DH doesn't even have a pension) and the tracker rate is slowly increasing. We're on interest only, and as I'm part time since the having DD, with another DC on the way, there's not much of a cushion.

What's really angered me over the last couple of days is the dawning realisation of how people just a few years older than us have profited from the massive increase in property 'values'. I'm still in touch with our ex-neighbour. She bought seven years earlier than us, sold at £120k profit after 10 years (this is not London!), her partner was in a similar situation so they have ended up comfortably in a property of twice the size, renovated to a really lovely standard. Obviously my resentment isn't directed at them personally - they're good people, have profited from a stupid market and good luck to them - but it's just an illustration.

How can we possibly hope to survive in a property market that boomed by more than 3.5x in this instance alone? We can't even afford to maintain our own home to a good standard. Pay isn't moving at all, and we're currently looking at less than .75 of a pension between us. I can't even bear to think about how we'll support our DCs through HE, and the risk to my DM's home if interest rates shoot up.

I just need a rant. Those of us stupid enough to be sucked in at high LTV rates towards the peak of the market are fucked all ways, whereas people just 5 years older than us are untouchable. I know I've only given one example for which I know the exact figures, but there are others I can think of in the same lucky situation. There just doesn't seem to be any point in trying when you compare our situation with those who profited so enormously in the 00s.

Money comes and goes...

I would also say whilst the economy is doom and gloom, whilst our civil liberties and media freedom are gradually eroded, and whilst our material living standards look set to fall for the foreseeable whilst the debt shit storm either implodes or plays out more mundanely (spending in the economy depressed for a decade whilst folks deleverage) it is really important to do stuff that is free and good for your mental health. I've just been making cuttings of willow trees - literally just pruning twigs - and have 'made' over 250 baby trees today - it reet cheered me up, even if the world is off to hell in a handbasket. tomorrow I'm going to plant them and see if I can't keep these pesky gales off my veg garden.

Well said YellowWellies
And enjoy the company of others if you can.

That sounds a lovely thing to do yellowwellies. dh grows trees from conkers and acorns and I've been potting up beech seedlings which have been sprouting over my garden. Make a nice beech hedge in a few years time.

Yup. I look after a community area for our village and a bit of nettle-pulling or bark-chip raking is better than the gym and free and very satisfying.

I also recommend baking cakes and walking dogs.

Yes x 100! to everything Abra1d said :)

With Yellow Wellies and Abra1d there. Doing simple things that make a difference can really give you a reason to get up in the morning when the realities of modern life are pressing down a bit. We have chickens, and nothing cheers me up more than seeing them pootling around the garden whilst I'm weeding the veg patch. we've built up quite a plot this year and are looking into canning our own veg come harvest time too.

A lot of towns and villages are now beginning to develop community veg plots or orchards, these can be great for getting to know your community, and that's what's going to keep up all going longer term I think, we'll get back to closer communities and more cooperatives. Which can only be a good thing afaic!

Not going to be good in the USA if they dont extend this
www.zerohedge.com/news/your-ebt-card-has-been-denied-700000-are-about-lose-their-extended-jobless-claims-benefits

700,000 people is a drop in the bucket in the US economy.
States are losing eligibility to prolong EB because unemployment levels are dropping -- some people are actually returning to work.
There will be an election later this year in the US that will return either Mitt Romney or Barack Obama to power. Neither one will owe his election to the rabid tea party element.

Another rich list has been announced on the bbc, still no sign of the rothschild family making it into the top ten, pretty strange that since western civilization is built on money borrowed from them.

Anybody started to prepare themselves for the bad times yet now that the double dip recession has been announced ?, the double dip recession is actually a depression that is going to change our whole way of life once it really gets going.

red I spent some time trying to find my pen knife (a birthday present that has 'what would Macgyver do?' written on it - still can't find the fecker, I may have left it in Bristol 2 years ago)...and bought some matches. I looked at chain saws but that was more of a zombie apocalypse thing...

Do you have a survival kit list?

Also what if the bank that owns your mortgage debt goes under? Do you get the house for free?

My survival kit list consists of having no debts of any kind and being able to feed myself when the eurozone collapses.

You may have seen your prime minister say quite recently that the eurozone may collapse after all, they wont tell you directly because this would cause panic. Its also probably an excuse to do another round of quantative easing which will push inflation even higher.

If the bank that owns your mortgage goes under it will be taken over by the state and you will owe them the imaginary money that never existed. Nobody will be getting a free house.

The Prime minister has now told you that the eurozone could collapse and the bbc has told you that the markets will crash and millions of peoples pensions and savings will be wiped out. this was a message to the markets and an arse covering piece to say you were warned that it could happen.

2007 Was the peak standard of your living, there will be no economic recovery for a generation minimum, the west is not in a recession it is in a depression, essentials like fuel and food will keep getting more and more expensive.

When the crisis heats up in the UK at some point interest rates will rise, in most mortgage contracts there is a section that says under exceptional circumstances they can raise your rate to a higher level than its capped at. The banks can then say ok you cant afford to pay your mortgage because the rate has shot up to 15%, what we can do for you is extend your mortgage term by another 5 years so the repayments are lower, people will accept because their wages have gone down so much and minimum wage was abolished and things will keep getting worse until people realise that their mortgage has turned into a lifetime debt that will outlive them. This is when the word mortgage will revert back to its true meaning (mort=death).

State pension age will keep going up because there is no money left to pay it out, it will get to the point where most people die before they reach state pension age.

It was always going to end this way due to fractional reserve banking printing money out of thin air and giving it to people to create debt. www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=53593

Or you can just keep track of whats happening in the global economy via the mainstream media and everything will be fine.

The choice is yours.

red I was hoping for a more practical list than that. Fishing line? machete?

Also what exactly awful will happen if I owe my mortgage to the state instead of the bank? Isn't that better?

You're fun redshield
Have you a loudspeaker?

I agree with whoever mentioned the effect of buy-to-let earlier in this thread. Yes, it's all very well buying a second/ third/ fourth property as an investment (and some of my lovely friends have done this), but the fact is that you are directly responsible for making it bloody difficult for someone to own the home they want to live in. All actions have consequences, of course they do. This is yours.

"red I was hoping for a more practical list than that. Fishing line? machete?"

redshield are you anti-semitic?

Why would you ask me if i am anti semitic ?

www.infowars.com/22-signs-that-the-collapsing-spanish-economy-is-heading-into-a-great-depression/

Britain will go the same way as the eurozone at some point.

grrrr....people think I am taking the piss but I would genuinely like to know what people would have on their surviving the eruo crisis kit list!

Its a bit more than a euro crisis, the wealth of western civilization is going to be eroded and the standard of living is going to decline considerably.

This isnt something thats going to last for a while like a recession, this is just how life will be.

Plenty of people are becoming as self sufficient as possible so they wont have to pay sky high energy bills and food prices once we get deeper into the recession that is actually a depression.

Food will still be available but will you be able to afford it after your wage keeps decreasing every year.

Labour did well at the polling stations i see, i wonder what orders ed balls received at last years bildeberg confrence.

So I should buy seeds?

Start growing my own food?

YABU to some degree. We bought in 2007 but we couldn't afford a house. I think we still can't afford one comfortably. Well, we could have if we had a 100% mortgage but decided to buy a 3 bedroom flat in what was then a less desirable area with 30% deposit. It's been paid off and the value has risen by about $100k since then but still much cheaper than a house. Even if the value had not risen though, and that is something completely out of our control, we didn't take on too much debt. If we had taken out a 100% mortgage and relied upon the 'bigger fool' theory to bail us out if it all got a bit too much, we would really be in a lot of trouble. I think the important thing is to look at your own circumstances before jumping in, rather than looking at what everyone else is doing, because you don't know how much family help etc they might be getting. My parents live in a rural area and the value of their home has not skyrocketed - in terms of average wages then and now it's probably worth about the same as they paid for it- not all baby boomers have fed at the trough..

Its up to you, i know i will be doing it once ive bought a house with a garden, throw in a wood burning stove and a water meter and my bills will be very small.

Our currency has already been devalued by 30% so if they do another round of quantative easing its going to devalue even more, which in turn will push prices of essentials up even higher.

Lots of people are already having to use food banks just to survive.

There have always been survivalists, especially in the seventies. My parents are more than a bit like that too. Nothing at all wrong with it of course but sometimes I think they all used to get a bit disappointed that everything didn't come to a grinding halt and they would be lauded for their skills like the way they had envisioned It's not that what you say about the banking system is not true but there are always ways around that (communalism etc) and the 'little people' have been employing those strategies for centuries. If you have a bit of land, growing a bit of your own food has always been a good idea. At least herbs and such. I can honestly say to my kids "When I was your age, my father used to make me to chop the wood".