Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The grand national is cruel to horses

999 replies

McHappyPants2012 · 12/04/2012 15:20

Alot of the horses will be injured and whipped into going faster, it's also a long race course.

I can't believe people would bet on this event

OP posts:
Mutt · 15/04/2012 09:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:06

If they had pulled him out everyone who had bet on him would have got their money back as he would have been a non runner as they were not under starters oders at that point

Flightty · 15/04/2012 09:06

Catgirl, it's fine, I didn't read your post re the wealthy being in charge properly either. Sorry. We all need more sleep Smile

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:10

um...ok but I failt to see the relevance of mentioning the tory government then.

It didn't change much under a labout governement.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:10

I miss sleep :)

Fireandashes · 15/04/2012 09:13

Flightty, I'm trying very hard not to come across as rude here, but almost every post you make just expresses further ignorance of some aspect of the sport and diminishes my respect for your opinions. From the comparative effects of a racing whip and a general riding whip (contrary to your assertion, the latter is MUCH more capable of doing harm to a horse whereas the former has foam padding and air cushioning and relies on the sound it makes as much as it does the physical contact to be effective) to your understanding of the make-up of racehorse ownership, you can state your beliefs as vehemently and eloquently as you like but they are just plain WRONG.

Have you heard of racing partnerships? Joint ownerships? Racing clubs? These multi-ownership entities have made horse racing ownership more affordable than ever before. Yes, there are still the Sheikhs on the Flat and the multi-millionaire owners of strings of horses, but they are the minority nowadays. People can pay for a half, a quarter, a twelfth, a twentieth of a horse with a group of like-minded friends. If you ever have a moment, look up the story of Dream Alliance. That's the reality of horse ownership for thousands of people nowadays.

And as for the "it's not working" aspect...I'm not going to rehash my entire former post but in a nutshell: while there is racing, horses will die. While there is any equestrian sport, horses will die. While human beings keep horses for pleasure, horses will die. All the safety measures, modifications and welfare rules in the world won't ever change that. It's a hard fact to stomach and shouldn't stop us all working to identify and implement further improvements (eg such as reducing field sizes in the National). But horses will still die. If you can't accept that, join Animal Aid and work towards the abolition of horse ownership as the only logical conclusion. If you think that's too extreme then you ( abstract you) are a hypocrite, because you've made the decision that the death of Horse X is unacceptable (because it happens on a TV in your living room; because that death is a by-product of people trying to make money out of racing) but the death of Horse Y is fine (because it happens in a field and you'll never know about it). A well-meaning hypocrite, but a hypocrite nonetheless.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:17

Also - just to point out - ownership of racehorses is not as expensive as people might think, even without joint ownership schemes. I am not saying its cheap but you don't need to be CEO level to do it.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:18

Can I point out that I can actually spell, I am just exhausted and juggling a very wriggly baby

Sorry

MissBetsyTrotwood · 15/04/2012 09:18

ExcitedElectrons (great name btw) it's good to hear your kennel and most others are doing well by greyhounds. I agree that it's hard to have perspective when you are not part of an industry and it's easy to find sites online that paint an extremely negative picture of it. From what I know the regulated industry has cleaned up a lot with the creation of the RGT for example.

I don't think our dog was cruelly treated - he's wonderful and trusting with people and his trainer clearly did the right thing by paying out for him to be rehomed. However, he has had a hard life and the facts of that are there for all to see. He has been worked damn hard and his body shows this. He's been left with ongoing health problems because of the accidents he had. It can't be denied either that there are far too many dogs that do slip through the net every year and disappear or get sent to other countries with less regulated industries. I'm not against the sport itself and if all kennels and independent trainers were like you I'd feel able to enjoy it. Sadly, human nature being what it is I fear this will never be the case.

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:20

what about the horses owned by syndicates that dont win? many many horses are sent to their death because they dont earn any money

a colleague at work part owned a horse. it didnt win. it got expensive. they sold it for dog meat in Belgium.

i think its a fairly disgusting industry all around really.

kilmuir · 15/04/2012 09:21

Barbaric, the grand slaughter.
They are soon carted off to slaughter house. Don't buy into this "we love our horse so much" yes only when it is winning.

Mutt · 15/04/2012 09:21

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:22

Hmmm - that really doesnt happen very often as it makes no financial sense whatsoever. In fact I am not sure I believe your friend.

Why sell a horse for a couple of £100 for meat when you can sell it to someone to keep and ride for a couple of grand?

Flightty · 15/04/2012 09:23

Fireandashes, I'm afraid you've lost me. If I'm wrong about the whip, put me right. I'm quite willing to concede. I don't know anything much about horses. I'm putting things as they appear to me.

Your second half makes me wonder where I said all that.

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:23

could anyone 'in the know' answer my point?

how many horses that don't win get sold for dog meat? the only person i know who part owned a horse sent it to its death when it didnt win. They didnt want the expense of a horse that wasnt winning.

how much does this happen in this industry? i would like to know.

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:24

he certainly wasnt a friend.

he was a colleague in a syndicate.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:24

Plus - how does he know where the carcass was sent?

Fireandashes · 15/04/2012 09:26

Missed the quotes about Synchronised unshipping McCoy due to the time it takes me to laboriously type on this phone.

Synchronised did not chuck his rider off because he didn't want to race! He shied/jinked at the white line and McCoy, taken by surprise, fell off. Again, an understanding of basic horse behaviour here, people! Anyone who had ever hacked out a flighty animal will know their tendencies to do this. A horse can walk past something - a wall, a manhole cover, a tree - nine times out of ten then in the tenth day will suddenly shy at it despite there being nothing apparently different.

Synchronised was led back to the start calmly and checked over by the vet while McCoy was checked by the doctor. Both were pronounced fit to start. He did not dig his toes in at the start or refuse to start. When he fell, he got up and galloped on. Sadly, he fell again and injured himself irreparably while running loose a few fences later. He wasn't being whipped, or carrying X stone of jockey at the time of his second fall. What happened was tragic - and unusual, in that it's rare for a loose horse to fall and sustain an injury. But there was no "spooky foresight" on his part when McCoy fell off on the way to the start. He was just being a horse, spooking at things like horses are prone to do.

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:27

read all about the slaughtered thousands right here

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:29

That article is totally unhelpful - it does not provide figures on how many ex-racehorses are sent for meat

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:29

that undercover investigation was done for the Guardian btw....that is exactly what my colleague did with his horse so please dont insult my intelligence by telling me it doesnt happen or isnt common.

it clearly is very common.

ThatVikRinA22 · 15/04/2012 09:30

the figures are in the article! if you dont believe it then just do a quick google search.

it happens.

its a disgusting industry all around.

Sparklingbrook · 15/04/2012 09:31

Yes, Fire that is all true. You can't pin human thoughts on an animal, of course he wouldn't have known. It's just in retrospect it's very sad that the runaway horse ended up dying.

Flightty · 15/04/2012 09:33

I didn't say it was spooky, that was a few other people. I was questioning what Marne had said earlier. How are people who don't know anything about horses supposed to differentiate between a horse unseating his rider and buggering off and a horse shying at something and the rider not holding on tight enough to not fall off?

I'm not stating an awful lot as fact here and I don't believe I'm being hypocritical. I've stated my feelings on AnimalAid and I feel that you're setting me up as someone trying to pretend I know stuff I don't, so you can mock and discredit me. I've never pretended to know anything about horses. And what's more I totally disagree with a lot of thngs said on here by those against the GN.

catgirl1976 · 15/04/2012 09:33

The figures are not in the article.

I am happy to take the guesses and anecdotes they rely on though. 100 a year from racing? OK fine. Take that as a % and what do you think it is. Less than 1%? So its not an issue is it.

What would you like them to do with the 100ish animals a year that need to be humanely destroyed due to illness, old age or injury?