If you can't afford children you shouldn't have them.

[MrsArchieTheInventor]

"If you can't afford children you shouldn't have them" [and] "child benefit and tax credits should be abolished" with the mantra that if she choses to be childless she should not be forced to pay for the 'breeding' choices of others.

A Facebook friend of mine. I didn't retaliate.

The thing is rhino if someone is as bad a parent as you have suggested in some of your posts then one child is too much for them. You must also remember you are seeing people at their worst. When they are stressed and worried about a sick child, perhaps standards will slip in other areas if they are looking after the sick child and suffering more sleepless nights than usual.

By it's very nature your job will never allow you to see people at their best, it can give you a jaded view of society. There are many more good people out there than there are bad.

It is probably why I am so useless at finding a job rhino. I am a feckless parent after all.

PMSL at 'patients' being an insulting term!! Hilarious. In Hec's profession, many of the people she sees would be patients. WTF is so wrong with being called a "patient"?

Ah yes hecubas, I am seeing people at their worst, at last we agree on something! And why are they at their worse? Because they have too many children to cope with! Bingo, as I said these service users require a disproportionate amount of fromtline social' education and health services.

I have mentioned before, I deal with all social backgrounds, a quite rightly a sick child is a sick child deserving of treatment whatever background, but I can't say it doesn't gall me when I have spent weeks working with a family who can't cope, are not working, are overcrowded and then expect me to congratulate me when they proudly announce another baby is on the way!

Ah ok thimbunny. If you were being seen for social reasons, such a child protection, and you saw yourself as healthy, you would be happy to be called a "patient" would you.

When I am at work I am seeing people because they are unwell. They come to me because they feel unwell therefore I doubt very much they view themselves as healthy at that particular moment. If they are healthy they are coming to me on behalf of someone who is ill in order to get help and or advice.

But hec doesn't see them for that reason, as she has explained. So there was no need to insult her, was there?

And I have never suggested one child is too much, I object to parents who are already struggling making a conscious decision to have more children, particularly when they can't look after the ones they have. Can you tell me exactly why you think that is uncalled for?

I don't see people because of child protection reasons. I may become aware of a child protection issue during a consultation necessitating me making a report but people are not referred to me for Child protection reason. In fact I am the one who does the referral to whomever is best placed to help them.

Custardo explained it nice and simply.

But hec you have already said you were unemployed, so what patients are you referring to? I work on the commu ity, but even when I was on the ward two years ago we didn't say patients.

You are misunderstanding people's objections rhino. People are objecting to the thinly veiled insinuations that everyone who finds themselves requiring benefits is feckless, that all those who are low paid are irresponsible. I could go on but I can't be bothered since you don't seem to want to consider our views.

Unfortunately thumb I need to be insulted as I am one of those feckless parents that rhino hates so much. Or at least so I am told. Cos I am scum innit.

Actually rhino I said I need to find a new or second job and that my DH had been made redundant and was therefore unemployed. However you were so intent on following your path of hatred towards benefits scum like me you didn't read my post fully.

HTH.

My God, talk about being unwilling to be in the wrong!! Hec is not unemployed, she is on mat leave.
The people she sees as a HCP are in fact often patients, not "service users", not "clients". She is not in a social services role, she is a healthcare professional in a healthcare role.

Ok hecubas, so do you think it is ok for people on non working benefits to have more than two more children after they found themselves on benefits? This gives leeway for two "accidents".

Yes or no?

And hecubas. Do you think the average "patient" is responsible for their own birth control? Or is the state?

I am a healthcare professional in a healthcare role. That is why I am surprised at terminology used.

People are responsible for their birth control. However postings on this thread have made disgusting generalisations which are quite frankly disgust me. The children didn't ask to be born for a start. A family with DC on benefits were not necessarily on benefits when the DC were born. etc.

As to your other question, personally I much prefer to be called a patient as IMO service user is much more patronising.

Ok hebuscab

I am not against benefits. I was on them myself for five years.
I do not see benefit claimants as "scum"
I do agree in a universal healthcare service available to those who need it.
I do get frustrated by people on benefits who continue to reproduce without financial or housing means to keep that child.
I do advocate personal responsibility.
I do advocate birth control if culturally acceptable.

Wht of the above do you disagree with.

And I would hate to be called a patient, unless I was ill as patient indicates illness, and people access healthcare for many more reasons than illness. In fact, most trust protocols are against the word "patient", perhaps yours is catching up.

I will call them what ever my boss tells me to call them, I follow whatever rules are in place at the time. You must know that not every healthcare role is the same.

You have called your service users 'feckless', you have called some of them bad parents yet I am the bad one?

You know what I don't give a flying fuck what you think of me you can consider me to be the dog shit you just trod in for all I care. I know I treat every single person that comes to me for help with kindness and compassion. I know my technical knowledge is good. I know I have helped people. I know I have saved lives. I know that I have sometimes failed to save lives but I also know that has never been due to lack of ability or lack of trying. I know I am good at my job.

I also know I love my children, I know I do everything I can for them. I know people like you think that isn't good enough. Go ahead report me to social services, MNHQ can have my address. I have taken it many times before and if I have to take it again for the sake of my girls I'll take it again. I'll take it however many times I need to. Too damn right I will.

'And I would hate to be called a patient, unless I was ill'

Which part of ALL of my patients are ill did you miss.

'I do not see benefit claimants as "scum"'

Well that is certainly not the impression you have given me.

I dont believe I have mentioned feckless or bad pare ts, read back if you don't believe the hundreds of posts, this word were mentioned by you no your cronies trying to twist my words, not me.

I am sure you don't need social services, i am sure you ar a great mum.

This thread is about why have children if you can't afford them, I took it as those parents who continually have children whilst having no means to support them.

Again you personalise, whereas you haven't answered any of my above questions:
Please tell me what you disagree with what I said above.

Which part of ALL of my patients are ill did you miss.

Where exactly do you work? And as what.? I don't think you said.

*'I do not see benefit claimants as "scum"'

Well that is certainly not the impression you have given me.*

Really? Considering i have been on benefits myself, That is very subjective and also untrue, can you tell me where I said benefits claimants were scum?

I don't disagree with how you have worded it above. However I have issue with people not acknowledging that many of the families struggling on benefits COULD AFFORD them at time of conception. On many post on this thread there is no distinction made.

By the time dd2 was born we couldn't really even afford 1 child. So I did give birth to a child I could not afford, so yes I take insults personally. When she was conceived we could afford 2, we even thought perhaps we would have a 3rd at some time in the future. We are doing what we can to ensure we never conceive again. I have an implant and DH is waiting for the snip. I have POAS every month thanks to still erratic periods and a feeling of panic in case of contraceptive failure but it's not enough for some. One of DH's colleagues, when he was leaving on his last day asked why I didn't have an abortion now, as it may be a good idea. It is lucky that I still haven't seen him as I am still so angry I would probably say something I would regret. So when I read threads like this yes I do get very angry.