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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to be sick of the way some women talk about diets..?

172 replies

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 19:39

as part of my job (CM) I take children to playgroups, have been doing this for years. Every woman I meet seems to be on a diet and they all talk about "being good" and "being naughty", how many syns/sins are in everything and what they've eaten in the last 24 hours. Is this normal? I am no stranger to trying to lose weight but I don't want to talk about it all the time when I'm on a diet.

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BenderBendingRodriguez · 23/03/2012 22:09

A friend once scathingly used the phrase 'giggle biscuits' in reference to how production of delicious snacks in her workplace causes most of the women there to simper like idiots about how naughty they are before demolishing half the packet.

NowThenWreck · 23/03/2012 22:15

I hate it too.
My mum does this. "Oh I shouldn't" if she sees cake, but then will demolish an entire packet of biscuits in one sitting.
I also hate the salad eaters in a restaurant.
I also hate when you go on a date and the man comments on how you eat an actual meal and have dessert, because normally women order a slad and then pretend not to have dessert, while actually eating his.
Yes, I eat food! Still a size 12...

NowThenWreck · 23/03/2012 22:15

Giggle biscuits makes me think of disco biscuits!

eurochick · 23/03/2012 22:16

I love the expression "giggle biscuits". I always think of it when someone brings sweet stuff into the office and the seccies cluster around them saying "oooo, I shouldn't, maybe just a little one" and the like.

TheBigJessie · 23/03/2012 22:20

I feel thankful to be on MN. At last, some kindred spirits!

I once walked out of M&S in a very bad mood, muttering about "the inanity of ascribing moral value to tastes", because there was a pre-packed "naughty nectarine salad" in the fruit aisle.

LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:21

"Fat is a Feminist Issue" literally saved my life back in 1980.

But I still apologise to my fellow students (young enough to be my own children) for eating a Danish before we go into a 9.00am seminar.

lou2321 · 23/03/2012 22:22

Feedzombie - thanks, yes I am planning on being careful afterwards, I am training for a 10km run but just need to shift this extra weight quickly to give me a kick start, I am hoping I don't put it on again, not sure why I have struggled to shift it this time really! Must be because I have started back at work and there are always biscuits and cakes!

Maybe I will start a cabbage soup thread next week!

LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:22

I mean a Danish pastry, natch.

LackaDAISYcal · 23/03/2012 22:22

Gosh it must be quite lofty up on your high horses. What fun to laugh at the fat people Hmm OP you are not being unreasonable in your hatred of all things commercial diet club, however you are beubg unreasonable to poke fun.

People have complex relationships with food, often through no fault of their own and some of them will be reading this thread and feeling more of a need to comfort eat. Have none of you wondered that the "Oh, naughty me" comments are the result of a desperate internal conversation where the temptation of the food always wins?
Or have none of you one grain of empathy for what is a lifelong struggle for many people.

I don't often get aerated on here, but the attitudes on this thread make me Angry

And fwiw, I can stand to lose a bit of weight, but am lazy and greedy, obviously.

LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:35

Shouldn't we be getting ANGRY about this?

I FEEL angry. All those wasted wasted years of crap self-esteem and self-loathing.

And now I'm 51 and menopausal, and never ever really enjoyed the years of being beautiful and healthy and full of energy.

This sounds terrible, but in some ways I'm glad I don't have a daughter. I'd hate her to go through the awful crap young women are exposed to nowadays. It's even worse than in my day - at least back in 1979 we had a very clear-cut and identifiable set of enemies issues to address.

Actually, I really relish being a gorgeous funky fat youngish-looking 21st Century 51 year old undergraduate. But still..........

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 22:37

Oh, I have plenty of empathy towards people struggling with weight. I'm much larger than 90% of the women I'm talking about, honestly. I over eat and I've been criticized and judged for daring to enjoy food when I should be refusing the giggle biscuits. What infuriates me is the way the women encourage this good and naughty approach to food, and the effect this will have on our kids, and how some women feel they have to join in to be accepted.

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Auntiestablishment · 23/03/2012 22:41

IvantaOuiOui - I agree entirely and please can I join your women's group?
I may bring cake but will eat it with great pleasure :)

And I love the name.

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 22:41

LapsedPacifist- I am angry. I have a daughter and I don't want her to be part of this. You sound great, btw :)

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LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:41

LackaDAISYcal - I can stand to lose a bit of weight, but am lazy and greedy, obviously

This makes me SO sad - and so cross!

The reason I waste so much of my life time on MN is because of the all wonderful, funny inteligent and wise women I get to talk with. And yet so many of us feel like this. It's crazy, isn't it?

We hold up half the world, but feel we have to occupy a fraction of the space.

Mrsjay · 23/03/2012 22:42

I had a bit of a discussion at work the other day with 2 women they had special lunch boxes im not sure if it was 1 of those diets you get sent to the door or not , anyway the cook had done a lovely lunch and 1 woman said ooo no i cant eat that it has carbs in it , I said why deprive yourself if you want some , oh no its naughty and off she went to tuck into her budgie seed the other lady was salivating and looked miserable eating her lunch box , and i ate the lunch with carbs , i had bread AND potatoes , how naughty

FrozenNorthPole · 23/03/2012 22:42

I think this fits in with the phenomenon of 'fat talk'

If you're not familiar with it, basically it is the convention of reciprocally making negative or critical comments about one's own body (and diet) when in conversation with other females.

Research indicates that women mirror each other's body / diet talk conventions i.e. if someone is talking about how they dislike their stomach, the other woman is likely to join in too. If someone is positive about their body, this can be mirrored too.

Interestingly, women who are negative about their bodies are rated as more likeable and approachable by other women than those that express body confidence.

Anyhow, the reason it interests me is that the subject of my PhD thesis was the development of dietary conventions, eating attitudes and body image in children, in relation to their BMI.

Talking about food and weight with children, I heard time and again from girls of 7 and 8 about good days, naughty days, sins, Slimfast, sins, points, treats, binges, and the fear/obsession of seeing what the scales show ... it's amazing how much they pick up. It has certainly made me particularly conscious of the way I talk about these things with my daughters.

Interestingly, the girls who - at 7 or 8 - were more concerned about their body and their eating patterns, and who expressed more of a desire to diet, actually gained more weight relative to their height over the next two years than the girls that didn't have these concerns.

In other words, girls who thought more about dieting and wanted to diet gained more weight over the next two years than those who had no such thoughts.

Now, this might be more understandable if the girls with these concerns were overweight, or even comparatively overweight i.e. the urge to diet might be felt more keenly by those with a higher BMI. But girls with high expressed dietary restraint were no more overweight than those without it.

Sadly, dietary restraint i.e. the urge and intention to eat less, eat differently, hold back, take control etc. is also a predictor of weight gain in adults. In some ways this makes Slimming World, Weight Watchers etc. and similar particularly impressive because, of the people that actually stick with their plans, they do actually seem to work. On the other hand, most women / men don't follow these programs although a high proportion of both genders are, at any one time, actively dieting or planning to diet.

Do I have a point? Two, I think. Firstly, losing weight is HARD. One of the hardest things a human being can make themselves do in a country where food is plentiful and safe, and where almost everything in the built and social environment conspires to make us want to burn fewer calories and eat more of them. Anybody who thinks overweight people should be mocked or simply 'eat less' has never thought seriously about how difficult even small behavioural changes are for everyone, and how much stigma they are contributing to by buying into the stereotype. Secondly, we need to try to achieve positive relationships with food and our bodies somehow, for the sake of ourselves and our children.

Right, I expect no-one's going to read that because it's a novel Blush It's just something that really fascinates me ...

HexagonalQueenOfTheSummer · 23/03/2012 22:43

One of my good friends is obsessed with dieting. Totally and utterly obsessed. And about exercise too. Constantly updating her FB status about losing a pound or two. Does my head in.

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 22:44

AuntieEstablishment- you're on the list. Cake and toilet rolls all round.

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LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:45

Ah, shucks Ivantaouioui! Blush

I have a DS. He is being well trained I hope.

He is a sweetie. And 15 year old boys are getting hung up about fake-bakeand zits etc too Sad

Auntiestablishment · 23/03/2012 22:46
FrozenNorthPole · 23/03/2012 22:47

PS - I should add, none of these children were actually on Slimfast or similar, but they had mums / females relatives who were or who talked about dieting in a specific way e.g. 2 points for a yoghurt etc. Just to be clear Blush

LapsedPacifist · 23/03/2012 22:47

the convention of reciprocally making negative or critical comments about one's own body (and diet) when in conversation with other females

< Falls down and worships FrozenNorthPole>

Yess! Not just me being a mad cow then! Grin

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 22:52

FrozenNorthPole, that is fascinating. What an interesting thesis. Awful that girls of 7 and 8 are feeling that way.

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LackaDAISYcal · 23/03/2012 22:53

I was being sarcastic lapsedpacifist.

I personally don't have a bad relationship with food, but I do have health issues which mean I can't exercise as much as I'd like and take steroids which contribute ro my general overweightiness. And I'm sure people see me driving my kids to school and think "fat, lazy cow, she only lives 10 mins away." Let them think it.

I suppose I was trying to illustrate that unless you know everyone's back story, it's not really on to judge.

IvantaOuiOui · 23/03/2012 23:04

I could never say to someone "I feel fat today" because I AM fat. I look after an 11yr old girl who is slightly bigger than her friends, a lovely girl, but quite self conscious. She does a lot of sport and dancing and eats healthily. At school they recently measured the weight and height of the older kids and sent letters with the measurements. Her mum told her that she is overweight, according to the letter. The child has started refusing breakfast at my house.

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