to think this is OTT and then some?

[Helenagrace]

I was tempted to namechange for this as I'm sure someone will scream troll. I am a regular non-namechanged poster and this is, sadly, very real.

My DS is a Beaver. In a couple of months time there is an overnight camp followed by a fun day. The children will stay overnight in the camp and then parents are invited to join in the activities from 10am.

I have just been told that unless I am CRB checked I cannot go to the fun day. I am not helping in any way. I am not looking after anyone else's child. I am responsible for my child alone. I am just going to enjoy the activities.

I have questioned this and the reply is that it is Scout policy that ALL adults on ANY campsite MUST be CRB cleared. No CRB form and you're not allowed on site. I pointed out that this goes way beyond any sensible guidance on how the CRB system should be operated. The Beavers' leaders have said that I must be CRB checked "because otherwise I might go into the toilets and there might be another child in there and I might get accused of something". I've pointed out that I could have all the shiny CRB clearances in the land and still be accused of something.

Apparently a local Cubs group runs a family camp and has CRB checked 300 parents this year alone. None of them are helpers, they are just attending with their own families.

I am planning to take this up with Scouts national HQ. I am not being unreasonable am I?

Maryz - it's the same here. I have 2 CRB checks for the same school, one as a parent helper and one as a supply teacher. I then have a third for the charity I'm a board member of and am about to get a fourth for another local group. It's mad!

Mary's, no you can't have one check that covers everything unfortunately. I'm like you, I have five CRBs for various things, it's ridiculous.

As a teacher I am CRB checked. The last time it was done was 5+ years ago when I changed jobs, so effectively the thing is meaningless as an assessment of my suitability to work with children right now. YANBU, complain.

No you can't have a personal CRB check, at one point I had 4 different CRB forms, one for work, one for army cadets, one for the archery club and one for the local rugby club, My son attended the clubs I sometimes stayed to help out so I was checked- I did stay with other peoples kids though- but 4 separate forms!! OP yrnbu It's also unnecessary- there is something called list 99 that schools and other organisations can check, but bearing in mind you are only going to support your own child and will not be left with other peoples children it's pointless. It's like saying parent have to be CRB checked to attend school sports day or an assembly or school production.

I work in a voluntary capacity for the scouts, I have no contact whatsoever for children and yet I had to be CRB checked.

I was CRB checked to become a parent governor at DS junior school. I have volunteered to be a parent helper for reading at DD infants school next door, but I will need another CRB check for that. My original CRB check doesn't carry over. So I can wander around a school full of 7-11 yr olds, but I can't help a 6 yr old read next door!

Absolutely ridiculous and costly. I think they cost £60 per person and you have to do something to do with children at least once every 3 months otherwise they aren't valid any more.

I helped do the footsteps course at school as a volunteer a couple of years a go and my crb check finally came through in the summer hols after I had already done the course and had been in contact with many children. Was told that if I didn't go into school at least once in the 3 months after it had been awarded then it would have to be re done which is an expense the school has to pay. Crazy in my opinion.

What would they have done if I hadn't been cleared by the crb check ???

Welcome to the wonderful world of CRB madness, been there. Most people have no idea how crazy it gets.

Next unpleasant surprise: insurance for events with kids.....

I hold a disclosure which covers me on supply on every school in our LA. But I couldn't do the library without a volunteer disclosure. Our scouts do Disclose all parents for the parent rota but usually there is just a case of parents not being left alone.

YABU. It is well established policy of the Scout Association, and you shouldn't be charged for it.

I really don't like the idea of a personal CRB check. Reason being, my landlord could ask to see mine and I don't think he should be able to ask. He couldn't send away for one. Annoying but it is a human rights issue. I presume that is the reason for the individual CRBs for individual roles.

If its well established Scout Association policy it isn't being applied in my area. I have been a parent at more than one group and the issue of CRBs for parents has never been mentioned.

It is a bit of a mine field because by definition if the parents were guilty of certain crimes, they probably wouldn't have residency of their children.

However that then means that organisations could only specify birth parents, allowing fun days.

Allegations, suspicions etc is contained under "other information" on a CRB check.

Working in CP and knowing how things are you would be surprised how many abusive people (not just males and not only sexual) target families and do their best to join in these events.

The Scouts have not long ago had toleaders convicted (seperately) of offences,sothey are just being very carefull and trying to remove risk.

Happens at our Scouts. They just get everyone to apply when they join, quite simple. They pay.

allowed at fun days

I am a Cub Scout Leader.

All of our parents attending family camp are required to have a CRB check. I dont think we enforce it for 'fundays' though
They are all funded by the Scout Association.
The official line is-

"wish to become a Member or Associate Member; or
may have unsupervised access to young people; or
will have involvement with the handling or management of funds; or
will be assisting with overnight activities (including Nights Away); or
will be helping out once a month or more."

As a general rule, we dont want parents to attend events with their child, unless they are volunteering as a 'leader'.
Parents usually create more hassle at these things than it is worth.
They may have told you that so you dont want to go.
We have done.

Sorry, official line FOR THOSE NEEDING A CRB CHECK.

I remember my father, a headmaster, having no fewer than seven separate CRB checks done on him for various volunatary roles with kids and vulnerable adults!! The one for school could not count for church, the one for church could not count for school, etc

No wonder these organsiations like scouts can't get the voluntary help they need to survive.

Helena I presume you are in England. I work with the Scottish system and under that it would be illegal to request any crb check for you to carry out tht activity, beyond the possibility of a basic disclosure which isn't really very valuable anyway.

It's an over reaction by a long shot, and as others have said, for people intent on causing harm, a crb check is only a check on how good they are at getting away with it.

As a Cub leader (and ex-Beaver leader), I would want you to be CRB checked for a Fun Day - and stuff what the rules from HQ are - they are as clear as mud, TBH.

If you help at a weekly meeting you are going to be in the same room as me (and the other leaders), or in the company of a group of children if on a hike or somesuch, so not 1-2-1.

At a Fun Day or other event in a larger space there would be plenty of opportunities for an unsavoury character (not implying that you are one, OP!) to have 1-2-1 access to a child without a Leader knowing about it.

I hate the paperwork involved, the system is rubbish and CRBs should be portable, but if it prevents one person gaining inappropriate access to one of my Cubs it is worth it.

If you refuse to complete the form and your Scout District is one that insists on a CRB check for whatever reason, please don't forget that you are making a volunteer's life a whole load more difficult? It takes 10 minutes once in 5 years to fill out a CRB and I give maybe 6 hours a week, every week, to Cubs ...

Thanks for all your replies.

I am going to call Scouts HQ tomorrow to see what they say.

If I was helping with an activity I wouldn't have any problem with it at all. In this case I'm going with my own child. I might as well get CRB cleared to take my children swimming or to the park.

I also think there's a wider issue of privacy here. My own CRB check is squeaky clean but what if I had a minor drug offence years ago or a caution for being drunk. Why should I have to disclose those to do a normal family activity?

There's also the time issue. It's not 10 minutes to fill the form in, it's at least an hour to fill in 4 pages, find 6 items of ID and proof of address then ages while you wait for someone to check it and copy your ID. Actually I really object to people having copies of my birth, marriage and change of name certificates. They are my personal documents. Oh and it's every year locally.

YANBU. They will be asking for that next at PTAs then!!
Sounds like a money sharing plan got CRB and scouts. It's not cheap and it has an expiry.

Query it to the highest level.
Good luck And let us know Whet happens!

The whole world has gone mad BUT I am not that surprised tbh as I had to have one just to sit on a parent committee for something (no need to even see the children), I have offered to have one for Beavers and school so I can help with things....