To think the government can't force women to declare what their dp earns?

[ThreeLittlePandas]

I'm a SAHM and claim child benefit for my 3 children. What my dh earns is his business and the government can go whistle for it if they think that I'm going to declare his earning.

I claim CB not dh

In fact they can fuck the fuck off....

I don't think whether he's their father is relevant TBH. A stay at home single mother who moves in with a new partner loses her benefits even though they're not his children.

I went to a talk by someone high up at the CAB once who said something interesting relating to this - that research showed, on balance, it was better to give blanket benefits (like CB for all) rather than making them means-tested. The cost of enforcing the means-testing cancelled out any savings made in not giving blanket benefits, and the means-testing had the added problem that some people who should get them ended up without, simply because they couldn't negotiate the system. The much trumpeted problem of benefits cheats was nothing up to the problem of people who were entitled to benefits going without. He knew what he was talking about, I reckon.

You're right Lydia - that's what happened with our tax credits. We were on the borderline and would qualify one year, but not the next then back again because of fluctuating earnings. And because of the way it was done on previous year's earnings the assessments were never right, leaving us owing money on occasion. We gave up.

I don't agree with the way in which this is being done, e.g. that a family jointly earning almost £120k will still be entitled to some CB whereas a family where one person earns £60k receive nothing. But I am a bit at the suggestion from some that CB is somehow an income - it isn't - it is a benefit given for the good of children, not for the benefit of women to be able to have their own independent money.

all other benefits are calculated based on household income, you wouldn't think you were entitled to claim income support for instance and not have to tell the government how much your partner earns, so I don't really see how this is different.

Yep people, that's the situation I'm in now. Will lose all benefits, CTC and now CB as I'm moving in with DP although the DCs are not his (get no maintenance though as exP died). As his salary is high, it's not too much of a problem, but I think it will make an impact on many LPs as any new partner will be expected to fully support any children from a previous relationship.

It is completely irrelevant whether the DH is the biological father and whose "business" it is. To claim any other sort of benefit necessitates full disclosure of all financial affairs including savings and contents of bank accounts. It isn't nice and yes, it is very intrusive. I had to do it myself for a year and fuck me, it was an eye-opener.

Welcome to the real world.

HMRC will be writing to all taxpayers with incomes over £50k in the Autumn. If either member of the "partnership" (H&W, civil partners or similar living together) is claiming CB and one or the other has an income over £50k there will be a charge (payable under self-assessment) of 1% of the CB for every £100 their income exceeds £50k. If your income exceeds £60k the charge will be = to the CB. It doesn't matter whose child it is. Those well over the limits will presumably stop claiming. To fail to self-assess the charge would be tax evasion. This does allow for incomes might go up and down. You claim, then effectively pay back some after the year end if your income is too high.

My DH salary will vary depending on overtime - His basic salary is under 50k but has in past gone over .

If he is initally taxed too much , will he / I get a rebate ? Will that be paid directly to me , as I claim CB ? or him as its his tax code ?

As I am about to have a baby I have had a look at the CB application form online ( I am boycotting Bounty packs). There is a section where you have to give details of your partner including his NI number.

The whole new system sounds like an administrative nightmare. I doubt much money will be saved. It would be better to scrap CB entirely and use the savings to protect tax credits for lower earners rather than reducing what you can earn before your tax credits stop.

I am particularly worried about the pensions aspect though. At the moment I will still get the CB anyway now that they have decided to put up the threshold a bit. If we are lucky in a few years time that will no longer be the case. So women who can't receive CB due to their partners earnings will therefore be entirely dependent on their partner in old age?

As all of us who work have tax codes or tax returns registered to our home address it won' t take much programming of the computer to catch anyone who tries to evade this. As the vast majority of people who earn over £50,000 have to do a tax return I wouldn't be surprised if a question will appear on next years return.

Very good question katandkit.

Kat, how does the CB change affect their pension? They won't be getting CB in old age anyway

people: CB is not just cash. It is also an NI credit, and your NI record makes a bi difference to long-term benefits. People should not receive a lower pension just because they were cohabiting with an HRT and acquired a gap in their record. Getting HRP was a major step forward in improving the income/well-being of women in their old age, a should not be relinquished lightly.

That this Govt as remained silent on this vital aspect tells us a great deal about their attitudes. As does the fact that this breaches the (also hard-won) principle of independence in finical and tax affairs.

Do you not claim tax credits then?

Duh, of course, I should know that having checked my own position when I was SAHM for a while. It doesn't make you completely dependent on OH though, as you still have to make up some credits in your non child rearing years, unless iirc you are SAHM for 23 years?

I thought it was the role of being SAHP that gave you the credit, rather than the CB?

While you are claiming child benefit, the government is also paying something towards your NI stamp even though you are not working. So you are entitled to some state pension in old age.
If you can't claim CB, will they still make this contribution on behalf of stay at home parents? If not, then what you can claim in old age will be significantly reduced, especially if you have more than a year or two out of the workforce.

So a woman lives with a rich bloke and has kids with him. She can't get any CB. She doesn't get the NI stamp as a result, she doesn't have her own career either. 20 years later he leaves her. She is much worse off in her retirement as a result. Yes, you do make up credits in your non child rearing years, but a woman who has two children might reasonably take a total of 5 years out of the workforce and she will then be a good bit worse off further down the line. Obviously women have the choice to go back to work sooner if they want to. But it is a shame if they take this away from women who would like to spend a few years at home with their children and not be worse off for it in old age.

people: the credit is part of CB, and runs all the time you have a primary aged child. If you are not working, it fills what would otherwise be a gap in your record.

Nothing has been announced on this aspect.

Which suggests that maintaining one of the single most important protections against poverty for women in old age is unimportant to the Chancellor.

YABU, why should the poor be the only ones to have to declare everything.

Hecubasdaughter - do you want fish to go with that chip on your shoulder ?

As I understand it, the parent who receives the CB will still receive it and the HRT will have their tax code adjusted so that they bring home less money.
This will have the net effect of the household income being lower.

If the parent still receives the CB they will maintain their NI history through the Home Responsibilities Protection policy.

HTH

You don't have to tell them, but if you don't fill in the forms you won't get it. Or you could lie, which would make you a benefit cheat. Its based on income so while they can't force you to actually declare it, they can infact do something about it. It won't affect NI contributions.

I don't find that funny barry. Claiming any benefit is a humiliating process, it's a fact of life. Punishment for not earning enough, crap but true.

YABU by your reckoning Id be entitled to full TC and CTC then as its none of their business what my dp earns and it is me that claims TC & CTC (mines went from about £160 a week to £10 when DP moved in).

They can't force you to tell them. They can not give you any benefit though. Hope they do that.