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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to have told my mother to get a grip...!

31 replies

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 18:51

Ok firstly apologies bc this is a long old story! And secondly yes I realise it's mother's day and I hate the fact this happened today, but I felt like this had to be said and it just happened to come up today.
Background on this is that my mum has been married twice, my dad died and then she divorced my stepdad about 10 yrs ago. Mum is engaged again but no plans to marry. Since my dad's death, mum has received a v generous annuity and worked part-time as well, she was able to move to a bigger house with only a 20k mortgage after his death. However, she has taken on an increasingly luxurious lifestyle, i.e. 2 or 3 cruises per year, she owns 2 luxury cars, goes out for lots of meals, buys clothes every day etc. At first we didn't begrudge her this as she'd been thru a hard time but after a while we found out she'd re-mortgaged so may times that there's no equity left in the house, all her credit cards are over the limit and she is in arrears with mortgage and hp agreements. She won't answer her phone unless she knows who it is and is getting very stressed. However, she doesn't know we know this. When we spoke to her about it she was more worried about how we knew rather than the problem itself.
In the meantime, the house is getting more and more untidy, things are not being replaced when they are broken, the shower doesn't work, there are holes in the floorboards and the boiler keeps breaking down. The biggest problem, however, is the garage. It is a double garage, filled to shoulder height with everything that has broken or been grown out of over the years. There's an old kitchen, a fridge, a huge photocopier, 2 TVs, a computer, a sofa plus other various bits of furniture. It is infested with mice and is also blocked from the outside as one of her posh cars is broken and cannot be moved off the drive!
My brother and I have offered to help clear out lots of times and have told her to sort out a date, hire a skip and we'll chuck it all out. She hasn't taken us up on the offer but a fortnight ago, our nanny died and she needs to store nanny's stuff in the garage. So...she sent us a text saying she'd booked a skip for today, would we come and help? My brother and I both said yes and we also all met on Wednesday to discuss the final details, i.e. size of skip and what to do with the fridge. Last night I texted her to ask what time to come and she told me that she'd not booked a skip as she didn't know we were definitely coming (!) but would we come anyway to sort stuff out-this is impossible as the garage is totally blocked. My brother and I did go and start sorting but it was totally pointless, however the reason we got angry was that absolutely none of this was her fault.
I know that this is a really petty thing to get angry about but our point was that she'd asked us to come and we did, yet it seems that she's not pulled her finger out and sorted her end of the deal-it's the principle more than anything. Anyway, we spent 3 hours "discussing" it this morning, she did not say sorry once and spent the whole time blaming everyone but herself. I told her that I think she needs to get professional help as she seems so overwhelmed by the problems around her and is just lashing out because she couldn't bring herself to start sorting things out. She fully admits that the stuff in the garage is junk and she wants it gone but can't seem to get organised enough to pick up a phone and get my brother, me and a skip at the same place at the same time.
Again, apologies for a super-long post on a v trivial matter but...am I right to think that she's got some issues? Or am I just being overly harsh and shouldn't be angry for her lashing out at us?
Please help! Thank you!

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spg1983 · 18/03/2012 18:54

Sorry...reason I got angry was because SHE BELIEVED that none of this was her fault. Missed out an important bit there!

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JustHecate · 18/03/2012 18:55

Yes. She sounds like she's got some problems.

Why not arrange a date with your brother and book a skip yourselves?

What matters is not that she organises it, but that it gets done.

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 18:59

Well that's what we have done, we are sorting it next Saturday...while she's at her weekly hair appointment...you couldn't make this up! The big thing that worries us is that she shows off a lot in terms of bragging about her big house and car etc...but no-one knows the car's broken and the house is falling to bits! She went mental when her next-door neighbour (who is lovely) came over to talk while the garage door was open. That was our fault too of course :(

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G1nger · 18/03/2012 19:03

Why apportion blame? The important thing is to help her to find a way forward.

LindyHemming · 18/03/2012 19:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MsF1t · 18/03/2012 19:05

This is far from a trivial matter. Actually, it sounds like she may have some underlying mental health issues- constantly buying and hoarding stuff, being overwhelmed and in debt..?

Not that you have no right to be angry- this sounds stressful all round!

I'm also with you in that one of the MOST annoying traits in a person is lack of personal accountability... I (personally) can handle all sorts of mistakes/negatives from folk- we're all human. But what I can't deal with at all is when nothing is that person's fault. It gives you nothing to work with when you're trying to help/negotiate a problem.

You may need to calmly (as possible) offer her help, laying before her the issues as you see them and then leave the ball in her court. If she doesn't meet you even part way, then I'm afraid you might need to leave her to it.

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 19:08

Well I did think that but with regard to finance etc she had a "last chance saloon" 2 years ago with refinancing and was told she needed to keep on the right track as her credit rating would not allow her to refinance again. And the house is just going further and further downhill. I agree that blame is not going to change things but I guess I'm using it as a synonym for responsibility. She will not take any responsibility for any of the issues around her, and that's all part of why we got so angry today. Does that make sense? :/

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spg1983 · 18/03/2012 19:16

Thanks for the replies. In response to the questions, my brother and I tried to help her a year ago but she would not open up to us-she literally spent the whole night asking us why we thought she had money issues and seemed gutted about the fact someone had that impression of her more than anything else. She then said that she was 10k over her limit on some credit cards but did not see that as a problem. My grandparents have also tried talking to her and genuinely believe that she's expecting to use her inheritance from them to sort things (she's an only child so would be sole benefactor). They were gutted about this as they thought she'd use their money to even herself out and then get into the mess again without learning anything from it.
With regard to the fiancé, he was out today. He's a nice chap but has been bankrupt twice himself and loves the lavish lifestyle my mum provided him with. He got really angry with us when we told mum to tighten her belt and stop paying for his share of everything (cruises, meals etc). He encourages her I think. Forgot to say before, she also spends her evenings doing typing to earn extra money which means she's always knackered...but rather than using it to pay off debts, it goes towards holidays!

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ImperialBlether · 18/03/2012 19:19

Can she actually afford a skip? If she's paying for everything on her credit card and the skip companies need cash, she might not be able to give it to them.

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 19:30

We did wonder which was why we offered to pay between us At the time she suggested it but she then said that my sister's boyfriend's family owns a skip company and had offered her a good deal which she was going to go with. We asked her if she wanted us to pay and she said no. That is a good point though, she always withdraws her wages from her account the minute they go in as otherwise they get taken away to cover late/missed payment charges and fees.
I am just so down about this, I'm actually having nightmares about bailiffs etc coming and being nasty to her. But I can't help her to sort things if she won't let me in and accept the help. I don't know if it's because we've offered to help with these issues and not to take them on ourselves, but I do think she needs to help herself otherwise she wouldn't learn from it. Plus I can't afford to take on any more of her debt...had to leave uni at 19 which I was financing myself as she couldn't afford to send me, but also took on some of her debt, which I've only just managed to get rid of...I'm 28 now!

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spg1983 · 18/03/2012 19:42

Also a bit worried now about how to get in touch with her about next week's arrangements...she was so wound up today-help!!

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spg1983 · 18/03/2012 20:23

Please?! :/

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Bossybritches22 · 18/03/2012 20:37

If she won't discuss this how do you know all the financial details?

Just curious?

It does sound like she has problems. So glad you're getting the skip sorted.

A lot of it might be junk but could you siphon off anything saleable & have a car-boot/ Ebay session. Then keep the proceeds to pay for repairs around the house?

How old is she? Things do get away from you as you get older and if the BF is enjoying living off her then maybe she's scared if she cuts the jollies she'll lose him & be lonely.

wimblehorse · 18/03/2012 20:54

This isn't addressing your current issue, but your grandparents could make a will leaving their assets to you, your brother and sister if they are concerned your mother will squander it.
Agree with other posters re you need to sort out skip/offer other practical help where you can if it's clear she is not capable.
Also agree sounds like she needs some help for depression and finances, but she needs to agree she needs it first.

Tranquilidade · 18/03/2012 20:59

I would seriously ask your grandparents to leave their money in a trust with you and DB as trustees so she can benefit from it reasonably but can't fritter it all away

MsF1t · 18/03/2012 21:19

On the face of it, it does sound as though her fiance is compounding matters. Bossybritches may have it spot on- would he disappear if the 'lifestyle' did?

Your Mum is clearly also quite defensive: she wants and needs to put on a show. Maybe she hasn't even admitted the extent of her problems to herself. It must be awful to feel so helpless when you want to help- and I really do sympathise with that.

But stop.

You say you had to abandon your degree. You had to, on top of that (unless I am reading your post wrongly), take on debt she had run up? It is YOU I feel sorriest for, and your brother if he has made similar sacrifices. Every time you make these sacrifices, and that you run to her aid, has it helped?

I don't know the ins and outs. There may be nuances I am missing. But I would suggest that the rest of you- your brother, you and your grandparents - have a family conference and and try to work out
a) What you think or KNOW is really going on (what proof have you?)
b) What the roots of it are- is it your father's death, for example, or has she always had these tendencies...
c) What can you actually do? Is it time for an 'intervention' - style approach? What do you do if she rejects your approaches and advice?
d) What are you prepared to accept? Can you bear just leaving her to her fate, if it comes down to it... or how much of a sacrifice are you prepared to make, emotionally and financially.

Best of luck.

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 22:36

Ok, had a break but back now! We know about finances for several reasons, firstly answerphone messages when she gets back to house from various debt collectors, credit refused for purchases plus my little sister still lives at home and has the same initial as her and accidentally opened a bit of her post one day as their names look the same when in miss/ms format.
Yes I had to take on her debts and yes my grandparents have changed the will to make sure the money can't be frittered away...they haven't said how but I assume it's the same as has been mentioned here. Plus as nanny died recently, grandad's been spoiling himself and spending lots of his well-earned money, so hopefully there won't be as much at the end.
I do think that she worries that the fiancé would leave if the lifestyle had to be curtailed...I don't know if I think that would happen...maybe?
Just spoke to her and she has got the fiancé to sort the garage on a day that she knows we can't make. I did finish the conversation by suggesting she sees a counsellor as the fact that she can't seem to organise things plus the reaction to today's situation was crazy, she's hung up on me. Even told her about all the people I know who have been to counsellors, including me, but she just won't take it :(

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spg1983 · 18/03/2012 22:39

Bossybritches-we did suggest eBay/taking clothes to centres where they give you cash per kilo but her response was "I'm too busy for that". She is 48 but to be fair she looks and seems a lot younger. She is very proud of how she looks which I think all adds to this "image" issue which is wrecking her life :(

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MrsBonkers · 18/03/2012 22:51

So difficult for you, as you can see the problems but she can't, (or won't.)
There are many practical things that can be done to help her, but like you say, she won't accept your help. Maybe she would if she thought it was her idea.
Metal has a good price these days, maybe you could get a dealer to come and collect for free, or freecycle things just to get rid of them. She might feel better about getting rid of things if she thought they were being put to good use rather than just chucking it away.
My mum is a bit of a hoarder, but she'll happily part with things if someone mentions they need something. Might help her feel good about herself so she doesn't feel the need to splash money around. Also, when you go on freecycle and realise how much little things mean to people I think you get a new appricetiation for spending.

olgaga · 18/03/2012 22:52

She's 48? By the sound of it I thought she must be elderly. How old is your little sister?

I'm not sure there's going to be much you can do really, if she is so defensive about everything and rejects all your offers of help.

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 22:57

My sister is 17. I'm 28, my brother is 25. My sister is a lot younger as she's from my mum's second marriage. I'd almost prefer it if mum were elderly but I just worry that she's making herself so miserable with such a lot of her life still to live.
MrsBonkers, we did try that, but her answers were "I don't have time and anyway I don't want anyone else to have my stuff", even though she fully admits she doesn't want it herself!

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MrsBonkers · 18/03/2012 22:59

Oh dear Hmm

Does you sister have any ideas?

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 23:02

Thinking about it, my grandparents were quite well off, as was my dad and she was in a very comfortable position financially after his death. Could it be that she's never had to go without and somehow feels that she's entitled to a lavish lifestyle, even though she hasn't got the finances to back it up? She's probably never had the feeling of not being able to afford things and maybe thinks that it doesn't apply to her...hence the lack of understanding of the dire state of affairs?

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lydiamama · 18/03/2012 23:05

She is not acting very maturely is she? I think you are right to suggest her to seek some help, and check what it is going on with her. Your sound like lovely children, good luck

spg1983 · 18/03/2012 23:06

Yes but she is turning into a nightmare. Turned 16 last year and immediately bought a moped which broke down on the way home and hasn't been fixed since. Then bought a £1200 dog and moaned that she didn't have money for driving lessons. Her dad offered to pay for them monthly as a 17th birthday present but she refused because she wanted an intensive course and then yelled at him as he refused to buy her a car immediately. She knows that mum has money problems but ends up adding to her problems as she's always borrowing money from mum who's too weak to say no. Dread to think what will happen when she turns 18 and offers of credit start landing on the doormat...

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